So few lifeguards in Scotland

[Endpress]

There are so few lifeguarded beaches in Scotland. Especially on the west coast. There’s none? Such a shame. They can be such good healthy role models for kids and really encourage people to use the water safely.

I am loving seeing people enjoying Scotland waterways just with the help of a wetsuit. It can provide such an adrenaline rush for kids.

That said, was so happy to see one in Loch Lomond the other day. He was on it and it was so reassuring. I believe this is a new thing for this season.

Loch Lomond is very easy to access on public transport from Glasgow. During the hot weather that's where the teenagers go, especially in years when they can't go overseas. My 16 year old was up there with her friends a couple of days, she had the lecture about safety before they went and they all had a great time but they can all swim, weren't drinking and weren't showing off trying to impress each other.

No kids in this area have swimming at primary, @Mrsjayy. Secondary pupils at one school locally do have a pool which they use in PE lessons, but that school is due to be demolished and rebuilt, without a pool.

My youngest is early 20s so I'm well out of touch. I think that's shocking that swimming isn't on the curriculum anymore 😕

Unfortunately in these deep Scottish lochs it's the cold water shock that gets people into trouble and kills them.
Someone can be a strong swimmer and still not survive. That's the bit that needs the education (as well as being able to swim)

Ahem. I’m as west coast as they come. The west coast sausage roll comment was, I felt, a play on well known stereotypes and obvious sarcasm. Apologies to those offended by it 🙄. I’m scunnered (see my Scottish credentials) that Scotland is not safely accessible to the masses. It’s just not. Yeah yeah capable people of any status can access the natural environment for leisure but it’s not as supported as it could be and often the preserve of those with the means to drive there and buy equipment. I’d love to see outward bound much more pushed in the schools- watersports, the hills and we’d transform the health of the nation. I think Lifeguards make a beach safer. I appreciate you can’t police every location.

I'm local to Loch Lomond. Have never seen any lifeguard (unless you count the ones who work at Lomond shores)

There is a big big problem with kids coming down to drink. Kids travelling from Glasgow. That kid who drowned came from Airdrie I think. Was he there to drink with his pals, I wonder?

Drinking means you pay less attention to the dangers.

@BridgetJonesPanties

because most people don't go into the sea or the lochs in Scotland because a, its bloody freezing b, its filthy c, its dangerous

So little need for a lifeguard. They'd be getting paid to do very little.

Its only gotten worse cause of Covid, normally people would go to Spain etc.

This is a stereotype! I live near sever lochs and they are all very clean. Your right about the cold though

I don’t know anything about the poor kid. I do know that type of dangerous activity definitely goes on. I just think lockdown has changed the landscape and we’ve an opportunity to create some jobs, increase safety and improve health. Would love to see kids getting their rush and self pride from say kayaking than a bottle of Buckie.

@TheGenealogist

To be fair, swimming off the Scottish coast is something you can do very rarely. It's not often we get hot enough weather, and most people you see swimming are the hardy open water people who are out there all weathers, never swim alone and absolutely know what they're doing.

We have hundreds of beaches in Scotland compared with other parts of the UK, you just can't compare with places like Devon and Cornwall.

Lifeguards are not the answer - especially at somewhere like Loch Lomond which covers a massive surface area and is accessible at all points. People drown in Loch Lomond (and reservoirs, quarries) because they do not appreciate the danger in going into a large body of very deep, very cold water when they either can't swim at all, or have minimal swimming skills.

And I'm not buying the line that it's up to the teachers (again) to parent kids and make sure that they know that water is dangerous. That's the parents' job. If you haven't had the conversation with your kids about how dangerous it is, especially when drownings over the summer were so widely reported, why not? Maybe we need the "Charlie Says" adverts again to scare the shit out of kids.

💯 this!!! My kids have all passed their water safety tests with the coast guards and surfing/ paddle board club. It was expensive but absolutely essential IMO.

@BridgetJonesPanties

I'm local to Loch Lomond. Have never seen any lifeguard (unless you count the ones who work at Lomond shores)

There is a big big problem with kids coming down to drink. Kids travelling from Glasgow. That kid who drowned came from Airdrie I think. Was he there to drink with his pals, I wonder?

Drinking means you pay less attention to the dangers.

The two days DD went up the transport police were on the trains from Glasgow searching everyone and confiscating drink.

She was there in the morning/early afternoon though, I understand it's a lot worse in the evenings.

Underage drinking, poor swimming skills, teenage showing off and Loch Lomond isn't a great combination.

Learning to swim in a swimming pool is not the same as swimming on lochs / sea. In fact it may well give a false sense of security.

Children (and parents!) need to be aware of basic water safety, which includes being aware of their own ignorance, and being aware that open water has big temperature differentials, can drop off from paddling depth to out of depth instantly, and can have currents.

