I need some perspective - long, sorry

[ilove]

I need some perspective on this because I'm too close to it all.

I have to go back to my childhood to get the background in, it is relevant.

My mum had me when she was 19. my father f***d off and left her to it. when I was 6 months old she met my dad and when I was 5 they adopted me - in those days they made you a ward of court, took you "off" your mum and then both had to adopt you. So, my mum is my mum, my dad is on paper my step-dad but he is my Daddy.

His mother refused to be called Grandma/Gran or any of the derivatives, her name was Molly and as I was into the Milly-Molly-Mandy books she begrudgingly agreed to be Milly-Molly. His dad was more than happy to be Grandpa. So, Milly-Molly and Grandpa it was.

My Grandma and Grandad (Mum's parents) were/are the most wonderful people. I lived with them till I was 5 and remain very close to my Grandma, my Grandad died 8 years ago and I miss him every day.

When my little sister was born, MM and G proudly added her to the family tree. I wasn't on it and asked why. I ws told it was because I wasn't family.

One year wea had to go there for Christmas day. I wasn't brought any presents. As I got older I refused to go there and went to my Grandmas instead while the others all went to MM & G's. My mum was in hospital one year and my dad had to go to MM's, she had made dinner for him, her and G and not me. My dad gave me his and she told him off

God there is so much...when Grandpa died, big funeral at Bradford cathedral, family all at the front, in teh posh cars, go to the graveyard afterwards, then to the wake. Me? At the back with my grandma and grandad as I'm not family.

The last time I saw this c*ing bit** from hell was when my eldest was a baby (he'll be 19 in July) and my dad proudly said to MM "look at my grandson"

The reply? "he's hardly your grandson is he Robin". My dad calmly replied "oh yes he is".

I haven't had any contact with her since then.

MM has lived with her daughter, another Nicola, since Grandpa died. Ruined Nicola's life, and I feel dreadfully sorry for her.

I refused to have her invited to my wedding and she hasnt been to my sister or brothers weddings either. they (MM and N - you still with me?) live in London, we are in Leeds.

My mum just rang. To tell me that MM and N are moving to Holmfirth to be near family. MM is now 90 and I apparently have to "be the adult" and "be the bigger person".

My Grandma lives in holmfirth and while I can't go veery often I DO try and get to see her when I have a very rare day off, and now I won't be able to go over there. Familyt get togethers now will involve me being rung, told "such and such is happening, o and MM will be there it is up to you if you come" and I wont be able to go.

I can't. I can NOT face that evil woman again and subject my children to her hatred. DH is at work today and I have just cried my eyes out down the phone at him, he thinks I am crazy and doesnt see why it affects me so much, "for goodness sake you are 40".

I don't have a brilliant relationship with my mum, never have. I can cope with that. But the thought of me and my kids being ostracised till the fucking cow dies is not something i can cope with right now. My kids dont even know she exists ffs!

Don'tr get me wrong I am thrilled for my dad that he will have his sister close and his mum as well, she has never bee a mum to him he was sent to bording school as a little boy, she split him and my mum up for 6 months and has never accepted us as part of the fanily, but she is still his mum asnd fotr himI am glad.

But me? i'm absolutely heartbroken at the thought that my kids will end up having to meet her and be subjected to her nastiness.

I don't know what to do. Please help me get some perspective on this.

Gosh, what a terrible time you've had.

I don't have much constructive advice here but wanted to bump for you, and let you know how sorry I am that you're in this horrible situation. I'm sure there will be someone along soon who can be more helpful, but FWIW, I would be finding it all just as hard as you. The woman has been vile, and you are totally entitled to feel the way you do.

Lots of hugs xxx

I don't think you'll find anyone to disagree with you that this woman's conduct has been horrific. But I do think you may (understandably) be exaggerating how much she can affect you now. You say you can't visit this town now to see your own grandmother because this awful woman is there? She's 90, she won't be roaming the town every day of the year to pounce on you as soon as you get there.

It's horrifying that your mum did nothing when you were a child, frankly, and now expects you to be the bigger person. Could you be reassigning some justified anger against your mum? When is she going to stand up to her monster of a MIL?

Thanks both, like I said I am too close to this to have any perspective on it. Common sense states that she won't be on every street waiting to pounce, no, but my car is distinctive and has to be parked in the residents space or my mum's second house drive, so easily visible. (Holmfirth is a pig for parking).

I have calmed down a bit now...well, I've stopped crying anyway.

That is horrific. What sort of person would leave a child with nothing while others ate Christmas dinner??. She was a monster.

I wouldn't mind betting that the reason for your mistreatment was to punish your father for refusing to end his relationship with your mother.

Your treatment at her hands was dreadful but it sounds as if her toxic influence affected the whole family.

Anyway that was then and this is now. In her terms - she lost and you won. Your parents stayed together, your father treated you as his own, you had more brothers and sisters, your grandpa loved you and now you have your own lovely family. You are important to so many people and she is just a toxic old wagon.

