Private school bursaries

[bmg1404]

My DS wants to go to a private school for 5th and 6th year -he's very bright and has an autism diagnosis .

I am separated from his dad who pays me maintenance , the responsibility split is 60:40 to me -as was set in the separation document 7 years ago but he is with me 90% of the time and we have never changed it

I am a full time student studying for an engineering degree and I applied for a foundation place for him . I submitted all the documents to the bursar and at a meeting was told I would qualify for a reduction. We had a home visit and I was then told that I would be entitled to no reduction as is dad pays maintenance and it wouldn't be fair if someone from the community saw him attending the school on a bursary knowing that a working parent was still contributing

I was crestfallen - they told me there was no point in him sitting the admissions test -I just couldn't do this to him so I said that I would find ffull fees to send him

Why was this not flagged at the bursars meeting ? His dad contributes maintenance of £400 a month -that's it and has flatly said he won't be paying for school fees

Do I have to remortgage until I'm working in 3 years time

I just don't understand why this was not mentioned 2 months prior to the home visit at tthe bursars meeting

Did you disclose at the meeting that his dad was working and paid maintenance?

FWIW I think paying for private education in your situation is a bad idea. Remortgaging for this is too much. What about all the extra costs attached to private education. Having teenagers is expensive enough. And then university to go which is very expensive if they move away.

Do you have a lot of savings or income other than your student loan? Unless there's something unusual about this school bursaries are usually based solely on income and savings of the household.

I'd be astounded if your household income didn't qualify based on a student loan and £400 a month from his father!

Hi

Thanks so much for replying -I have some savings and I have a bit of inheritance coming but the amount is not significant and of course I will pay what I can . My issue is that it is not made explicit in any of the guidelines that both parents incomes would be assessed which is why I applied because I knew that my ex husband would not be willing to pay a penny .

I understand how people wlll abuse this system and I believe the checks are to mitigate against separated couples basing the costs on the less well offs parent income as well as a lot of other factors but what happens in a situation that is acrimonious like mine -where one parent refuses to pay .

I've opened a can of worms with my son -I sincerely believed that there was a possibility that he could go

Thanks for answering

I do find there’s a lot of smoke and mirrors around private school bursaries. If they state on their website that bursaries are for children who interview well, do well in tests and parents earn under X then you’d know where you stood when you first had the idea.

Thanks yes I can see that private education costs are not the best idea at the moment -this idea was floated post lockdown when my sons school really wasn't in a good place and it wasn't serving him and we had just had his diagnosis - which my ex denies.

He could maybe go for 6th year as a compromise -I'll have some inheritance money. I let out my house for Airbnb so I could save from that

Sorry to answer your question -no I didn't disclose my ex income at any point because I was not asked to -I don't know what his income is and if required it's his information to disclose

However my bank statements fully disclose my income and his maintenance payments -the bursar ran the figures through some software and was able to tell me what level of reduction was possible

I kind of feel lured in , in a way - the bursar was good cop and the home visit woman was bad cop and within 10 minutes of the meeting I was being told no- just tell me at the outset and I could have managed my sons expectations

Sadly I agree

I have heard that there is quite a drive to get kids into fee paying schools atm

I have heard that there is quite a drive to get kids into fee paying schools atm

A drive from who? The schools themselves? They will be concerned about a dip in income when the VAT on fees is introduced, worried that a lot of parents will pull their children out. I do agree though that any organisation offering reduced fees (not just schools) should be clear about the criteria for accessing those reductions, it's simply not fair to say "we offer reductions" and not applying the same rules to everyone.

I would start looking at alternatives - I am assuming your DS is in S4 and coming up for Nat 5s if you're looking to switch for S5 and S6. You don't say where you are in the country but I know that there have been children who joined my kids school in S5, after transferring from another local state school, or leaving the private sector. Often this is because the private schools are smaller and can't offer the range of Highers and Advanced Highers that they can in a larger school with 200 kids in each year group. Getting a state place in S5 or S6 is easier as some kids will have left at the end of S4 for college or an apprenticeship.

It's worth exploring - look at local state provision and ask about support for kids with additional needs, and what range of courses they can offer. If you're sure that a change is needed, this could be a good option. Why is your DS so set on private school as the only option?

Yes that's it , it's hearsay rather than fact but yes the VAT hike will be prohibitive if you have multiple children at one school . I'm in Edinburgh

As you're in Edinburgh would it be worth looking at other schools? They may vary with regard to considering the non resident parent income.
I know 2 single parent families who got substantial bursaries based on the single parent income, but that was 4 or 5 years ago before the VAT squeeze on finances.

