Can't abide my ILs but don't want it to ruin things with DH

[Sparkletastic]

DH and I have been together 9 years. Have had ups and downs and stresses with DD2 who has health condition and SN. Gradually I'd gone cold on him. He confronted this last weekend, asked if I wanted us to split up and we stayed up all night talking it all through. For the 1st time in 9 years we were open and honest about our feelings. Upshot was we both feel like our relationship has had a re-boot and we are once again looking forward to a future together with our DCs. Early days but signs are all good except for one major glitch - his parents.

FIL is an odd chap - very emotionally cold, almost completely incapable of making conversation or showing any empathy, completely dependent on MIL for his social life, only interested in DIY. DH was scared of him when he was a child and can now occasionally relate to him on a blokey level and talk about football / techy stuff, but has no love for him.

MIL is a very domineering person, hugely opinionated and with a strong sense of everyone else's duty towards her. She was actually my boss several years ago and introduced me to DH so there is a difficult dynamic to our relationship (she was universally feared and hated at work as she was a complete bully - I only went on date with DH because I was too scared to say no ).

Over the years they have been one of the major issues in my and DH's marriage. I cannot abide them but am prepared to make as much effort as I can with them for the sake of the DCs. I have been guilty of bitching about them way too much to DH. He doesn't disagree but would rather pretend they don't exist except for when we are actually with them IYSWIM. They seem to think I am a model DIL so my twofacedness acting abilities are clearly Oscar-worthy .

We have had the latest incident with them over the last week. They had arranged a family gathering with MIL's deeply unpleasant brother at their house. They have not got together for 5 years as he hasn't wanted to see MIL. She persuaded him and his wife to come to their house by inviting his daughter and family, us and my SIL as 'bribes' I think. DH has now told MIL we can't come as we have booked a week away just for the 4 of us over half term -we really need some relaxing family time and can't afford summer prices so this is our last chance. MIL is enraged and FIL is telling DH off for upsetting his mother, but both seem to be blaming me for 'not understanding' how important this lunch with evil brother is and for being selfish and 'taking a better offer'. This seems to be because MIL made me agree to this lunch several months back last time we saw them when DH wasn't around - as is often the case as she always wants to speak to me not him.

I am absolutely furious and can feel it is coming between DH and I. I know it sounds a small thing, and we have certainly put ourselves 1st, but for damned good reason. ILs live abroad much of the year so have no real clue what is going on with us and do always try to pin us down for things several months in advance. We needed to be spontaneous for once though and it has massively pissed them off. It is just the latest in their over-bearing behaviour towards us.

Should I speak to DH about how I am feeling or just pull myself together?! We are not cancelling our holiday so ILs will have to get over it. I'm dreading seeing them though as I feel so angry and resentful. When DH spoke to them I don't think he exactly set them straight - he tried for a while but then gave up to keep the peace from what he's told me. I feel let down by him, but suspect this is unreasonable of me....

Bless anyone for persevering with this. Any thoughts gratefully received.

If your new found future is based on honestly then you have to tell him.

You have to accept that they are like this and as hard as it will be, do what you need to do for your family. It needs to be both of you not just yopu or dh saying no iyswim. tbh your dh is gonna have to man up and say no we;re not coming, sorry if it upsets you but this is what we are doing.

Thanks LoveBeing - I feel in my gut you are right about the honesty. I guess I need to be straight with DH without being bitchy! I know he will put DCs and I first but won't necessarily be able to confront ILs as much as I want him to.

i do understand where you're coming from because i also have difficult inlaws.

BUT

your dh isn't responsible for their actions so i'd try not to harp on at him about it.

i like his attitude - they don't exist until you're actually with them and i think you should take a leaf out of his book.

tell him once, by all means, how you feel but i wouldn't go to him with every small thing. moan about it on here and to your friends and family. then you also need to start letting it go and not let it rule your life. i'm not saying that you are, but if you're anything like me, there is an atmosphere in which you live - don't let them cloud it.

decide yourself what your limits are: call them once a week / see them x number of times, whatever, but beyond that don't give them a thought. hard though that is.

your relationship with dh is the most important thing - don't let them ruin it.

as for getting him to confront them, well he could but do you think that is the best course? very hard for him and ultimately would it make a difference?