I hope you see that to ostracise yourself and your family now would be to continue her work for her. To continue to wipe yourselves from existence and to appear to be of lesser importance.

You don't have to try to be the bigger person. You are the bigger person. You were the bigger person when you were 5 years old. You just need to find a way to take the power back from her. Turn up at those family events proud of yourself and your children and your place at the centre of that family. Let her see that her horribleness acheived nothing.

Tell your kids that she is a very old woman with very strange ideas and that she was not very nice to you as a child. They don't have to listen to her. She can't hurt them.
When you see her she will be diminished in every way.

You don't need to give her the time of day but you must not let her continue to push you out.

I can completely see why you will be reacting this way. She has been a truly toxic influence in your past. Despite her shocking nastiness, you have grown up well-adjusted and had a family of your own.

I would agree that, from an outside point of view, your mother and father have a lot to answer for here. They both had a duty to protect you from hurt - and she will have psychologically hurt you considerably. I am sure there is more to the story, but I am quite shocked that you were allowed to be treated in this way. She must have been a real battle-axe if no one stood up to her.

I think, for you, maybe seeing her now may be cathartic for you. She was probably a big, dominant figure in your family and now she is just an old woman, who has no power to hurt you anymore. If she is rude to your children, you must do what your parents failed to do for you and stand up to her.

Go and see her - be polite and self-confident and see her for the insignificant person she really is. She is not worth your anxiety.

Sorry if that's a bit ranty. I just feel rather shocked at your treatment as an innocent child!

I have a step mother very much like this ilove.I was verbally and emotionally abused by her from the age of 4,I couldn't stand up for myself at that age but I can at the age of 33.

I have lots of bitterness towards my father tbh,as he never stood up for me and still doesn't when she decides to unleash her toxic tongue.She bought my dh a birthday present last year (he has only spoken to her 5 times at the most in our 9 yr marriage),it was just a dig at me as she doesn't bother with her step grandchildren (my children),there are many things that have been said about me and my children.She just a vile person.

I don't converse and I won't allow her in my home-simple as.

She still continues to behave in a spoilt,abusive fashion but I let her eat herself up with her anger and jealousy.

Do NOT feel like you have to do anything for this toxic old lady.You are a adult and can choose who to have in your life.

Actually you do NOT need to be the bigger person. You don't have to have anything to do with her that you do not want to. Toxic families don't like it when people stand up and start talking about things that went on within the family, that is probably why your Mum wants you to "be the bigger person", don't rock the boat and all that.

I totally understand why you feel like you do, your OP made me want to cry.

Personally I would go to any family occasion that I wanted to go to, greet her with a smile and breezy hello and then ignore her entirely. Remember she is coming into YOUR area and YOUR life, not taking it over. She is insignificant in the life that you have now with your dh and dc.

Agree with mrsboogie, don't let her push you out anymore, she already did that. I truly believe that things that we have problems with come in cycles until we find a way to lay them to rest. This is your chance. She can't hurt you.

My friend, who is on here (hello) has just said on MSN,

says:
you need to tell DH that 25 yrs on, i still remember one day of her treatment of you
that should tell him how bloody evil and hate filled it was
even i wanted to protect you
shame your parents didnt

She met MM once. ONCE.

I feel for you.

I knwo I will get flamed for this but in all probability you will get to dance on her grave.

I wouldn't give her the satisfaction. The one thought going round my head, which I will probably get flamed for, is why did my wonderful Grandad have to die and her live?

understandable. Do you have any idea what turned her into such a twisted, spiteful, nasty individual? I don't like to think that people are born this way - or that people can be capable of what is, after all, out and out abuse.

I still don't quite get why your parents let this go. Did you ever bring it up with them?

She is THE most formidable battleaxe you will ever meet...she was well up in the army...possibly a General. She is really nasty, and basically my Mum and me weren't good enough for their family.

Why did they let it go? I don't know...if my mum could even NOW acknowledge the way they were with me, instead of the "oh I'm sure she didnt't do/say that, I'm sure that never happened" then I would feel better. I know why she doesn't, she can't accept it as she feels guilty. But that isn't my fault.

Mum rang me back today and said "I'm sure that incident with your dad and her saying that about your DS didn't happe because I don't remember you seeing her after you had him"

Well, it did and I do. I told her exactly where and when, what my Dad was doing and even the area of the property we were in. She went quiet then...

My mum has been on the receiving end of her nastiness as well...but I guess for Dad's sake she wants to forget about it. Maybe I should try and do the same...sadly I can't.

I'm sorry you've had such an awful time. You don't owe anyone anything, no one's exactly stood up for you ever, have they? You don't have to see this woman if you don't want to. Look after yourself, withdraw from it and do everything on YOUR terms. You don't have to forgive, why should you? You do what is best for you. I really hope you find a way through this without causing yourself too much stress.

You are, as your husband said, 40 years old.

And that means you can do whatever seems best. Don't see her if you don't want to. By the sounds of it, she wouldn't be thrilled to see you anyway.