Ahhh I had a thought at the back of my head that the VAT hike was maybe part of this . I too have heard stories about reductions being made on the lone parents income which was encouraging me to do this

Weird -hmmmm . The bursar was very emphatic that no special reductions received would ever be disclosed to the child let alone anyone else and that there was a big point made of confidentiality around this matter and as per the ethos of the school full inclusivity would be afforded to every child

Then

There seemed to be a U turn in approach at the home visit -stating that the child's bursary status could impact 'the community' verbatim -"if people saw [my son] receiving a bursary when he was in a shared care situation with 2 parents , it could affect the stakeholders "

I communicated non of this to DS obvs but I wish I had and had dissuaded him from attending the assessment-this is what really changed his mind -he asked lots of questions about subjects he can't do at his current school and was so enthused

I'm talking about GWC -myself and his dad live in the community -he's made lots of friends here and knows people from GWC

Considering another school would be awful given his autism - he wouldn't find that easy at all

I really appreciate everyones' help with this as its been bearing down on me and I have no idea how to tell my son . I believe there has been a sea change based on the VAT increase - I just wish they had been up front about this

I’m sorry your crestfallen. If it’s any consolation many parents have experienced similiar disappointments. My DC got a substantial bursary admittedly quite a long time ago and I used to successfully advise others on how to get one.
1.there are no universal rules schools can do whatever they want. Why they offer X to 1 child and Y to another may make little sense to others.
2 I would be astounded if a school didn’t take both parents income into consideration regardless of any difficulties post divorce. Maintainence is generally not relevant it’s your husbands income they would look at. Most take the view that you are both liable for the fees. The only times I have known school not ask proof of both incomes is where there is DV and no contact at all due to safe guarding.
3 Many schools will encourage parents to apply for a bursary and make positive encouraging remarks but when the numbers are actually crunched offer significantly less than parents hoped for. I think this is partly due to the fact that bursars don’t know each year how many will actually apply to the bursary pot remember this will include current pupils. IME most schools would rather offer small to medium sized bursaries to 30 pupils rather than very big bursaries to 5 pupils and are more likely to prioritise existing pupils.
4 sadly many schools write lots of stuff on their websites about bursaries implying they are dishing them out to every man and his dog but the reality is even the super wealthy big name boysschools (in England) which are usually full boarding with enormous fees extensive assets and wealthy alumni therefore big bursary pots in comparison with most others are not divying our huge bursaries to all applicants.
5 although bursaries are not scholarships schools are more likely to offer bursaries especially substantial ones to very desirable super bright all rounders who they think will make their school look good.
6 savings however small are usually taken into consideration and you say you have inheritance coming this will also be taken into consideration some schools would expect you to contribute all of it others may want as little as 10%.
Persinally I wouldn’t remortgage to pay the fees. If my DC was already there and it was the only way I could keep them there I might but I have extensive experience of both sectors there are god bad and mediocre in both. Just because you pay doesn’t mean it’s the best option for your DC. Don’t cripple yourself to pay.
Do PM me if you want to discuss it further.

@bmg1404 as you say bursaries are confidential this is usually a condition of accepting one. If my memory serves me correctly when signing all the paperwork agreeing not to discuss it with others was written into the agreement. Usually teachers in the school don’t usually know apart from the head and maybe a house master/mistress so I’m surprised at the comment about what the community” think. Of course I’ve no doubt that many parents may have an idea about who receives one but it is strictly confidential.

GWC has had a lot of parents complaining about the school offering bursaries whilst also raising fees (and VAT).

The head of Clifton Hall has mouthed off about it, and said they’ve abolished all bursaries because of VAT.

There is a feeling that the schools were more generous when they were trying to protect their tax advantaged position. Now those have benefits have largely gone, they’re retreating to a more self-interested position.

Thank you so much for responding and for your insight . I agree why would the other parents income not be factored in -it’s only fair to do so and this is the stinger -the vagueness on the website raises expectations.

I'm starting to see the conversations I had with the school through a different lens .

i think the website info is intentionally ambiguous then there’s a tacit selection process that happens .

l told the bursar that I had inheritance money coming and was told that would be looked at at the time . At the home visit when I mentioned that DS had achieved all As in his prelims there was an astounding “wow” remarked

Yeah it’s disappointingly smoke and mirrors all wrapped up in a child centred ethos

thanks again for the insight

My issue is that it is not made explicit in any of the guidelines that both parents incomes would be assessed which is why I applied because I knew that my ex husband would not be willing to pay a penny .

Yes as PPs have said they probably keep this intentionally vague and then assess in a case by case basis, once they've gathered all the information about your family circumstances.

The 2 families I know of who got substantial bursaries (one a colleagues child and the other a family friend) had no way the other parent could pay anything. With one the father had headed back home overseas and had very little contact with the child, and the other the father had serious mental health problems and was never going to be doing any substantial work again. So I guess they were assessed as single parent households once the school had all the facts.

