Depressed and alcoholic dh how do i help him?

[unyummy]

Dh told me last week that he is depressed, and has been going down for a while. He has cycles of depression so this is nothing new, they are often triggered and definitely tied up with him drinking. He agreed that drinking was making things worse.

Today i went out most of the day, called him at 6 and he was drunk. We have 2 dc, one is a new baby, and as his drinking has increased his involvement with the kids has decreased, I am getting up to do night feeds and then up early while he sleeps - sometimes as he is hungover sometimes as he is just down and tired. I was so angry today to find him drunk and with the house in a state, when i got home he said sorry and then " I need your help. I'm f*ed up" I told him i was too angry to discuss it or to be of any help to him while he was drunk and for him to go to bed as i was having to sort house and dinner out and he was just slumped at the table and i was furious with him for the state he was in. I said what do you want me to do and he said be a bit nicer to me - but really i am nice to him all the time until he pushes me with his selfishness.

We have been down this route before, he has been to AA sometimes and other times just stopped drinking and got himself out of it. This time i think he is in a real mess but i just dont think i have the strength to help him. What can i do? I do love him but he is such hard work and i just cant bear the idea of having one more dependent that i have to look after at the moment, as callous as that might sound. I know from reading al anon stuff that i cant make him stop drinking but i need some kind of practical solution while we try to work on things. Anyone help?

Snowkitten, oh no! . What happened? Please offload onto us if it'll help.

I had Christmas with my sister's family and my parents, which was lovely, but I missed DP. DP was at his mother's and didn't even text me. All is silence there. I'm trying not to feel hurt, just hoping that the talk they were hoping to have with him, may bear fruit. But if he couldn't even spare a few minutes to text 'Merry Christmas Darling', then I am not that optimistic.

Bloody, bloody bloody.

look at my other thread in mental health. you will see it there. so sorry for you, esp on xmas day. Mine was a disaster.

unyummy, I'm sorry to hear about what you're going through.

I come from a family that has a dysfunctional relationship with alcohol; and I have attended Al-Anon meetings. What I can say about detachment is that you can't detach by trying to detach. You detach by focusing on your life, health and wellbeing, rather than the alcoholic's, and then one day you realise you're one step further removed from it all ... then another step ... then another.

Detachment isn't something you do - it's something that happens as a result of your doing things for yourself. When it happens, you realise that it was slowly taking place in the background, while you were focusing on other things. It is a subtle but powerful process. Difficult to explain ... but you feel it when it happens!

Well i'm back. I had stopped posting as he stopped drinking over christmas, we had a long conversation in which he promised to stop, said he had realised what he was heading towards and that he loved us all too much to risk losing us etc etc. Hilariously i didnt want to post as i thought i might upset some of the kind people who have replied saying that they are in similar situations, as i thought it might look like i turn up, post about my problems and hey presto they are solved in a week!!

Anyway, he went to the docs, signed up for counselling for depression and addiction discussed aa etc and did online aa meetings. He got through the whole of christmas without drinking but then started again on NYE, we had people over and i knew it was going to be hard but didnt want to cancel. He didnt drink much, just a few glasses of champagne, but then he drank yesterday and ended up drunk and had the usual infuriating long lie in while i looked after kids this morning.

Today we went shopping, separated for me to go to shops, he took the kids to dinner and had a glass of wine, i just casually asked him when i got home and he said he had a glass, but would stop tomorrow - i then saw that he had finished one bottle that was left in the fridge from NYE. I said i know you've had more so please just tell me so i at least know what i'm dealing with. I went to bed and the last words were that he was coming soon too and would get up tomorrow to help me with kids and definitely stop tomorrow. I just woke up at 2.30 and he was still up and heard the front door go so i'm pretty sure he went out to get more drink (24 hr shops round here!!). I just said to him calmly that if he didnt get up tomorrow i would take the kids away with me to my dads until he stopped drinking. He came to bed but i cant sleep for thinking about it, i feel sick that he obviously cant control this as much as he knows he is risking. I dont want to go to my dads, i have a young baby and 4 year old and it's too hard. But i want to scare him into doing something. Maybe i should kick him out? I am trying my best to get on with it, have not been nagging him just gently asking if he has had a drink so i know what's what. He was so much better over christmas although he had massive problems sleeping and was ratty as a consequence, but still such a nicer person without drinking. I dont think i love the drinking version any more, his lack of control and general uselessness with dc disgusts and annoys me, and he is spiralling into depression. I have gone from feeling really hopeful and positive about the coming year to the total opposite.