sometimes actions speak louder than words. keep with your holiday plans as you are. you can say on phone to them wistfully 'oh i wish we were going to see your family, i'm so sorry we're missing your lunch blah blah. unfortunately only time we can afford our holiday is half term blah blah'.

wrt booking things way in advance, you can say 'gosh it will be so lovely to see you, but i'm not sure what we're doing on those dates. i wouldn't want to let you down. can i confirm closer to the date? i will pencil it in for now.' then have a good think and get back to them in a month or two.

in a nutshell: start living the way you want the relationship to work. talk is just that: talk, and will be hard for your dh and you.

slowly the light shall start dawning.

good advice warthog - many thanks. Maybe I should have a brief discussion with DH just to let him know that whilst I am quietly seething at the mo it is not his fault and I will get over it. I can deal with ILs as long as DH and I are a united front. I am not prepared to make arrangements with ILs without DH's involvement any more though as then it is all down to me if things go tits up! My parents are fabulously supportive and loathe ILs too, although they are far too polite to show it, so I can have a cathartic slagging off sesh with them when I need to. And of course there is always MN as your say Warthog

What is making me fume incidentally is that MIL, in her usual 'drama out of a crisis' stylee, is saying that she has to cancel the whole lunch fixture with everyone now we aren't going to be there. Can't quite see why but she seems determined that we have ruined everything...

I do think it was rude to say that you would go to the meal & then change your mind tbh.
Although I can see why you´ve done it.

And if things are so bad with MIL´s brother she should imo be sorting that out by herself & not involving others.

I sympathise about the ILs though.

I think I would be wanting it emphasising -when it´s next mentioned-that the holiday is a joint decision.

And both of you stick together.

The one time MIL said something to me & husband told her not to speak to me like that she burst into tears & asked if he still loved her FFS!

FIL told him off for upsetting his Mum & husband told him that she shouldn´t have upset me then-and did they really think he was EVER going to put his Mum before his wife?

Dont cancel your holiday for them. You cant be the good samaritan who is expected to make this lunch go smoothly with evil brother. Let her go mad or whatever but put your family first. If she expects you to cancel your holiday then she needs rehab!! Have fun on your holiday btw

I think you are being a little harsh on dh I have a similar MIL and I can honestly do the same thing abd be annoyed with dp.

He has supported you by not pushing to cancel the holiday he has told his mum but he can't control the way she acts.

I would phone MIL yourself and tell her how childish she is behaving me and dp had endless arguments over his mum until I started dealing with her now we don't argue because if I have a problem with MIL I tell her myself instead of taking it out on dp.

Hi sparkletastic (Great name that!!),

They have always been overbearing/toxic methinks and it will be so forever more.
These people too are more than happy moreover to pass on all their rubbish to the next generation i.e your children!.

I would ask you what if anything your children get from these awful sounding people. Nothing is the short answer to that one. Do not fall into the age old trap of, "we cannot abide them but am prepared to make as much effort as I can with them for the sake of the DCs". You can't abide them for good reason but why should your children have to put up with them?. Sod feeling guilty as well, you think they feel at all guilty/sorry for their actions?. Er no. Effort like this has to be two way and you have certainly tried to be nice; its no point at all if they continue to act unreasonably as they will. A line has to be drawn somewhere.

It seems like you have yourself come from a family unit where this type of familial dysfunction is thankfully unknown. This is what makes it harder for you to deal with and perhaps you think it will all work out. You must remember too that these types of dysfunctional families do not play by the rules governing "normal" family behaviour and thus say its their way only or we'll throw a wobbly. They are doing and saying ALL the usual things that toxic parents say.
Your MIL has also got the emotional blackmail stuff down to a tee and FIL sounds like the typical bystander in these situations. People from dysfunctional families play and have distinct roles.

Why are they like it, well its probably because their own parents treated them appallingly as children and they failed them miserably as a result. Such behaviours get learnt at a young age.

You both have to set clear and firm boundaries with these toxic people. You don't have to see them as and when they want you to see them. Stick to your holiday plans (do not cancel because of them) and stand firm and united against their toxic behaviours.

After a lifetime of conditioning at the hands of his toxic parents it is very hard for your DH to be able to start thinking differently about them. This though is absolutely not an excuse for him, his loyalty should be first and foremost to you as his wife.

You may want to read "Toxic Inlaws" written by Susan Forward as that could help you further.

