extreme insecurity leading to ruin part 2!

[fathersday]

reposted original OP with paragrpahs to make easier to read! sorry for initial load of block text!

Objectively speaking my husband is an absolutely wonderful man. He has a lovely caring outlook on life, lives by very firm principles, is professionally very successful and is, not that a matters in the slightest, very good looking.

He was attracted to me and I to him initially as we seemed very similar ? both outgoing, confident, clever, happy. We got married and I was as sure as sure can be that I was making a great decision.

We have now been married 8 years, as time has gone on we have become more and more different. I have remained as I always have been, really happy in anyone?s company, undaunted by almost any social situation, happy to talk to anyone, and not really experiencing shyness that much.

I like going out, but don?t go out that much as I like much more staying at home with my family. I like to be there for my children and they all have busy lives that need a lot of administration ? arranging socialising with other children, making sure they have everything they need for school trips, projects etc, and helping them with their homework and other activities at home. They are undoubtedly my priority.

However every now and again, I do go out, to a party, with friends, whatever. I would dearly love it if my husband came with me and enjoyed himself. Sometimes he does come with me. It is almost always an unmitigated disaster. If too many other people talk to me, he gets upset and wants to leave. He usually ends up leaving early and I always go with him as I feel guilty about him going angrily or upset home on his own. But I also resent this as I feel it is putting an end to one of my few nights out, when there is no real reason for it apart from his - as I see it ? ludicrous insecurity.

It is not so much that he thinks I will cheat on him (I would never ever do this), he says the fact that I am popular and people want to talk to me, more than him, makes him feel bad.

From my point of view, everyone wants to speak to each of us equally, all through the night, we will be in equal demand, not that it is a competition anyway, until he starts his moody withdrawal from everything, often accompanied by calling me ?Miss Popularity? and then, when he gives monosyllabic answers to people or even ignores them completely preferring to whisper in my ear about how we need to go and how popular I am and how he holds me back and so should just leave me there, then perhaps understandably, people tactfully leave him alone. I am at my wits end.

He says he would be happier if he was with someone more mediocre as my success and popularity (obviously these are his words and his perspective, this is not what I am saying about myself!) make him feel rubbish and he feels in my shadow.

I love him very much and when the going is good, it is really very good ? he is a great dad, and is funny and witty and can socialise, but only when there is absolutely no threat that I may speak to someone of around our age, that I am not related to.

We have built a wonderful life together which I know from the outside must look perfect ? our children are all healthy and happy, we have great jobs, enough money and a lovely place to live. I have everything I have always wanted, apart from a husband who has the confidence to enjoy a social life with me.

Hi Fathersday,

I honestly think the only thing that could make me stop being the way I am in social situations is to feel better about myself.
As I explained, I am having body concious issues, and well as feeling fat and wearing ugly maternity clothes I also feel uncomfortable etc. I am longing for my body back...I am also longing for people to speak to me about anything other than being pregnant and to think about other thngs apart from being pregnant
Ultimately I need to LIKE myself again.

I do see how hard it is for DH (although not always at the time) He is great towards me and does start the night sitting next to me, holding my hand, including me etc....but he is easily sidetracked and once a couple of drinks are involved he is still there, but not 'with' me IYSWIM? which if I was myself, I would not have a prolem with at all - as we are not normally that sort of couple..

I can see he is finding it difficult and know that the more I am like it, the more likely he is to not want to spend the evening with me. I end up convincing myself that he would be better off if I just stayed at home, but then get so upset at home on my own, I would much rather be there.

It is very difficult and a real catch 22 situation, I know I am being awful company > makes me upset > Makes me awful company.

Just as a reference, I am usually a happy, confident, popular person who loves nothing more than a good night out with my DH and a bunch of good friends.

As an aside.....I feel less uncomfortable in situations where drink and forced socialising are not the main thing so going out for meals in smaller groups for example.
I Don't know if that could help, at least until your DH gets help with his insecurities, honestly though, if I didn't know this was (hopefully) going to have an end, I would know that I have to go and see someone for some professional help in getting back to the person I once believed I was.
I hope your DH see's this too - as I can assure you, if he is feeling the same stuff as me, he IS NOT being abusive, manipulating or trying to control you at all. In fact none of this is even about you...it's him and he knows it, just can't help himself out of it, he must be feeling very sad (and probably guilty about how it makes you feel)

Maybe he is depressed and would benefit from professional help. However, that's not a Get Out OF Jail Free card: if refusing to pander to him doesn't stop the behaviour, tell him he can seek help or leave. You really, really, mustn't give in to this sort of thing.
Munchkinland - in your case you are aware of the problem, feel bad about its effects on your partner and you are trying to change, so that's different to someone who is basically doing the 'take me as I am' line over behaviour which is distressing a partner.

thankyou so much for the supportive messages. i am really struggling now. really upset. i love him so much, i had such high hopes for a brilliant perfect life with him, and now, i am reflecting on what i thought we would never become: a couple who have had almost 6 years of intermittent joy and sadness and anger and pain. I have rarely in the last 6 years, had a month go by without needing to deal with a husband insecurity induced crisis. that is not normal is it? or is it? how often does everyone have to sort out their DP?

