Guilt on spliiting up the family... advice on when to put yourself first!

[toobusytoobusy]

Hi, not looking for any right or wrong answers really, just wondered what others think as I can't seem to make a decision on this one.....
My husband and I are effectively living separate lives as we have both agreed that there is no love between us anymore. However, we have 3 young children and have agreed to stay together for them. They dont see us rowing, there is no terrible atmosphere (well there is in my head and heart, but I think I hide it well) and so for now putting on a front is the plan.

However, I feel so lonely and I hate it. How much do you keep going for your kids? When do you put yourself first? I feel like we should keep up the pretence as the things that make me not love him anymore are not new, and deep down I knew his faults when I married him and had his children, that said he has a horrible side to him that I never saw until the last few years. He says he is not lonely, he can carry this on indefinitely because nothing bothers him, and to be honest I don't think it does. I think he is quite honestly emotionally dead. But I am not!

At what point is it okay to put yourself first?! Separating would be a nightmare financially, we dont have a lot of equity and I couldn't get a mortgage on my own.

As I said at the start, I know there is no right or wrong answer, just wanted to hear some others opinions I guess. I just dont feel justified in making my children come from a broken home if there is no adultery, abuse etc, just a miserable mum with a miserable, unmotivated dad!

Thank you x

I am sorry that you are living like this, your 3 young children may not notice now or you think they don't notice but they will grow up and notice and think this is how a family works.

it is hard spliting up or staying together - how do you plan to live together but appart, what will happen if you meet someone else? how will you feel if your dp that is not meets someone?

I don't really see how you are staying for hte children, it will still effect thme.

Do you live your life sepeartely wiht the children, or do you bth get equal time with them and go off and do things with all three alone?

Sorry to hear you are in this situation. It sounds horrendous to be honest. I am in the same position, living with my H but seperated (financial reasons only). There has been an affair in the past, but we get on so well as friends, don't argue, co parent very well etc, I am going through massive guilt thinking I should just "get on with it" for the childrens sake. HOWEVER, I feel long term this kind of scenario just doesn't work. It is destructive and demeaning. Long term you will start to feel resentful and bitter and this is when arguments start (sometimes affairs).
You DO need to put yourself first at times(although I would argue being in an unhappy marriage isn't putting anyones needs first) and being in a relationship "just for the kids" doesn't give you, your H any self respect and certainly doesn't give your children any tools to handle their own adult relationships in the future. They do pick up on seperate lives and atmospheres and sometimes end up Relate customers wondering why their relationships don't work!
Good luck though, it is a very very hard position to be in. Good luck x

What you're both doing is delaying the inevitable, which would be an affair. The fall-out for the children if there is an affair will be worse than if you parted now reasonably amicably.

It does children no favours to bring them up in a marriage without love or intimacy - it becomes their "normal" and can create all sorts of problems for them later on when they go on to form relationships of their own.

The reasons you cite as being justifiable are too narrow. Leaving a marriage where there is no love - and where there is deep-seated resentment, is enough. I assume however, you've tried everything, including Relate?

Thank you for your thoughtful replies, to be honest what you have both said about how it does actually affect the children is always there at the back of my mind. My mum was widowed when I was young and went for a very safe option for her second husband and I feel that I have repeated the pattern, so if I am being honest with myself I accept that by staying together in an unhappy marriage we are also affecting them in an adverse way. To grow up and see a marriage with no affection etc is not good for their idea of a marriage. BUT, when they are young can you balance that argument against them not living in the same house as their father, who they adore?

We get by with this arrangement because we have always been by our nature (or as a reflection of our marriage maybe) quite independent people. He works very long hours (as do I) so for example, he will watch the kids whilst I run off and do a food shop, or take one to a party at the weekend whilst he looks after the other two. We haven't made time for each other for a long time as I got sick of being the only one trying to arrange that and getting nowhere. We do have a hectic lifestyle which doesn't/hasn't helped.

Family always pop in at the weekends and we just kind of tick over. We sleep in the same bed but there is no physical contact at all, quite comical at times really, although it is too sad to be proper funny iykwim!

Cheatedon, glad you are able to coparent well and be friends, we just seem to function, there is no friendship as he has told me bluntly he has no interest in my feelings and that I should just get on with things, so I feel that there is little point in trying to share things with him.

Oh bloody men! And bloody chick lit books and films! Make you hanker after a life that rarely exists me thinks! Ivykaty, as for meeting other people, I think at this stage in my life I'd rather stick pins in my eyes. I don't have the energy, the time or the inclination, BUT, I know at some point I will feel different, and even now I do feel lonley. As I said before, I consider him to be emotionally dead and he says that he is not interested in meeting anyone else, ever! He is quite a loner, always been very happy with his own company.

