How long would you need to see change before a second chance?

[Peanutbutterlindt]

When we were together my H was unfaithful to me repeatedly, don't actually know how often but for sure more than twenty times.

Verbally and sometimes physically abusive. Generally pretty disrespectful towards me and women in his family generally.

Financially irresponsible, he would pay the rent and buy childrens clothes but I paid for everything else out of Child Benefit and the Incapacity Benefit I was on at the time, he kept the rest of his wages for himself.

Drank excessively most nights.

On the other hand.

He was only 23 when we married and we got married very quickly, within a few months.

Since splitting he is very hands on with child care, sees the dc regularly and pays child support every month.

He says he is different and seems so in himself but I think he is still drinking.

I do still care about him and feel sad at the thought of him meeting someone else and us not being a family anymore but I cannot go back to that life that was ruled by his drinking, entitlement and financial irresponsibility.

I suppose I am asking in your opinions can a man like this change or "grow up" as he says he has.

Would welcome any thoughts no matter how blunt. Sorry so long.

'words are cheap' and 'a leopard never changes his spots' springs to mind. Out of interest, have you ever split up before and he's promise to change?

I actually think that some people do grow up and change, i know someone very well who was a general playa and cheat and he has now found someone he truly loves and would never cheat on her, he still likes his beer but things are not like they were,

On the other hand, i personally would worry about the abusive side of things, growing up and realising you have a responsibility is one thing which i think can happen but im not sure just by growing up the physical abuse would just stop?!?!?! not sure if i have just contradicted myself

x

No, never split before, although I threatened a million times. Now split and heading for divorce so he knows I am serious now.

He has probably got desperate now and is promising the earth. His meal ticket has gone!

I would seriously consider what negative effects your dc could experience seeing you being treated badly by him. I believe our parent's relationships create a Blueprint for children's future relationships

He cheated on you, several times, and was abusive to you. Sorry, personally I wouldn't touch him with a barge pole.

I do too foxy123 that is the main reason I ended it. I couldn't stand the thought of my ds growing up like him (H is just like his dad) or dd growing up to think it was normal to accept that from a man.

I am going through the same thing except this is 3rd time I have kicked him to the curb. He actually got worse each time but now we have a child it was time to put a stop to it. You could try reading 'women who love too much' as this is a very good book to put things in perspective. You may even find this link interesting survivinganarcissist.com/?hop=panet

Sorry peanutbutter, but I don't see from your post how he has actually changed. The examples of "good" behaviour that you have given are that he is spending time with his children and paying child support. Isn't this the bare minimum of parenting?

How has changed towards you? In what way would your relationship with him be any different?

He just got 12 out of 15 on that quiz foxy.

Had to really think about that Rycie I am not sure that he has changed. Deep down I do think that he is putting on a bit of an act at the moment. I am trying to be fair and not present him as super villain here. He does seem to be listening to me more and not using as much emotive and accusatory language towards me as he used to that is why I asked how long would you need to see this change to believe it was genuine? I personally think at least a year.

WOW! Well there you go! From what I've read there isn't much hope for these type of people to change. They are very persistent & clever at getting you back though so be careful...

I think it is easy for him to show you changes as you are not living with it day in day out IYSWIM.
My ex was emotionall abusive, lazy, crap with money etc etc.
He is with someone else now and on the surface he appears like a different man, but when we have talked for any length of time he has mentioned things that show me he is making the same mistakes he has always done and probably always will do.
He hasn't changed it is just easier for me to to see and be shown that side of him now as i'm not with him 24/7 id that makes sense.

The only thing is that he does not seem to fit all the criteria of NPD. He DOES support his kids and sees them as regularly as possible. It is all very confusing.

That is what confuses me he doesn't quite fit the bill anywhere except with me, when we were married I often said to my Mum "he just doesn't seem to like me" and that is how it felt that he just didn't like me or respect me at all.

Maybe the children idolise their dad, so he enjoys the narcissistic supply?

My ex is great with our dd too, I think he thinks of her as an extension of himself (she looks like him and is only 19months so doesn't really talk back like a teenager will)

Yikes! I'd be very very very careful before letting someone like that back into my life for a relationship. In fact, I don't think I ever could. I really don't see how someone can change that sort of behaviour.

Sorry, probably not the answer you want, but my honest opinion.

I really don't think I'd want to share my life with someone who didn't seem to like me!

No he didn't seem to like me for 8 years but is being very nice and supportive now where he never was before. That is what I am finding confusing.

I am grateful for all opinions Patsy. Don't want to make anymore mistakes with dc's and my life.

Yes the not liking me thing, no-one I told ever seemed to get that. "Well what have you done for him not to like you?" being a question I got from BIL. It was just him having no interest in me or my life or ambitions almost as though I was an object just there to take care of the kids, keep things going at home and keep quiet no matter how much crap he dished out to me. It was as though there was this low level dislike simmering near constantly, just for being married to him, that is the best way I can describe it. If I ever tried to assert myself he could become incredibly angry and abusive. He said a few times "I will treat you as an equal because I want to, not because you keep telling me to".

No, no, no, no and no

You say he was "only" 23 when you got together...that isn't that young, IMO so a crap excuse for bad behaviour

The behaviour you describe is inexcusable at any age

I hate this man, and I have never even met him

If you take him back, you will live to regret it

I don't think people do change that much fundamentally. I recently came across an ex who messed me around when we went out together in our 20s. He is now 40 something, married with children. I noticed that he dropped quite a few hints about how he was open to other relationships. It was relatively subtle but immistakeable, especially as I knew him well so I can interpret his behaviour quite accurately.

Perhaps some women would be flattered but I found it insulting and also disappointing that he had not really changed. Also, his wife is really lovely - what an insult to her. Unfortunately, it put me off him to the point where I now actively dislike him.

You are talking about worse than this in my opinion - physical abuse - a complete NO!

no,he hasnt changed,just the situation has.....you arent around to shout at or be violent to. he spends his money the same.

he wont have changed....i tried a holiday with my ecx before getting the divorce. confirmed ffor me he hadnt changed

Well I think that is pretty catergorical.

I think that too, though deep down just feel sad and there is a little part of me that is worried that it was actually my fault and I made him that way and he will be totally different with someone else. Think I would find that very hard to deal with.

Sure if he has changed as he says, time will tell.

why, why, why do women continue to blame themselves time and time again for the fuckwittery of men ???

OP, you didn't turn him into a twat...he did that all by himself

now, protect yourself and move on

I think you have the answer already. He says he has changed but you say, 'I am not sure that he has changed. Deep down I do think that he is putting on a bit of an act at the moment.' & I think that is your answer. If you have been abused I think you develop a feeling for these things out of self protection, listen to your feelings, your inner voice - they are probably right.

On the other hand don't listen to the bit of you that thinks his abusive behaviour of you is somehow your fault - it's not. His behaviour is his choice. Remember all the bad times, he choose to abuse you physically, verbally, financially, emotionally. He had (? has) an alcohol problem. He was unfaithful.

Do yourself and the DCs a favour - move on, not back. Good luck.