Deluded ferry building company

[SnoozingFox]

Seiously, pull the plug on Ferguson Marine and put us all out of our misery. This is the shower who were what - 6 years late delivering the Glen Sannox, which has now been sent for repairs because it's leaking.

And yesterday, they were sad-facing all over the news because CalMac has placed their next order for 7 ferries with a yard in Poland. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cqjd8xx8wvlo Why do you think that is, numpties?

How much is it costing to keep this lot employed?

Oh you want a DRS? Discuss with UK government AT THE OUTSET, not at the last minute.

It was the UK government who insisted the scheme absolutely must include glass. So the Scottish Government set about getting a scheme that included glass up and running, only for the UK government to turn around at the 11th hour, having been insistent upon the inclusion of glass for years, to then completely u-turn and demand it could not include glass because they had changed their minds, totally coincidentally of course after heavy lobbying by their benefactors at Diageo and suchlike.

The DRS scheme was scuppered by Westminster's own intransigence and corruption, nothing to do with Lorna Slater or anyone else in Holyrood. See the Welsh scheme, which has had the common sense to ignore Westminster and go their own way regardless, having witnessed what attempting a "joined up" approach got Scotland.

There was nothing to stop Scotland going ahead without glass. Apart from, of course, a judicial review which found the whole payment scheme it was based on by the Scottish Government to be illegal - and that had to do with Westminster.

I am Scottish but live in London, so never get to vote in elections. I do, however, have very strong views about the ferry debacle because I frequently have to use the ferry route in question. Let's not forget that when the Glen Sannox finally came into service it turned out that she can't dock at Ardrossan and has to go to Troon. It takes longer to make that return trip so there are fewer trips per day. The Alfred, hired at enormous expense from Orkney ferries, can't dock at Ardrossan either and also has to go to Troon.

The only ferry that can dock at Ardrossan is the Caledonian Isles, which went away for routine maintenance in January 2024 (yes, 14 months ago) and hasn't yet returned. She might be back at the end of April. I'm not holding my breath on that one. She is over 30 years old and will soon have to be retired, so the vast sums spent on the current maintenance are a dubious investment, but the Scottish government has not prioritised getting new vessels for Calmac, so there's probably no alternative.

Why can't the other ferries dock at Ardrossan? The novel fuel supply the Glen Sannox uses (which the even more delayed Glen Rosa will also use) can't currently be stored at Ardrossan. The Alfred can't dock there because only one of the two berths was suitable for a catamaran, and that berth has been condemned as unsafe because it's not been kept in good repair, so no ferry can dock there.

Who owns the port at Ardrossan? Peel Ports, a private company, which doesn't seem to have any interest in this tiny part of its massive portfolion. Ardrossan Harbour was privatised under Mrs Thatcher and the Scottish government has made no effort to nationalise it (as they did for Ferguson Marine) or to force Peel Ports to invest in the Harbour. Perhaps Peel Ports didn't make donations to the SNP, as I believe the owner of Ferguson Marine did before getting the contract to build the Glen Rosa and the Glen Sannox.

Troon is a nightmare for foot passengers transferring to the train. I don't see how anybody with mobility issues manages it at all.

I feel so sorry for the businesses in Ardrossan who are really struggling now, and for many businesses and residents on Arran who rely on visitors, workers and tradespeople travelling from the mainland. This was all foreseeable and preventable.

I blame the Scottish government for all of this. They have been elected over and over again by single issue obsessives driven by hatred of the English. The fact that they haven't a clue how to do the basic work of government appears not to matter. I'd like to think they'll be wiped out at the next election, but their diehard supporters won't care about their record.

The payment scheme had nothing to do with Westminster .

I'd like to think they'll be wiped out at the next election, but their diehard supporters won't care about their record.

On of the (many) things I will struggle forgive Labour for is making such a mess of things that Scottish Labour will likely be hammered in the next Scottish election allowing the SNP to get away with their incompetence

That likely will happen.

I’m not a huge fan of any of the parties at the moment, they all seem to have a few well-reasoned people who are surrounded by point-scoring careerists more interested in their Twitter profiles than making a difference.

Labour have scored an absolute own goal though, they didn’t realise that they didn’t win the last vote, the SNP lost it.

They had the chance to build their reputation and make some competent decisions, but instead just meekly fell in line with what London told them to do, reinforcing their ‘branch office’ image.

This, alongside with the Tory lurch to the right, Reform splitting the Tory vote, the Green collapse and a weak Lib-Dem party, will result in an SNP Landslide again.

Probably not on the scale of a decade ago, but enough to give a majority.