Hey ho.... good luck to anyone in this position, it's not easy is it? x

WhenwillIfeelnormal... sorry, reply overlapped. You make such good sense, although I don't think either of us would ever have an affair, I would find the strength to leave if I felt tempted, and his mum was a serial cheat and he has incredibly strong views on the subject, took his marriage vows very seriously, just a shame he doesn't want to put any effort in to actively having a happy marriage!!!

I dont want my children to be emotionally damaged, there is a little voice inside me growing stronger that tells me we need to find the strength to separate.... x

Bloody hell!! Have just phoned the tax credits helpline to see how things would stand if we separated as I need to be realistic about keeping our house on. Can't believe how much money they would give me! Doesn't help promote family life....

Generous tax credits might not promote family life, but they do a great deal to enable lone parents to keep their heads above water, and to enable the children of lone parents to have access to the same things as their peers.

Good luck to you - I was where you are a couple of months ago. FWIW I know I made the right decision in ending my relationship, and - so far, touch wood - the children have taken it very calmly.

One of the things that concerns me in my situation is that my children don't ever see their father and myself relating in a 'normal' way as parents. The lack of daily communication does not show them/teach them anything about relationships between men and women. They are not seeing two people demonstrate positive, communicative, thoughtful, loving behaviour towards each other. They have never seen us argue and make up either to learn about security in life etc. I presume your H was not emotionally dead originally. My enlightenment over the years has been that my H's personality is such that there is no emotional depth in it. Full stop. I feel, therefore, that it is down to me solely to teach my dc about caring, loving, thoughtfulness, empathy, as I do not want them to develop into 'cold' human-beings.

Autumnlight, absolutely ditto apart from my poor kids have heard us have many a yelling fight, and they do ask us to stop My h has never been massive on the emotional front, but he did used to care about me and my feelings, even though he has professed to never having many of his own. Same as yours I think, no depth, but he has got worse. Would never in a million years consider counselling.

Pollytroll, well done for making the leap, can't have been easy, and you make a very good and fair point about the tax credits x

Sorry - I meant to put - my dc have seen us argue (although my H has consistently used the silent treatment with me over the years) - but there was never a resolution or making up at any time demonstrated by us. I know that is not healthy for them.

Autumnlight we are the same on that one too then, my children have never seen us make up. And what bothers me is that lack of emotion or affection being demonstrated, especially since we both seem to have repeated our parents mistakes in terms of relationships, but he just won't have any of it. Whenever I try and talk about anything to do with emotions or feelings he just says, along the lines of, it's a load of bollocks and I'm not interested! I know he wasn't always that heartless else I wouldn't have married him!!

Meant also to say that H would never consider counselling, I made it sound like both us wouldn't consider it, even at this late stage I would, but then I think would my heart be in it, or would I just be doing it so that I can say I tried everything? (though if your heart isn't in it then you're not truly trying everything, I do realise how hypocritical I sound!).

I told him tonight that I having spoke to Tax Credits I could afford to be without him and I could tell by his reaction that he just doesn't think I'm being serious about splitting up, but thinks it's perfectly acceptable to live in this loveless, sexless, friendless marriage!

Oh what to do.... Best try and get on with some work, it's so hard to concentrate when my head is swimming with it all the time, and frustrates me that he's lying there watching telly, really not giving a shit.

Thanks for the replies, it's been so great to offload x

I don't honestly think you can sustain this. There is a world of difference between a sexless marriage, where you both communicate and get on well, an open marriage, where you have relationships outside the marriage, but inside communicate and get on, and how you are living now - separate lives.

It's the separate lives that is the killer.

And it doesn't matter a jot whether or not an affair is on the horizon. That is the least of your worries.

The immediate problem will come, I would guess, over a parenting issue. You need to be able to communicate or, at some point, one of your dc, or more, will fall into the gap. Really.

And there are loads of other things you need to be able to communicate about.

And it's not good for your soul, and your need to love and be loved.

And the dc will pick up on it -- and think that is normal. Or at least have it as their background as they set out on a quest for love.

Putting dc first is admirable, but I'm not sure your relationship is going to be capable of putting them first, in the way they need.

Sorry - I realised that sounded like a really rude response to an earlier post. I didn't mean it that way. I meant it more as "It;s not so much that something new might happen, and then things will get worse -- the situation as it is will lead to problems."

I'm really sorry if I did sound snarky. It wasn't the intention. I can indeed see that there is a degree of inevitability in that situation, and it will undoubtedly do very little to help a bad situation.

But I do think that even if nothing else happened, the situation as is will slowly eat away at joy and happiness in your family.

And I suppose I should add the usual rider - are you sure that things wouldn't improve with a little more communication? though it does sound as though you've tried that ... .

Animula, you didn't sound at all rude, in fact I really did appreciate the whole post, especially the bit about it not being good for the soul, and my need to love and be loved.... I am not an overly emotional person but I fear he is turning me in to a cold fish, and your line there really snapped me back to who I really am. And yes, I should look after my soul, and I should be loved, I am a good person (though yes of course I have faults!), and I want to love someone and have affection in my life. But yes, above all, it isn't good for the children long term.