Not sure I can do it to the children - the kicking him out thing, also might just crumble on the floor in devastation if i saw him walk out the door. o god. this is just awful. i know though, i know that when he is ni a low mood, i prefer doing bedtime if he is not there, i prefer it if he is not there generally when he is in this mood - it is horrible for the kids, although i am very professional about it and don't engage with it at all, just focus on playing with them so i don't think they notice what a prick he is being.

o god. never though life would end up being such a nightmare...

Just spoken to CBT therapist. some glimmer of hope. However also spoke to DH who is not completely accepting that none of this is because of me.
how bloody depressing can you get.

Shyness is one thing. Emotional blackmail is another.

There is a condition called social phobia (like agoraphobia, only to do with people). It can be treated with a combination of anti-anxiety drugs and CBT. Your H would need to decide he has a problem and be committed to making the treatment work.

The way he behaves when you're around other people is very passiv-aggressive and is a rather unpleasant form of control. If it's limited purely to social situations - and he doesn't 'punish' you for being sociable - you may as well agree that you'll have a social life and he won't. You'll just have to tell your friends he's a curmudgeonly old git

Watch out for 'punishments' though. Passive-aggressive types can save up their resentments for weeks; you have to be a bit smart to spot what's happening.

hi fathers day.

So sad to see this message, and actually that there seems to be more to it than it seems - general insecurity, that seems to be a little more pervasive than you first said?

I am not surprised at all that he is now projecting the behaviour onto you. I wouldn't be surprised either if he says you are too loud/flirtatious/ boisterous/ etc. I guess it is understandable if you were feelig in a generous mood, that he has started to think about what therapy really entails and has realised that those skeletons in the closet will have something to say, hes probably very scared. I can understand that. But it doesnt mean its OK to blame you.

I have to say it does take a certain bravery to admit you have a problem. Maybe he just doesn't have that bravery.

I am reading Toxic parents at the moment and there is a case in there of a son who basically has to do everything for his mother. He came to therapy as he couldn't hold a adult relationship. Underneath it all, he feels socialising and committing to other women is a betrayal of his dead mother. It might not apply here, but it is something to think about. seemingly "fringe" issues can run really deep.

You werent the one whispering, or name calling. YOu havnet been the one stripping or trying to strip confidence out of the partner if anything it sounds like you've been embarrassed and trying to jolly him along.

Have to agree with the "punishments" aspects too. Grace is very wise ;)

Take care love from 1foot.

Thank you for such helpful messages.
I feel a bit better today. We had a family event on saturday - my niece's birthday - whole family were there, lovely party in the garden, with grandparents, friends etc. DH did really really well all the way through it he was nice and lovely and charming and got on with everyone and was complimentary and loving to me. He was at his best. I am still a bit wary though of talking to others for too long, and I know I tailor my behaviour to avooid his moods. Something happened in a conversation, I am not sure what as I wasn't in it. It seems like it was a bit of banter, that my DH was the butt of -nothing nasty, just completley normal banter between friends. I came along just at the tail end of it and everyone was laughing and DH was looking awkward and then walked away. I followed him. He said he wanted to go home. Party was not in any way over. All the kids were still having a great time, everyone was still there. I said let's compromise, let's go in one hour. He said no, half an hour. I said look I really don't want to go, you can go and I don't mind at all, I want you to do whatever makes you happy, but I don't want to go this early. He left. THen he sent me a text message saying he wants to split up as he is not good enough for me and holding me back. I switched my phone off.
I left the party later, brought the kids home, he'd been home for a couple of hours by then and was in bed. It was about 7pm. HE then said that I'd promised him I'd be right be his side always but that at the first sign of trouble I just told him to leave, this proves I don't want to be with him and just think he is a burden.
We then had a major meltdown. Luckily I had put everyone to bed and read all their stories etc by then so they were all asleep. We werent shouting but it was very upsetting. I felt desperately sad that he wanted to end everything. Hours later he came round and said he loves me and that he wants to work on himself and sort it out so that he can be the DH I deserve. He has promised he will ring therapist (identified by me and mobile number provided to him - waht can go wrong>!) today.