Telling MIL she is childish may well be counterproductive as it will give her more ammo to fight you with (I can imagine the conversation with your H, her darling boy and then he will be torn again). The way to go here ultimately is no contact with them which is easy to write but hard to achieve.

Oh Attila that is all so relevant - thank you. MIL's mother was a violent, neglectful alcoholic and her father supported his wife rather than his children and ignored the abuse. MIL's twin took it all out on MIL and their younger brother. Completed screwed up but MIL proudly talks about how despite her childhood what a fine parent she is, how caring and unselfish she is etc and does nothing but slag off her twin despite now wanting this lovely family lunch with him DH is very unhappy about aspects of his childhood (being farmed out on friends / relatives / neighbours all the time, rarely doing anything as a family, being forced to do chores all the time from an extremely early age etc).

I do worry about ILs relationship with my DDs. At present DDs are too young to pick up on all the negative dynamics but they won't remain in blissful ignorance for long. ILs are by turn extremely critical of my DDs and then overly concerned and then over-praising the next minute - we never know quite where we are with them.

TBH I think DH would be happy to not see his parents any more but part of me does feel sorry for them. I think things will get harder as our DCs get older and less cute and biddable around the ILs. Apparently ILs are planning to move to some rural idyll further away from us in the next year or so and we are pinning a certain amount of hope on this, although they often say they are going to make life changes then don't

Well I´m probably going to sound a b!tch, but your MIL is an adult now & should imo be able to see that what is important to her isn´t top priority to everyone else.

TBH the family sound so dysfunctional that I don´t think your children would be missing much by not having a very close relationship with them.

We are abroad & ILs have never visited-and no one has missed them.

Hi sparkletastic,

You're welcome.

Small wonder you MIL is the way she is having read about her own childhood and her own dysfunctional parents. There is a definate correlation here. These are though her issues to deal with though and she has chosen not to again for whatever reasons. They are not your burden to carry, both you and your H are not responsible for making her the way she is towards you.

I have very screwed up ILs myself so do unfortunately speak from experience here.

Do not though subject your children to their toxic crap, believe me it won't do you as a family unit any good at all and you will live to regret letting them into your lives. They will manipulate your children and infact they are doing so now by the act of criticising them one moment and over praising them the next. If you don't know where you stand with them understandably then they certainly won't and their actions could well go onto form problems between the two siblings (overt favouritism shown towards one whilst other get ignored or unnoticed).

Re your comment:-
"TBH I think DH would be happy to not see his parents any more but part of me does feel sorry for them"

A part of you feels sorry for them, why is this exactly?. I did smile wryly to myself when I read that. This is understandable coming from you as you have yourself come from a family unit where this type of dysfunction is unknown. You must understand though that these people do not play by the "normal" rules of family relations.

Support your DH too in not wanting to see them anymore, at the very least have caller id on your phone and keep all forms of contact with them to the barest of minimums (this is what I do and it for me works nicely). I can only reiterate to you though they do not feel the same way at all and neither of you will never receive any apology from them for their behaviours. It is because at heart they feel they have done nothing wrong towards you and your H.

He btw may want to read "Toxic Parents" written by Susan Forward. Also do read the book I previously recommended.

actually i agree with attila.

if neither of you can't stand them, why should your children have to? as you say, it will only get worse as they begin to assert themselves.

they sound awful and i'd advise a gentle retraction. make sure you can't go to everything. stop phoning so often etc.

if you'd feel better you could phone them up and tell them that you're cutting contact.

Thanks all - you've really made me think about this more calmly. I'm going to go for a gradual withdrawal I think as I need to make sure DH and I are together on it all. I've already told him I'm no longer willing to have contact with them without him and have started screening calls and ignoring emails. TBH if it is left to DH to make arrangements then meet-ups will be very few and far between. Unfortunately SIL is caught up in all this too - she's a very strong assertive person in her working life but single and childless and much more emotionally dependent on her parents than perhaps she should be at her age. If we have minimal contact with ILs she will try and get involved as desperately wants the 'big happy family' dream. Will have a serious think about their access to our DDs. They only really spend any quantity of time with DD1 (occasional sleepovers for her at theirs when they are in this country etc) as DD2 has SN and is very dependent on me so they rarely suggest she spends any time with them.

Right - off to Amazon to find those books you recommended Attila....