unyummy

The only person you can help here is yourself along with your children. Not him.

You cannot scare him into doing anything re his drink problem. The 3cs re alcoholism apply - you cannot cure this or control this. You also did not cause this to arise.

Your man has no intention at all of giving up booze; he is quite happy to continue as he is. He was only able to stop drinking for a few days; also you only have his word for it that he has signed up for counselling and addiction issues. Talk is cheap, its actions and long term actions at that that matter. He told you what you wanted to hear from him. They are truly masters at manipulation of others and denial.

BTW as well make your house an alcohol free zone. If you do happen to drink alcohol with him stop this behaviour, this is only enabling him more.

When it comes to alcoholism the whole family need help and support, not just the alcoholic.

I was not at all surprised to subsequently read in your post that he had recommenced drinking alcohol; he has no intention at all of wanting to seek proper long term help for his drink problem. All that he said to you means nothing; actions in the long term speak far louder than words. You are his enabler now, you enable him by being there to clear up after him. Stop asking him too if he's had a drink, you will know anyway.

Perhaps you should kick him out as you write. You don't yourself have to move out, why should you when he is the one who has caused all this to arise in the first place.

Look at this problem another way too.
What are you both teaching your own children about relationships here?. Growing up in a household where one parent is an alcoholic brings the children their own set of problems. Your 4 year old is no doubt already aware that something is amiss but cannot put it into words. It will affect them as children markedly. This is NOT a legacy you want to leave them believe me.

The following is also going to be hard for you to have acceptance of:-
There are no guarantees here, he could lose everything and he could still drink. You cannot allow yourselves to be dragged down with him any more. You can save your own selves but you cannot rescue and or save someone who does not want to be saved. He has to want to help his own self, enabling him as you are doing will only prolong the agonies.

If you set an ultimatum you can only do so once and you have to follow it through. Making them repeatedly loses their power.

You need to talk to Al-anon, you need real life support too.

Thank you attila though that is so hard to read. I am going to a meeting tomorrow, and will try to call the helpline today in the meantime. The house is cleared of booze ( i had done this, stupidly, except for the bottle of wine in the fridge, i don't drink with him at home. I think you are right in all that you say apart from i know he has booked for counselling, he is not a very good liar for an addict. I am finding it so hard to contemplate the future though, i think i've been in denial about this for ages and i don't want to be a single parent - it's hard, as he's not that bad - just rubbish as opposed to abusive. But you're right, it's not a healthy relationship for me or for the kids to have as an example.

Out of interest and i hope you don't think i'm doubting your advice, are you a counselor or addicts partner? Or just a wise meerkat?!

Unyummy

Online AA meetings are aimed at people who genuinely cannot get to real meetings - by genuinely, I'm thinking lighthouse keepers and oil riggers, the medically housebound, convicts in some of the smaller prisons (the larger ones have meetings) and people who live in countries where AA is illegal (typically because alcoholism officially does not exist there.) It's not sounding like your husband ticks any of those boxes, so why isn't he going to real meetings? If he can brave the elements to get booze at 2.30 am he can sit in a church hall for 90 minutes.

This "i'll do it online" attitude reeks of "I'm special and different" which is a short cut to failure. Don't let him bullshit you any further - if he mentions AA again, get him out of the house to a real meeting with real people, face to face. Send him whether he's drunk or sober, we really don't mind.