I am going to support him through the therapy, which I am told could take around 3 months to take effect, and then review. If he is still a prick then, we may need to split.

Hi fatherday

I just have to say, that this 3 months thing, It could honestly take a lot longer than this! I am expecting to see my therapist for a lot longer than that! Its taken me 30-odd years to be whom I am today, so it will take more than 12 hours to reverse it, Im sure.

But it may well invite more comfortable ways of being, for example, that he can walk away from these situations in a more productive way. Or to arrive at a function with a ready excuse if having to go somewhere and not staying long.

I think you need to be realistic that the next few months are likely to be exceptionally hard, and that there are thing that are going to come out that will be very hard indeed to hear both for him and for you.

When Ive come back from therapy I feel like Ive been hit by a bus, and it takes a good few hours to even contemplate functioning properly. Ie eating, wiping the snot from my nose, etc.

As you weren't in that conversation, ( for example) you don't know what was said and what the "trigger" was. Indeed, maybe he doesn't even know yet. I would take care to hold off here, and let him work these things out for himself. I would expect also that you will have said things to reassure ( entirely naturally) like "it wasn't that bad" "they didn't mean it" or whatever. What im trying to say ( badly!) is that you dont know how he feels so dont negate what he is saying. I have had this all my life and it is very difficult.

Im not sure what I'm saying here, but I'll say that expecting a quick fix to this is probably setting the bar too high, and disappointment for both of you will follow, undoubtedly. Also if you expect a quick fix and its not forthcoming then there is a potential he will throw the towel in too soon. "its not working".

I suppose what Im trying to say is that if you want to be part of his recovery, then youll have to be a support, unwavering to a degree, gently challenge where necessary, but that the real challenging will come in his sessions.

Expect it to be a hard and long road, if its anything less than this then its a bonus.

Good luck, keep us posted
Love from 1foot. xxxx

fathersday, firstly you have my sympathy. That line "Oh you're so much better than me, I'm so awful" can only be put up with for so long without that person making an effort to change whatever it is they hate about themselves.

My H was depressed and started talking like this. I was sympathetic and caring and told him all the things that were great about him; in return he started making himself feel better by blaming his insecurity and depression on me. It was not a good time.

CBT can be great. It certainly sounds like it could help your DH since the emphasis is not on what you can't change (other people), but what you can change (yourself). So hopefully no matter how much he believes this is down to your behaviour, the CBT therapist will encourage him to look at his own instead.

I hope he sticks with it.

If you do have to wait at all there are some good CBT books out there that he could work through. But that would take some effort on his part.

i know it will be hard. I know. But waht I also know now is how utterly devastated I felt at the thought of our marriage being over - I was literally shaking and crying and felt like I was going to fall over. I cannot imagine life without him. I have built it up with him always in mind, and so I am definitely in it for the long haul, bumps and all. I think if I can deal with the amount of utter crap I have dealt with thus far, I will be able to deal with a bit more, especially as now I know he is acting to try and remedy it - he has rang the therapist and is waiting for a call back. I am looking tentatively to the future. IF he doesn't stick at it though, I know I may have to boot him out - at least to shock him back into trying. Or if not, then to give myself and the children a chance at some consistent happiness.

I have to say your last post seems very healthy to me "bumps and all". He is a lucky guy to have that unwavering support, right now I could do with a dose of it myself!

I just wish you the very best of luck, and sending strength to you as Im sure you need a little extra.

1foot xxxx

thank you so much! Yes, i do think he is lucky to have me. He does too. When he is not being mental, he does say he knows that!
And yes, I do need the support, it is a very difficult thing to be open with friends and family about as to tell everyone about it is to make everyone aware of his difficulty in socialising which could actually make his ridiculous fears a reality!
I am a tough old boot at heart so I think I will be ok.
lots of love and support back to you also xxxx

well....we've had first couple of CBT sessions and all seems to be going along as planned. DH is sticking to it, which is great, after first one he came home sying thought it was pointless waste of money, but then went to second one, and has discussed more the tools CBT can provide to help him be able to see reality, rather than his own insecurities, and so feels more positive. As do I! Just hope he sticks at it. We have a family wedding this weekend. I am slightly dreading it and slightly daring to hope it will be ok and he won't be a prat.

though we did have a festival last weekend and he ended up going to bed early on grounds I was joining in with some of the activities - juggling, dancing around etc- just fun stuff with the kids - that he feels he cannot join in with. so i let him. i heard it about the next day - he said he feels isolated when i join in with things like that as he doesn't know anyone else there except me so can't chat to anyone else there and just get to know them. GOD. I cannot understand the mentality, said I found it really frustrating and that he really needed to try and stop seeing my pleasure as his suffering.