It is not possible to have lifeguards everywhere - people need to take responsibility for their own and their children's safety.

I'm not victim blaming but I was quite shocked by what one man said - I think he was the brother or uncle of two of the people who drowned up by Ardlui. They went into the water off a pier/jetty. They thought the pier was there to allow people to get into the water easily. They didn't think the water would be cold, or deep. None of them could swim.

Agree that swimming in a swimming pool is very different from swimming in open water or the sea. Not just the temperature either. But if you've had at least a few lessons, or have been taught the "float to live" basics, you at least stand a chance.

However how do you even start to tackle the ignorance of thinking a pier is there to let you get into the water, and that Scottish lochs aren't cold, deep or both? Obviously people some people DO need to be told that, but how do you do it in a way which isn't patronising the rest of us for which it's basic common sense?

Better education on the geography of Scottish lochs may help. Do people paddling in these lochs realise they're basically three quarters of the way up a mountain? The rest is underwater and if paddling they could step off a cliff edge at any more moment and plummet in dark freezing water?

People have definitely died in Loch Lomond this way.

Does the national park have signs up warning of this?

@ItsAllGoingToBeFine

Learning to swim in a swimming pool is not the same as swimming on lochs / sea. In fact it may well give a false sense of security.

Children (and parents!) need to be aware of basic water safety, which includes being aware of their own ignorance, and being aware that open water has big temperature differentials, can drop off from paddling depth to out of depth instantly, and can have currents.

It is not possible to have lifeguards everywhere - people need to take responsibility for their own and their children's safety.

Absolutely, my kids learnt about rip tides and how to get out, assessing waves and the water conditions ( swell if any, temperature, under currents, speed etc). My 6 year old pulled herself out of a rip to paddle back to shore just last week in Croyde

I'm sure there are signs warning about deep water at the Balloch end, but Loch Lomond is about 30 miles from north to south and you'd need a sign every 25 or 50 metres?

It's so easy to see though - steep hills rising each side of the loch, it's obvious that that gradient is going to continue into the loch and although the deepest part is in the middle, it's not going to be uniform. Definitely covered in geography at secondary when they're talking about glaciation and valley formation.

Once your kids can pool swim I would 100% recommend beach and inlad water training

@Endpress

Ahem. I’m as west coast as they come. The west coast sausage roll comment was, I felt, a play on well known stereotypes and obvious sarcasm. Apologies to those offended by it 🙄. I’m scunnered (see my Scottish credentials) that Scotland is not safely accessible to the masses. It’s just not. Yeah yeah capable people of any status can access the natural environment for leisure but it’s not as supported as it could be and often the preserve of those with the means to drive there and buy equipment. I’d love to see outward bound much more pushed in the schools- watersports, the hills and we’d transform the health of the nation. I think Lifeguards make a beach safer. I appreciate you can’t police every location.

If only the Scottish Government (and UK Government) could see the benefit of this it might be better funded in schools. I remember several school trips to outward bound centres in my youth, where we learned about water safety, mountain safety etc. Real skills learned and put into practice in real life are much better than anything shown on a YouTube video.

Also, Scouts, Girls Brigade and Boys Brigade were great for teaching this stuff. I learned skills doing my DofE that I can still use now.

Agree with a PP that there are too many Scottish beaches to patrol, but in high season on the most popular beaches it could be done?

Does the national park have signs up warning of this?

Yes there is signs.

Who funds the lifeguards? Is it RNLI? (So charity) or local councils? We were on the south coast of England this summer and I'm sure the lifeguards were RNLI. And they weren't there the whole time.

But even having the system of flags showing where is safe to swim would be better than nothing.

Our lifeguards are rnli funded. The council, supposedly, also provide funding BUT there's nothing to prove it. They were against lifeguards, so I doubt it.

The 17 year old who died in Loch Lomond last year was a strong swimmer, no buoyancy aid as felt they didn't need one. They disappeared not far from the shore. Found miles away, due to current.

@BridgetJonesPanties

I'm local to Loch Lomond. Have never seen any lifeguard (unless you count the ones who work at Lomond shores)

There is a big big problem with kids coming down to drink. Kids travelling from Glasgow. That kid who drowned came from Airdrie I think. Was he there to drink with his pals, I wonder?

Drinking means you pay less attention to the dangers.

At some point Darwin's Law comes into play though.

People need to take responsibility for themselves and their families.

@TheGenealogist

Who funds the lifeguards? Is it RNLI? (So charity) or local councils? We were on the south coast of England this summer and I'm sure the lifeguards were RNLI. And they weren't there the whole time.

But even having the system of flags showing where is safe to swim would be better than nothing.

It's never "safe" - you can't tell people that via a flag. Life isn't that simple.

And how bad would the young lifeguard kid feel when someone drowned anyway and he or she gets dogs' abuse for not managing to save them? Thankless task in this world.