Oxbridge Entrance

[coodles]

I wonder if anyone has any information or hints on applying - the school has given some advice, but I would appreciate any information.

My DS wants to apply to do History, he has 11 A* grades and other good reports. I've heard the chances of getting in are probably low, especially in this climate.

The suggestion to apply has come from his school and he is keen himself, doing extra work.

My DS is at Oxford doing History and Economics and loving it. His (Grammar) school didn't suggest Oxbridge for him (and neither did we or DS) until he got his A Level results, when the school sent us a letter suggesting he think about applying. He had a gap year where he got work experience with a big consultant and worked teaching in Africa. He had also travelled a lot with us and on eg World Challenge trips at school. Actually, he wanted to go to Bristol but didn't get offered a place (even after Oxford had offered him one). From what I can deduce he got in to Oxford because he was passionate about his subjects (and how they relate to each other), is good at writing essays quickly and he had a merry line of banter linking history and economics to his travels. I don't think he had ever been in a museum of his own free will then (has now!). Wonder if because he was really wanting to go to Bristol he was relaxed at the interview and that helped? Also his school arranged a really good practise day (with the local independent school) where teachers they didn't know put them through the interview process and gave them feedback. I was really impressed to see this sort of co-operation between state and private sector!

Hi,

First of all he must understand why he wants to go to OXford. This is really key, as this will motivate him. It has to be his passion, his dream.

Then, he has to be creative, he has to perhaps do his own history newspaper for the local village, do coursework that will inspire anyone who is reading it. He is welcome to collect info from the collages he is applying to as part of his coursework. This will get him some exposure, something to write about in his application form. Make a video, edit it, youtube it. Resources and opportunities today are infinite compared to the times when I filled in my ucas forms, no internet, by hand :).

If he wants to get into Oxford, he will get there. You motivate him, and do not let someone tell you that with 11 A* grades he has slim chances, because this someone must be a glass ceiling restricted non-believer. If someone told this to my son when he grows up, I would be very upset. You should be too. Take responsibility yourself for guidance, originality of ideas and hard work. Bad advice is worst than no advise, so follow your own views - but be humble when needed.

He can do it if he wants to - though if you all left it too late, then nobody and no hard work will help him to achieve his dream.

Good luck and well done on the 11 A*. Wonderful result.

my tuppence worth with some experience of Oxford is definitely to give it a go but to be canny about the colleges.

The advice about open days etc. is very sound.

There will be less fierce competition at some of the less popular colleges than at the big, more prestigious ones. It might improve his chances, a bit. And that might just be enough ...

He will need to persuade tutor's that they will want to teach him for three years. I can see why spade's son got in. That's just the kind of person I'd love to teach.

Good luck.

Yes, tactical application re colleges etc I am sure helps.
I agree about practice interviews (I've done them in my subject at some schools to help pupils)
Also his only downside so far is he is quiet and shy and may not confident. That could mean it might be hard for him to shine in an interview even about a subject he loves. There are loads of clever children as dull as ditch water verbally and in interviews so he might want to practice how he comes over, film himself etc

I read History at Oxford (rather a lot of years ago) and my nephew is currently doing the same).

I think your DS should do his research on courses and on colleges and should go for it. don't be negative for him.

The main thing to understand which is as true today as it ever was, is that Oxford is not looking for tick box candidates and if your son is already reading round the subject, he's on the right lines. Oxford want to know if students can THINK, logically and intelligently and have a real interest in their subject. The interviews can be challenging, but the tutors are not there to make fools of people; even if they ask off the wall questions, there is usually no right answer, just a test of thinking power.

I went to St Anne's College and loved every minute. It is an ex women's college (30 yrs ago) and takes a higher proportion of state pupils than many others. It is very unstuffy and normal, with none of the inherited "poshness" of some of the older colleges.It has an excellent library and 3yrs accommodation for all undergrads.

Go for it I say.

Just to say also that I was a state school person at a (small) Cambridge college with a heavy reputation as a heartland for the posh. Who cares? It was great. I'd say, what are the areas and particularly the types of history that he loves - does he love social/economic history data like food prices, population statistics and what they mean? does he like pictures, jewels, the Count of Monte Cristo ? does he like military history? the history of science? What are his favourite books in that area?

Find out where those authors teach and head in that direction - He may or may not get teaching from that person of course, but it makes sense to go where your particular strand of history is strong and respected.

I was state school applicant at a college with a strong reputation for poshness. In my experience, tutors are looking for people who are genuinely interested and passionate about their subject. They are keen to take on students who have an independent approach. When I applied, I'm sure one of the reasons for my success was that I'd read around my subject and had come across a new and trendy research area. It wasn't a topic that was anywhere remotely near the school curriculum but because I had found it on my own and was able to discuss it with enthusiasm, I'm sure I stood out.

In some ways, private school applicants are at a disadvantge, because they have often been so well taught and prepared that it's harder for them to demonstrate what they would actually achieve on their own with less support and resources. That's not in any way to denigrate their achievements or their potential; but it's less easy to tell how much is down to excellent teaching and how much is genuine flair.