Very interesting -I’m learning so much . Yes that blows the ‘community’ comment away . I wonder if they do background checks before the visits . Thanks for sharing your thoughts -all have been so illuminating and a real dose of realism

Bursaries are always a lottery. The advise I used to give was before you even put a toe over the thread hold of a school especially with your DC is have an honest and frank conversation with the bursar and spell out your situation in black and white
“I really like your school in particular the pastoral care/tennis coaching (Henry’s been playing since he was 2 yrs old and been talent spotted)/the science dept (Tatiana is top in the whole school for chemistry and want to go to Cambridge) or similar but I would need a bursary of 75% to attend, my circumstances are: my 13 bedroomed house is mortgaged to the eyeball due to inheritance tax, my ex husband is a twat and and despite earning 250k a year won’t contribute a bean, etc etc. I’m not asking you to formally commit yourself now but do you offer bursaries of this size and would you consider my circumstances because very obviously I don’t want to waste your time my time and most importantly raise my DCs expectations if this is never going to be a goer.
You also mentioned your DS has autism although obviously very bright this might put some schools off.

Hahaha yes . The autism I guess could go both ways -he could be a quota filler or not . I know think all questions at the home visit were loaded (I could be being over sensitive) . When the woman arrived -one of the first things she said was “normally I see people manically tidying because they think I’m social work” ….bizarre but it definitely catches you on the back foot

these tactics are massively divisive and echelon generating aren’t they .

I’m now thinking negatively of a family I know who got both children into the school 2 years ago because the woman had moved here alone with them . DS was at a club with one kid who told him that his mum and dad lived in 2 separate countries because the dad couldn’t join the family because all his money was in cryptocurrency!!

something that I haven’t mentioned is that on the back of this and after being told that there was no point in having him come to the assessment I told admissions that I wanted him to be assessed and that ‘I would borrow from family’ thus taking away the need to be assessed for a discounted place -so we’ll see if the money talks

Ah interesting

I dont think schools have a “quota filler”.
If you’re an independent school your raison d’etre is to convince prospective parents that if they pay to send their child to your school they will achieve better results and thus go to a better/top uni and get a “better” job than they would if they went to the local academy up the road. This is what the vast majority of parents are paying for; results. Yes it’s nice if your DC can translate a bit of Virgil, be erudite in his discussions on Thomas Hardy and quote a bit of Mallory but this is all window dressing for the majority of parents.
Bursaries are completely discretionary each individual school can do whatever it likes it is their money after all. As I said above there are no common rules, for the majority the only quota they need to meet is to try and offer bursaries to the sort of children who are going to make them look good; high achievers. They want to be able to put on their websites/spout at open that 5/10/20% of our pupils went to the UKs top universities/Ivy League (or whatever) if Henry also happens to be the junior world scrabble champion and in the 1st 15 for rugby that’s even better.
Secondly Im sure if you can borrow the money and pay the fees they’ll happily assess him and if suitable offer him a place ( I know absolutely nothing about the school you’re apply too) but I think the bursar would say if you can borrow the money “from family” then you weren’t suitable for a bursary. Every year when we reapplied one of the questions was “have you approached family to fund the fees”.
Lastly I will just say that many independent schools are often not good at meeting the needs of a child with SEN yes they’ll write all sorts of stuff on their websites but they really are only interested in those with mild dyslexia or the socially awkward. Don’t go in with the idea that because you’re paying it will automatically be better (I’m writing this as someone who has worked extensively in both sectors), and many will charge you for any additional support. Most schools have a box that your child needs to fit into and this particularly applies to independent schools if your DC fits it he will thrive but if for some reason through no fault of his own he doesn’t then he will struggle. Don’t be blinded by swimming pools, manuscripts going back to the 15th century and ridiculous uniforms again this is all window dressing try and find out the what the specific box the school has and ask yourself objectively will my DS fit it? I dont know how selective the school you’re looking at is but independent schools can be quite tough places because they are results driven so a lot of pressure is being applied on the pupils especially in the senior years.
Good luck.

when they were tax exempt part of the conditions of their charitable status was dependent on them serving less affluent communities , which I believe was graded by postcode -however as we know that’s all changed

I agree with the boxing off of children - unfortunately I was one of them . I went to a Scottish independent school from 5-18 in the 70s and 80s -did well but then fell away when I was 16 which marked my entire life-3 years ago I was diagnosed with adhd and it all made sense but back then there was no additional provision made for SEN kids. I would have had the same outcome at public school but the expectations would have been lighter on me

interestingly the ‘elite’ education and I mean elite in terms of different from the norm worked for me- my adhd is of a type where I injest and retain a high volume of information

But to your point yes , I believe admission is very cherry picked

Thanks for your insight