BUT

At YOUR family get-togethers, t's YOUR family and she cannot leave you out because she's not in charge any more.

You go to whatever family events you want to. You give her a nod/eye contact then ignore her.

If she makes one spiteful comment to you OR your children you stand up to her and tell her you are an adult you will not take the abuse she gave you as a child and you sure as hell will not let her abuse your children (if they are the target) as your parents did you.

Then you tell her that this is your family and to deal with it.

If she says nothing you don't.

She sounds horrible. You have my sympathy.

Agree with Xales. She is more the outsider in the family now than you are.

But really - do you have to see her? It sounds as though you are getting along fine without knowing her and not having anything to do with her could be the best course of action.

If you do have to see her and she starts kicking off you don't have to put up with it any more - you are an adult now that dynamics have changed. Ultimately, it is up to you to decide whether you want to put up with her crap. If she starts being a bitch you can answer back (you will probably have support on that one), leave the building etc.

Was it your mum who said you had to be the bigger person? Where was she when your grandma was being such a bitch?

BTW your children don't have to meet her. I won't allow my children anywhere near the woman who gave birth to me. Only bloody thing she ever did give me.

ilove... Bloody, bloody, bloody horrible old cow.

I think the problem with facing the demons or, in this case, evil old dragons from our childhood is that often the reactions they provoke in us reflect what we did as children. If this is effect she has on you, ie making you feel powerless, sad, hurt and unable to express your anger (assumptions from your OP, I hope I've understood correctly) then no wonder this is filling you with such horror.

I had to face something not the same but with similar feelings attached a while ago (I'm 44 by the way) and, for once, I was determined that I wouldn't react the way I always did and stood up to the bully (in this case, my dad). It was hard and I couldn't do it immediately. I started the encounter by feeling the same way I always did but ended it by saying things I should have said years ago.

I guess what I'm saying is that if you get the opportunity to simply say to her that her behaviour is rude and rather common (something like that will hit hard if she thinks you are "beneath her") and then simply ignore her, you may find it gets easier and eaiser to deal with her. One thing is for certain, she'll need you a long time before you ever need her!

The other thing that occurred to me is that your mum won't want to admit how terribly you have been treated because, quite frankly, she should not have allowed it to happen or continue. If she pretends it didn't happen she doesn't have to face her culpability.

BTW, I'm near Holmfirth myself and can only hope that our hills and snow will cause this wicked old bat some "challenges"!

OP, you seem to have decided how things will be, when she has not even moved yet. I think that the feelings are all dredged up because you thought that you had got rid of her and now she is back in your local proximity. It really cannot be like it was before. You are not 5 any more and she cannot make you feel that way any more. I don't think that there is any debating how poisonous this woman has been, but now you are a grown up, and she has no control over you at all.

I think that you should write her a really horrible letter, get it all down on paper. BUT DON'T SEND IT! It will make you feel better. The feelings that you have are real, but there is nothing to be gained by acting on them.

OP, I will never pretend that I understand this sort of hurt - she sounds truly horrible and you don't have to be around horrible people. That said, I thought I'd offer a tiny thing that makes me feel better about my DH's hag of a grandmother.

Everytime she comes out with something racist, anti-immigrant (which I am), an observation about my weight or utter disdain for me being in the same room as the rest of the family, I make a special point to laugh in her face and make some comment like "Oh dear. They did have different ideas in your time, didn't they?"

I've made her into the crazy old cat lady in the attic in my head - and it's worked so well that I look forward to her outrageous rantings so I can laugh into her face some more.

I'm not saying that this would work at all for you. But, there may be SOMETHING, some sort of strategy that you can use when she's in the room so you can hold your head high at events with YOUR family.

Sorry to have gone quiet but I was out last night and today.

My Dad rang me last night on his way home from work, I missed his call so rang him back when he got home.

He started the conversation with: "I'm calling about MM". I thought he was going to have a go at me...lol.

He said "I am ringing to tell you that YOU come first with me, I am your dad and you are my daughter and NOTHING is going to stop me seeing you and the children and if she doesn't like it that's tough. I know how nasty she was when you were growing up and I promise you she won't do it again, I won't let her. All the fire has gone out of her and there is NO way I am accepting you not coming to anything because she might be there. You, your DH and my grandchildren are MY family and nothing is going to change that. SHE is the incomer now, you have done nothing wrong and neither have we and that is that. I'm so proud of you and what you have achieved and I have told her and shown her photos of ALL the grandchildren and that is it. She is an old lady who sits in teh corner and doesn't say a lot!"

I said I was worried that she would start to say stuff about me and the children not being family, and he said "YOU are my family and YOU come first and you always will, you know that".

So, knowing he is on my side means the world, him admitting how utterly vile she was means the world, and I have my wonderful DH and him on my side and I know if she starts then I will (I hope) be able to come back at her with an appropriate put-down.

Anyway, she hasn't moved here yet. Perhaps karma will state that she needs to either not be able to buy up here OR will stick her at the top of a very steep hill that she'll then be stuck on!

Thanks for all your thought and input