Workload of four versus five highers

[sparkysdream]

I’m in a quandary over what would be the best option for my son for highers. He’s doing really well in Nat 5s and all his 6 subjects would be happy for him to take the higher. His prelims/ results were 4As, 2 Bs (and one B was 69%).

He’d like to continue them all, and likely to pick up the dropped ones in 6th year.

I’m just not sure whether he should go for five, or if he would get higher grades just doing four. I know it’s impossible to predict, just wondering what others in a similar position have done? He wouldn’t be looking to do a Uni course that requires five in one sitting- most likely Geography.

Both my dc's took 5 highers in S5 and a mix of advanced highers and highers in S6

Is there any particular reason why your son only sat 6 Nat 5s?

Has he looked at the entry requirements of any courses that he is interested in?

If he sits 5 higher and gets the required grades, he could go to uni after S5 - is that something he wants to do ? Or he could leave school and take a gap year, get a job, travel etc.

Or he could go back to school for S6 , apply to uni during s6 and probably get an unconditional offer.

If he sits 4 highers in S5, offers might be conditional on his S6 exam results.

If he’s going to study geography at uni, it would probably be more useful for him to do AH geography rather than do a higher in the subject/s that he dropped after S4.

Also some school have subjects that they only offer at Higher
level ( crash higher ) during S6. And there may be vocational courses at college that would interest him , or subjects that he could do at other schools in his consortium that are not offered at his own school .

So there are lots of options in S6.

Thanks, the school only offer 6 Nat 5s in the timetable so no option to do more.

They also most likely won’t offer Advanced higher Geography as there hasn’t been enough interest, which is disappointing. I haven’t heard of being able to do it at another school so will ask about that. It wasn’t mentioned by his pastoral care teacher when I mentioned that he would likely want to do it. We’re rural so that would be an additional challenge.

Many years ago I did 5 highers and loved the unconditional offers in 6th year. My husband went straight to Uni after 5th year (and 4 highers) but thinks that was a mistake, so we wouldn’t encourage that, especially as he’s young for the year. Good to know an unconditional is more likely with 5.

DD is doing 5 Highers this year. Next year she is doing 2 HIghers and an AH (at another school) and a N5. We're very disappointed with the options for S6 and I would have liked her to have had more AH options available.

My DCs school would say start 5 Highers as he's likely to have very good Nat 5s (maybe even all As). He can always drop one or do higher course over 2 years if finding it tough mid way thru next year.

Dont worry about only doing 6 Nat 5s if that's all the school allow. Unis are aware of differences in numbers and some don't even consider Nat 5s.

My middle one has a geography degree. Loved it. Graduated in 2021. I think his Glasgow offer was 4As or 3As2Bs (he went at end of S5 as old in year and few AHs available at his school - couldn't be arsed getting taxis to neighbouring schools). Not sure whether tariff has gone up. But definitely need to hit mainly As and need to avoid Cs at higher fror Glasgow/Edinburgh unless widening access.

Some universities require 5 Highers in one sitting so I would be cautious about taking only 4 if actually capable of 5

My daughter did only 4 subjects at higher and got 3 As and a B. Unconditionals from Dundee, Edinburgh, Stirling and Aberdeen to read Human Geography which is often higher entry requirements than physical. Reject from St As. She was sitting AH geography but plenty of uni year didn’t. My understanding is you’re better getting more As if that’s the balance. Ie 4 As better than 2As 3Bs etc

Thanks, yes, that’s the dilemma, it only seems to be medicine and the like that needs 5 in one sitting but the rest are looking for high grades from four(Glasgow has 4 Bs as minimum from 5th year, but possibly needing 6 As by 6th in arts or social science, less in the Science faculty) so I just wonder if that’s more achievable with four highers.

I remember wanting to drop Chemistry or Maths higher, and decided it would be whichever I got the worse mark in the prelim in. I got exactly the same in both! I talked it over with a teacher who said thinking back to his time at school and feeling he’d overstretched himself, he didn’t think doing fewer would up the grade in the remaining ones. Who knows if that’s right though!

Does he want to do human or physical geography? Human seems more competitive?

Physical seems to be his preferences.

@sparkysdream ah I think I remember, are you the petite lady from near Aberdeen?

Id be amazed if Glasgow are giving out (non contextual) offers at BBBB for geography , I went there 100 years ago and I’m pretty sure my offer was AAABB or AABBB from S5.

If she’s only doing 4 Highers in S5 I bet most good Scottish unis will want something like AAAB minimum. So doing 4 might be less work but it’s more pressure to get the grades. Of course she will have a second chance at S6 but that also puts on the pressure, when lots of her friends will have unconditional offers.

