Has anyone represented themselves in court??

[SwannMum]

I'm due in court next month over my ex's access to our child. I've written about the background in another thread, but basically to sum up in brief, he walked out when our son was 10 weeks old after throwing at Moses basket at me while I was breastfeeding. I went out of my way to try and get him to bond with our son under very difficult conditions. Namely his aggressive behaviour towards me. Not physical abuse, but I found the way he used language very intimidating and he threatened not to bring our son back, using the fact he was on the birth certificate, therefore with equal parental reponsibility and there would be nothing the police could do about it... he's a copper himself so knows the law inside out apparently. In the end, what finally did it was our son's behaviour. He became extremely upset when he saw his father. Started crying in a way I'd never seen before. (He was at nursery by then and never cried, so it couldn't have been clinginess). What I found disturbing was the fact the ex refused to acknowledge this at all. I found it all very disturbing. This is all very much a potted version, there's a number of issues, but this is just a quick overview.

I don't actually think he's fundamentally bothered about our son. I actually found him on a dating profile a couple of weeks after he'd left saying he hadn't got any children and wasn't sure if he wanted any. But his mother is very domineering and I reckon she's the one behind the court proceedings. I honestly think he would have just vanished otherwise.

Anyway, next month we are due in court. I work (on an indecently low salary) so don't unfortunately qualify for legal aid and cannot raise any more money to pay solicitors' fees. So far I've spent around £3000 and the solicitor said that court costs very quickly escalate out of control and to expect in the region of £10000, which I simply have not got. As such I have no choice other than to represent myself which is absolutely shit but there really is no alternative option... it's situations like this which show the failings of the system . I just feel really scared about the situation. I'm going to be up against a solicitor or a barrister and really I'm not sure if I stand much chance. The facts remain the same and I do have 'evidence' of my concerns in the forms of doctors' records (about his porn addiction), dating profile (stating how he likes to drink several times a week)and pictures of the magic mushrooms he grew. But obviously I just feel very much out of my depth so... HELP!

Has anyone been through anything similar and if so, how can I prepare? Just for clarity, I don't want to stop the ex's contact at all... far from it. I grew up with a father and want my son to have a good relationship with his. But there are conditions that I want putting down which I do feel are in the best interests of my child. i.e. the fact I don't want him to have access in evenings or at the weekend when he gets absolutely twatted.

SwannMum, I don't know anything which can be helpful in your situation but felt that it needs to be bumped.

CandyK

am going through court myself,but with legal aid

however,get yourself a mckenzie friend...google it...

also,i have to say,alot of what you mentioned may not be of any use in court....the drinking,etc....can all be argued away.adults are allowed to drink...you need to pick your battles very carefully

you maybe will need cafcass involvement

Swannmum, I have very little to add, except that in my limited experience courts look on those who represent themselves with kindness and compassion, and the bottom line is that this is about the best interests of your ds, which should be the overarching principal. Best of luck, you'll be brilliant because you love him, let us know how you go.

SwannMum,

First, please check out all the places you might get a lawyer for free (pro bono) like the Bar's Free Representation Unit, any similar Law Society scheme or law firms(some of the bigger ones run voluntary schemes staffed by trainees and juniors). Citizen's Advice may know more.

Secondly, perhaps you could pay for a last consultation to help you prepare for court? If you can do this, make sure you cover what papers to put in and how to present them, how to make written submissions and how to marshall your arguments.

Thirdly, make sure you maintain civilised contact with your ex's lawyers (however you feel about them inside) as the court will expect you to liaise on practical arrangements, exchange of documents etc. If you feel they have not behaved properly at any time draw it to the court's attention straight away, by e-mail or fax if necessary.

Maybe start by writing down what you think is a good outcome for your son and a fair arrangement with your ex then argue from there.

I don't know anything about family law so can't be any more specific, but I do wish you good luck. It might be worth posting in Legal.