He is the one that is trying to advocate this living together but separate lives crap saying that it is the best solution for the children because he doesn't want to be away from his children, which I understand, BUT, really, I know it isn't the answer. However, it breaks my heart to think of them not seeing their daddy all the time, he worships them and they worship him.

Grrr, I would love to think we could try again and communicate, but he's just gone up to bed without so much as a sound, left me here working, and then I think, do you know what.. I just don't even like you.

I don't know how others on this board feel but my life is so busy with work and the children that even though I know we should separate, I just don't even find the time to think it through clearly, I always feel like my head is full. I know that to separate it would take strength of character that I just don't think I have the energy for, but then it all becomes a viscous circle because whilst I am living like this I won't find the strength, and I am definitely more snappy and grizzly with my kids.

I feel like there is no let up in my life, and that is when I feel that it is not good for the soul to live like this, I want to run away to the seaside or something! Thanks all for listening (reading), have just discoverd this and it is a godsend for offloading, even without the replies, which I am grateful for though, as they have been so helpful. Thanks again x

Morning toobusy
I completely agree with what others have already said, I think you will get too a point (not far from now I'd say) when this life is just not good enough anymore. Life is so much more than just 'getting on with it'.
Remember who you are, you and your children deserve a rich and fulfilling life....you can do it!!!!!
X

Hello toobusy. I have been exactly where you are now. My exH and I lived seperate lives (though not when he wanted sex! and I felt obliged to oblige) but eventually I decided that infact the best thing for the children and I was to split up. I had tried everything to make it work but the gap between us got bigger and bigger. Infact in the end we split up over a very minor fall out, but it was really the straw that broke the camels back and I have heard lots of poeple since say that it was the same with them, you plod on and on and on and then one day its just enough and you want out. I would say you will know when that day arrives.

I really believe yes of course its very important whats right for your children but that does not mean whats right for you isn't just as important. I got to the stage where I thought when I am really old and look back on my life would I regret that I hadn't made the best of my life for me, would I look back and see other people had enjoyed a happy marriage etc and wish I had tried to get that, plus when your children are adults what would they think, I know I wouldn't have wanted my Mum to be unhappy so that I didn't come from a broken home.

Don't get me wrong the initial break up was hard, lots of emotions and guilt etc but a huge relief too that I was doing something positive for me and for the children. They were all young at the time (7, 5 and 3) but thats 7 years ago now and I know if I asked them now they would agree it was the right thing to do.

With regards to tax credits, I am now re-married but financially I was actually better off on my own with the children than I am now.

I look back on the time I was on my own with my children with fondness now, it was hard at times but actually if I am honest, one of the most happiest times of my life. I don't know how your H is with your children, but depending on what arrangements you would make they may actually be happier as they may spend some happy time with each parent rather than being in the middle of an unhappy marriage. Good luck with whatever you decide. x

I do believe strongly that when you have children, you owe it to them to do everything you can to make a marriage work. When you've done all you can, though (and it does need both parties to do their bit there, you can't mend a partnership single-handedly), if it really is not working, you are entitled to think of some other way of raising the children than being married to their father. Of course you must consider their needs as a priority, but that doesn't mean they always get exactly what they want. How to end a relationship responsibly, with decency and dignity, is likely to be just as important a life lesson to them as how to keep one going. They will also benefit from realising that parents are human beings before they have children and are, spookily enough, still human beings afterwards. At least you will be if you get the chance.

Sorry for the delay in replying (been busy with work), I really appreciate your replies.
Buttons99 thank you so much for your reply, when you split from your H your children were very similar in age to mine now. Given me lots of food for thought, thanks again.

Anniegetyourgun, I too believe that we owe it to our children to do everything we can, but the problem is, as you so rightly say, you can't mend a partnership single handedly.

I am convinced he is depressed, but he is so old school he would never in a million years do anything about it. Last night I insisted we talk, and offered him two choices - split up or have counselling and really try and tackle the issues once and for all. Almost immediately he said right then let's split up, because this life is shit. He then said how he hates his job, hates his life, but loves his kids, other than that life is just dull. Today I felt sad, but better because I felt that I could move on and have some direction. When I got in from work tonight he is trying really hard to talk to me and have a laugh and a joke with me, I swear to god he does not believe that I am being serious!!!! Argh!! I read out rental prices of houses to him tonight and he said (trying to be friendly jokey), Oh I'm staying here and we're going to be one big happy family!). Deep down I don't know even if I want to fix things and be a happy family, part of me thinks it's delaying the inevitable, part of me remembers why I did love him so much and why we've been together so long. And as I've said before, I feel too busy with day to day life to even have any clarity with my thoughts and feelings.

I am so grateful I found this forum, just venting and reading other people's posts has been so helpful and I have drawn so much support from it. Thank you so much for all your replies x