Totally agree with you wilferbell. That's what I think got me in too.

Interview interview interview. My son got in with 6A*s 3As and 2Bs at GCSE, 2As and 2Bs at AS (though he has to get 3As at A2 so the pressure is on). They look at how their results compare with others in the same school so it's not about best grades. He had to sit an internal exam (the Elat) and got in the top band, and then had two interviews. They were not remotely interested in extra-curricular activities or how many books he'd read - it was nearly all about giving him unseen texts and questioning him closely - they wanted to see if he could think on the spot with no preparation. He'd read over 100 books in prep for the interview and they mentioned two! He loved it though - loved the challenge and the stimulation and very nearly didn't apply because of his grades. If your child is interested, go for it. The tutors there know what they're looking for and it's not about squeezing out top GCSE grades - they want to dig into your mind and they want to see real passion for the subject. Good luck!!!

My sister is at cambridge doing english now. SO many people apply and all have straight A's - I always think things that your son mighthave done extra curricular style might help. I forget what my sister said happened at her interviews but I think she had a couple of tests and an interview over a couple of days - her friend who also had great grades didn't even get to the interview stage though as we're not sure why .

She was also careful to choose to apply to the college she liked the look of for her best, not the one with the best facilities or with the stats for lowest number of applicants per place (apparently this then causes an influx in applicants to that college the following year as everyone thinks they have a better chance of getting in through that college).

Someone has to get in - so why not your son

oh yes, agree with squeeze in that they want you to think for yourself - I was once told by someone who did interviews for a cambridge course (not sure which one) that in his interviews he would always ask students 'there's a box on my desk. what do you think is in it?' (there wasn't a box on the desk btw. Apparently he was looking for people to ask him questions about the box to deduce what could be in it e.g. does it have air holes in it? What material is the box made of? etc etc - looking for people to think for themselves independantly. My sister, however, got nothing like that! I think she got asked questions about books and reading and authors etc.

I would absolutely advise not stressing too much about it- Oxbridge often has such an immense elitist aura about it that, as others have commented, many people self-select and remove themselves from the running because they decide they won't be good enough and that can put kids off and make them panicky and stressed out.

I think v important when talking to DC to just treat it like any other uni application - they will all be v competitive, especially other v prestigious ones like Durham, so why not just go for it as one of several applications and treat it as such.

Having been to Cam myself I would definitely recommend visiting- and if you can, try to get shown round a college by a student not an official guide or professor because you'll get much more of a feel for the place and he'll be able to see whether he thinks he would fit in there. My advice would be to go for the college he'd be happiest at - central is often a big factor, as well as how good sports facilities/accomodation are etc. People put so much emphasis on going for less popular colleges or further out ones for a greater chance of getting in but if he's going to go for it he may as well go for what he really feels would be best for him - no use going for a rubbish college and feeling unhappy if he actually does get in! Anyway so many people thinking like that may even lead to far more applications than you might expect for those 'unpopular' colleges anyway...!

I studied Ancient & Modern History at Oxford, and would say that generally the joint courses eg History and something else are a tiny bit easier to get in on, just because there are only 1 or 2 students/year per college and so they are viewed a little bit more as individuals - make sure you pick a college with a tradition of taking students in that joint subject, though!

I don't recall the interview being particularly 'tricky' - being able to speak with confidence beyond the limitations of the syllabus is useful. But there is no need to be overawed.

Your son needs to sit the entrance exam,I believe - presumably his school will tutor him. You can help by talking about bigger questions, getting him to read newspapers etc.

Second (third? fourth?) the advice to visit colleges and find ones where he likes the tutors and where their research interests ideally match his own interests - at the end of the day, decisions are made on the basis of personal likes and dislikes - tutors choose candidates they feel they would like to spend time with for the next 3 years, so one where he bonds with the tutor on an individual level, or at least where s/he seems pleasant and encouraging (and not all are!) is a good start.

Be aware, if your ds is interested in 'older' history, that the Oxford course artificially starts in 285AD, or did when I was there, which always seemed odd to me,and was why I chose the joint course I did - Cambridge's course has no such limitations, as far as I am aware.

Be aware that Oxbridge history is simply far more work and far less guided than other unis - I found it hard emotionally as well as intellectually, and arguably would have had a better time elsewhere - not sure I would recommend it unequivocally.

I would definitely NOT recommend Durham - it's notorious for being the home of Oxford rejects,as the first anecdotes on this thread suggest - if your ds fancies endless conversations along the lines of 'so what college did you fail to get into, then?', then he'd be right at home. MY DH went to Durham and hated it as it was indeed stuffed to the gills with public school Oxbridge rejects (he was a state school non-Oxbridge candidate).

Good luck to your ds.

My daughter's a couple of years away from Uni but has her heart set in Cambridge. One of the posts stated that they self select. Out of interest, how do they do that? Do you mean they select from those that have made applications or is there something else that I'm missing. Just cirious. (btw just joined mumsnet - 1st post - nice site)

I think the self-select comment meant that candidates select themselves by not bothering to apply in thefirst place.

Welcome.