Other than what has already been said.
go in and leave your emotions at the court room door. you will be in there to represent your dc's best interests.
have bullet pointed notes with a clear objective . ie you want cafcass involvement , or no over night stays etc and very clear non emotional reasons why. keep these short and to the point. keep copies of any paperwork eveidence that backs your arguement up to hand if you are asked for it.

most of this should be dealt with in the meeting before you go into the actual court room. Also be prepared for a little comprimise, even if it is under your terms in the best interest for dc.

I represented myself for exactly the same reasons that you are doing.. and got what I needed for the dc's.

there will be water provided for you.. if you feel yourself drying up have a sip of water. Litene to what is being said, think about how you'd like to respond, and respond in a clear considered manner. they will take allowences for the fact that you are representing yourself, as long as you don't get all over emotional.

Great, thank you. Wish me luck and pray that I don't burst into tears and end up looking like Alice Cooper in there... had to speak to CAFCASS on the phone the other week and was only about five minutes into the conversation before crying... am S.C.A.R.E.D but fundamentally also feel very much that I'm doing the right thing by my child. I just want him to grow up happy in a safe environment. Not sure if his father will ever "grow up" (God, I hate that expression, so patronising but Peter Pan syndrome is the only way to describe it) and stop being so aggressive and threatening towards me. Because another 18 years of that sort of behvaiour is a very daunting prospect. I sort of wish there was some sort of behaviour modification programme you could put parents who so far have failed their children. There's a good idea for Dragon's Den.

Very best of luck to you, SwannMum. Give 'em heck. Have the important points written down, and consult your notes to give yourself a quick break if you feel you're getting too emotional.

Thats a terrible situation but he is a copper?? OMG I would have hoped that in his position he would be more responsible, perhaps that is narrow minded of me.

I think you just need to get as much evidence and material as you can, try lots of research on the laws involved.

What a shit.

Hi,

I self represented in the family courts about 9 ish yrs ago now. I used a barrister for the very last bit but my case really was very complicated so that part was unavoidable.

I'm at work at the moment but I'm happy to talk to you via email/msn or similar about it if you think it would help. I don't particularly wish to post all the details on here for obvious reasons.

I will CAT you my email address now and leave it up to you whether or not you wish to contact me.

Do what everyone who has advised getting legal aid has said. Google free legal aid. There are ins and outs in court procedures, and protocols -- it can be very intimidating and things can move extremely fast.

If you can't get free legal aid, try going to the court beforehand and speaking to the clerk of the court where the hearing will be about the way things will proceed, what you need to do wrt signing in, your case number, where you should sit, what documents you will need, any forms you should have filled in, etc.

I really, really advise writing everything down neatly -- you can ask the judge if you can consult your notes when you speak.

But even moreso, I advise finding a legal representative. Try McKenzie Friend, Women's Aid, Law Society -- leave no stone unturned.

Swannmum, well done you. I'm glad you found some informed advice here. I have no experience of this sort of thing so wasn't going to reply. Having done a few quick searches on your recommendations above, though - and found that you probably can drum up some free legal assistance - I wanted to encourage you to get as much professional help and/or coaching as you can.

My father was a policeman and he could twist the legal system around to achieve his own ends, without thinking very hard about it all. He had to learn great swathes of law (as I'm sure you know), word for word, and there's also the fact that they frequently give evidence in court and have all the language at their fingertips.

Family courts are a different matter - much more sympathetic and informal - however, I represented myself at a family court against a lawyer, a couple of years ago. The judge then told us he was extremely sympathetic to me and if he could he'd find in my favour (!!) But my opponent was correct on a point of law; I didn't have enough specialised knowledge to win the case. Courts, remember, are about law which is not always the same as 'natural' justice

I realise you're short of time and the last thing I want to do is make you even more stressed. If you can drum up some expert support, though, so much the better.

Tell the court about your DC crying, of course ... GOOD LUCK!!! xxx

Swannmum, I think going to get advice from Womens Aid could be helpful for you. They often help women in situations where an abusive ex-partner is seeking access to the children. A worker may also be able to go to court with you to give you some moral support.