And “ not getting the grades you needed at S5” feels a lot different from “having to do a couple of AH to get into the course “ or “ having to do a couple of crash highers because you didn’t chose the right subjects in s5 “ or “ changed your mind and didn’t have a subject you needed at higher “.

Which is why everyone else who is working hard in S6 will be doing so.

It might be different for your DD loves / excels at 4 subjects in S4 and hates the 5th and 6th subjects . But you said that she likes all 6, so she should be ok to take 5 at Higher. It shows that she can cope with the workload, just like the kids who sat 9 Nat 5s.

Its a shame that there’s no chance for her to do AH Geography but she won’t be penalised for that . Scottish uni admissions officers understand our education system very well. I’m in a city and lots of our S6s have to go to other schools for their AHs.

@N0Tfunny umm maybe, how do you know me? I don’t post much on mumsnet. Message me and put me out of my misery!

every bright kid in our school does 5 highers. 4 highers it totally unheard of. Many that’s a school league table thing though?

Would the school not require him to do 5 subjects anyway? So if he doesn’t do 5 Highers he would have to do something else with a workload but no Higher at the end of it? Agree that it is highly unusual for a bright pupil doing well at N5 to not do 5 Highers.

@sparkysdream have PMed you as requested 🙂

Yes, that’s right, another Nat 5, or something like Games development. I gather the workload of a Nat 5 is way below a higher though. It’s odd the school don’t seem to push five, rather stress there are just a particular few courses where 5 is needed, and to check that out.

I think he’s now realised a fair few friends are doing 5 though so is keener to give it a go. The added complication was his first choice of five didn’t work in the columns, so he would have had to take his 6th choice instead. It seems there may be a work around so waiting to hear about that.

I think if he gets those grades the school will want him to do 5. I think it’s one of the things league tables are done on.

My son did 5 and he did get 5 As but it was a lot of work even after 7 As at Nat 5.

Doing 4 doesn’t seem as common these days. Back in the day I also did 5 and got 5 As but I know a lot of people who did 4 and got better grades than if they’d done 5, but now they have to do a 5th subject anyway, there doesn’t seem tbe option for 4.

your boy is clearly smart so I would start him on 5 and if it seems a stretch after prelims maybe see about dropping one

Incodentally I also went to Uni after s5 and wasn’t keen on the same for my son, am glad he did s6.

Ds3 is in S6 now but they were definitely expected to take 5 Highers in 5th year. With universities encouraging overseas and English student for the higher fees there appears to be greater pressure on places for Scottish students and entry requirements seem higher than ever.

He sounds bright enough to be doing 5. It would potentially limit him in future to only do 4.

The step up from NAT5 to Higher is significant, especially when accustomed to only studying for 6 NAT5s and it is only one subject that will be dropped. But he sounds clever enough for 5, my biggest advice would be start studying very early, little and often, and it really takes the pressure off nearer the time.

Glasgow uni entry requirements generally look at achievement by the end of S5 and potentially conditional offers into S6 if grades not met in S5. They encourage AH level study as preparation for university level study.

If your son only sits 4 Highers he will be competing with applications that have the additional challenge of sitting 5 - I would suggest phoning/emailing his preferred unis and asking if it will impact his application/offer.

My son has 5 As and only got a conditional for Glasgow, course reqs were AAABB after s5 and offers typically made at AAAAAA after s6. He should get his condition easily but he’s probably going to go elsewhere anyway

@TooOldForThisNonsense it will be very course dependent, and perhaps also dependent on the number of applications that year. 2 years ago ds had an unconditional from Glasgow after S5 for an integrated masters, MEng Mech Engineering while his gf who also had 5As in S5, had to get another A (or B at AH) for Law.

ds also went elsewhere, but glad he did his AHs in S6 too (even though he didn't do as well in them!) as they really helped him with the uni first year maths/physics as a lot of the content is similar.

My middle one did 6 Nat 5s and found step up to Higher fine (both done over one year). I think my youngest who did 8 nat 5s over 2 years found the one year for Highers different.

DS sitting four Highers. He started with five but struggled with Higher Maths so dropped it after his Christmas prelim. He has just been assessed by OT and CAMHs so has a lot going on. We don't feel it's necessary to be putting pressure on him. If he does really well in those four he enjoys then that's all that really matters. He wasn't enjoying maths so did the right thing. His future career choice isn't bothered about higher than Nat 5 level pass in Maths anyway.

Good luck with whatever your DD decides. Not an easy decision.

DS planning to do one AH for S6, a day release course at the local tech, and one Nat 5 he has an interest in. Just a bit fun in the final year 😀