The SNP won’t get a majority but they may well end up the biggest party again. 😫

We were horrified at the stories we were told when travelling around the islands last year as to the very basic errors made which had catastrophic effects on the cost and delay of her coming in to use. It is appalling that such a part of Scottish infrastructure should be so poorly managed, mind you sign of the times - wasting money at a time when projects need to come in on budget at the time promised. It seems the more we need money to be used effectively it is squandered.

Hum......

This raises all sorts of issues about the competence of the UK political and managerial class

Firstly ships last about 25 years or so so it would be possible to set up a replacement plan for the Scottish Maritime Assets (SMA) fleet - Caledonian MacBrayne & Northlink possibly throw in the Shetland ones as well from now until the end of the world but for whatever reason it hasnt been done resulting in an elderly & unreliable Cal Mac fleet.

The next issue is that the Glen Sannox was designed to run on Liquefied Natural Gas which is a new technology - and potentially a dead end for carbon reduction. It seems that SMA or the safety authorities were constantly changing the specification for the ship.

I suggest that there are many issues about what happened but dont just point the finger at Fergusons.

Finally, we are an island, if we cant or dont build, crew and own ships we are reliant on the goodwill of others. Is that wise?

It’s not wise, and it’s actually scary that some people seem to be revelling in the fact that we are having our ships built in Poland.

It’s pretty much impossible to actually have an autopsy on what the issues were because so many are desperate to blame everything on the Scottish Government.

In reality we need to look at every aspect of the supply chain, the designs, the contracts, the operations, the changing economic factors etc..

This constant political tribalism is stopping us not only solving problems, but even identifying what the issues are in the first place.

I will never understand the thought process behind anyone who when they hear news like this don’t think of the workers first but are actually happy it gives them ammunition to score points, it doesn’t sit right with me at all.

We should be doing what we can to secure industry and a future for our country.

As a (slightly) related point, for anyone with children under 25, these generations are going to be substantially poorer with much less opportunities than ours. Much of this will happen as technology progresses which will reduce opportunities in fields like accountancy/law/engineering, so if we have a chance to secure skilled industry and boost employment in the country then morally we should take it.

In reality we need to look at every aspect of the supply chain, the designs, the contracts, the operations, the changing economic factors etc..

This is all part and parcel of building ships everywhere. Other places manage it on time and on budget.

It’s not wise, and it’s actually scary that some people seem to be revelling in the fact that we are having our ships built in Poland.

I’m certainly revelling in the fact that another £400 million won’t be wasted and can be used on roads, nhs, education….

I blame the Scottish government for all of this. They have been elected over and over again by single issue obsessives driven by hatred of the English. The fact that they haven't a clue how to do the basic work of government appears not to matter. I'd like to think they'll be wiped out at the next election, but their diehard supporters won't care about their record.

This perfectly sums up why Scotland is run so terribly badly. They just haven’t a clue what they are doing. Not one braincell in the entire party. It’s so embarrassing.

This is the household income of a person who gets disability payments in Scotland. From an AIBU thread. Her husband works:

Salary (presumably her husband’s)- £2200
UC - £1500
Scottish Child Payment - £425
Child Benefit - £305
ADP - £290
Total: £4720

I am staggered! Just staggered!!! Her husband earns not a lot over the minimum wage but benefits to this up to more like an £85k salary! Take out the disability payment and that’s the equivalent of £80k!!! This is the drain all are taxes are disappearing down. I am horrified! On what planet is that fair or just??? I assumed the Scottish child payment paid for those who were looking at food banks. Obviously not!

While the benefits system does need some reform I really don’t like the culture change in the last few weeks.

The government and media have engineered a campaign against benefit claimants and the population has meekly followed, turning their faux-outrage on claimants now.

Yes there are people who take advantage of the system and there should be more effort to detect them.

But I am fine and happy with genuinely disabled people receiving enough benefits to give them an equivalent standard of living that they would have if they were able to be employed.

Instead of punching down towards people who can’t work we should maybe be asking why wages in the country are so low that even people in work need to be supported by benefits, while the richest in the country have doubled their wealth in the last 5 years.

If we have a system that allows people to work hard and make no progress in life then it really isn’t surprising many will choose not to participate.

@9fthighfence Despite your interpretation of the facts here it is actually the equivalent of both partners being on a salary of £34500, in other words pretty much the average salary in the country.

Now I’m fine with a disabled parent being supported to the average wage level of the country.

I don’t believe that a person who is incapable of working should be made to live in poverty, they should be as valued and as able to live a reasonable lifestyle as anyone else.

They also have a right to financial independence, making disabled women totally financially reliant on their partners puts them at risk of being trapped in abusive situations, which is already a higher risk for them as it is.

How we treat our most vulnerable is a measure of our society, and also ourselves.