Good luck!

S

(8 years in the fellowship, sober since Dec 16 2002, one day at a time)

Hello, i know this will probably sound like i'm a mug making excuses for him,maybe i am, but it was christmas week when all this happened and we had things on all week that we couldn't cancel plus small baby and 4 year old to look after, i saw it more like he was doing a virtual meeting as the next best thing?

Anyway i'm pleased to say he did go to a real life meeting this evening, and came back happy that he'd been and enthusiastic for going back . I know that he is capable of doing this, i feel a bit like people are assuming he's bullshitting me when he hasnt been - i mean not about things like docs appointments, signing up for counselling etc. I totally accept that he is capable of lying and that he has done, and it's an addicts' nature, but i dont find it helpful to assume that everything he says is rubbish. I want to believe in him, not to suspect him of lying about trying to get better. Do people think this is naive of me?

Sorry if I seem to have been accusing you of anything. I think I meant more that he does not appear to be being honest with himself, in the sense that he does not see his problem as meriting doing AA (or an alternative) properly. A lot of alcoholics also end up lying without meaning to (typically by being manipulative) because the alternative of facing the truth and its consequences is so unpalatable.

A virtual meeting is great if one canno get to a real meeting. But I try to remind myself, where my own behaviour is concerned, that, as I managed to get to the pub or the off-license (or both) on a regular basis back in the day, it doesn't really wash for me to say that I can't get to at least one meeting a week. I would also say that, booked up someone may be, but he could have gone to a real meeting when he had a lie-in, or when he was already out of the house seeing the doctor ... You can fill in the gaps yourself. In all but the tiniest communities (I am guessing you are in the UK) there will be at least one or two meetings in the day time and early evening within striking distance. If someone wants a meeting, there will usually be a meeting they can get to. It mainly depends on how much they want it and how willing they are to put themselves out to the same degree as they did in order to drink.

All of this is not to say that you are naive or a mug or that he is a liar or a bad man ... Just that, where drink is involved, you can bet your life that he has developed finely honed skills for presenting part of the truth as if it is all of the truth. I know, because I was the same, and I was so good I even fooled myself sometimes.

It is fantastic that he has been to a real meeting tonight and long may that continue. It really can work, for the drinker and for the family behind the drinker. I really hope it works for your family too.

PS can't remember if I said this before, but I am a man. If, by any chance, you are in the London area, let me know if I can help your husband in any way.

Hi MIFLAW i know you werent accusing me it's not just you there have been many comments on the thread assuming that he was lying about everything from making a docs appointment to having arranged counselling. I know he did genuinely do these things and i'm just quite saddened by the way that people seem to think you should treat everything an alcholic says with suspicion. I dont want to live my life like that but also i worry that perhaps i have been naive and denying the real problem as it has come and gone over the years. He did attempt to lie that he hadnt had a drink yesterday when he had, but very quickly confessed.

He has been to NA and AA before and they have helped, and he has friends who are clean and have gone through either or both programme. He hates it, but he does recognise that it works and that he needs support to stop. I am going to an al anon meeting tomorrow too, this is the first time in all the years of him drinking that i've done this, i'll let you know how i get on. Thanks for your words its always good to hear from someone out the other side.

If I have or can help in any way, you're welcome.

I'm afraid that the suspicion comes with the territory but it is important to remember that alcoholism is a recognised illness (by BMA and WHO) and your husband is an ill man. As AA and NA will tell him, he's not a bad man trying to get good, he's a sick man trying to get well.

The main reason people fail in AA or NA is that, once they've stopped drinking, they stop attending. Then they either forget what it was like and drink/use again, or else they don't deal with all the stuff that made them drink and end up bittr, mad people. Try to help your husband not be one of those unfortunates.

I have at times found it useful to think to myself, I'll just attend AA and do what they suggest till I have a better idea. 8 years on, I am sober, happy ... and still no better ideas in sight!