Throwing a moses basket at you while you were breastfeeding your baby IS physical abuse, and an extremely serious incident. Not only could he have hurt you, but he could also have seriously hurt his child.

I think it's VERY important that you mention this incident in court.

Best of luck. Sending you loads of moral support.

SM, if you think you might cry in court, make sure you get something down in writing to hand in to the judge with a copy for your ex. That way, if you are too upset to continue speaking you will still have got your points across in written form.

The worst time is just before you go into court, so it will be worth having a calming, sensible relative or friend to wait with you (and there is ALWAYS a lot of waiting). Once you are in, the adrenaline kicks in and you will just get into it.

One last tip: take your time when speaking. You don't need permission to refer to notes, and you can always pause to gather your thoughts. Barristers do both those things as a matter of course. The worst thing is rushing through your points because of nerves, or gabbling. Deep breaths, don't be rushed by anyone. Do not stop speaking until you are absolutely certain you have covered everything you want to cover.

Adding to what a previous poster has said, having a McKenzie Friend with you can be very helpful.

don't forget rescue remedy, laughable to some but i swear by it.
and best of luck, go and show that court room the courageous woman and bloody great parent that you are

I also represented myself in court for the same reasons as you. He had a barrister. My nerves were gone but the court were very good. You can write down everything first and hand it to the judge when you first go in so that you don't have to speak to the judge to explain your situation, which might make you nervous. CAB might be able to help you with this. I did pay for a solicitor to help me write out my letter for court.
I stopped access over his inability to keep to set times and holidays. He went away with OW when he should have been taking time off with the DC's.
The court made him set actual dates when he would have the children over holidays and put in the order that OW should not see DC's until proper access with the DC's had been establised. They told him it would be 6 months before he should introduce her! Made my day!

Court has now been adjorned upon Copper's wishes. I'd agreed to let him see our baby under supervised contact but because of the snow it has been cancelled and by the time of court, he would only have had two visits with our baby. So it's been postponed for another month so a good number of contacts will have been made. (another month of nervous twitching for me)

He texted me asking if I'd sign papers saying he could take photos. I said I didn't have a problem in principle but obviously that's not the main priority. The main priority is to make our baby feel happy and secure in his company... which should be his priority when our baby was refusing to eat and was crying hysterically for the entire time Copper came round.

The photo thing will be his mother. I still think if it was up to him he would have just disappeared. Which is really rubbish. I want my child to have a father and have said that all along.

The scary thing is that because he's on the birth certificate, he has equal parental responsibility which does actually mean that he could follow through with his threats and not bring him back. i.e. he would be within his legal rights. He'd obviously looked into this because he pretty much quoted the law to me in legal speak. If I phoned the police (i.e. HIM!), they would not be able to return my baby without a court order. And you can't get a court order 'just in case'. I find that worrying. I jst find it immensely stressful to think that I'm going to have to deal with him on a weekly basis again for the next 16 or so years. It really does make me feel panicky. I like the idea of equal parental responsibility in theory (as am sure there are as many mental mothers out there as there are mental fathers) but in practice, in a case such as mine, it doesn't really work.

If we go to a full on court case where you have to present evidence, his emails and text messages often 'look' reasonable but it is a completely different picture in the flesh. I am so naive because really that's probably why he never answered his phone to 'collect' evidence for his case. Although,with the exception of calling his mother an arsehole I haven't done anything wrong. I did find him on a second dating profile though saying he liked drinking 'several times a week' and was looking for someone who liked similar, so single ladies out there who are scouring the net for a prospective partner... take care!

I have decided to date again. Nothing serious. Jesus no, but it's nice to see that there are nice men out there! This experience could have turned me into a full on man hater if I wasn't careful, so since I have a son (whom I want to grow up happily sane with no issues) I felt I needed to get to grips with my own issues.

Thank you for all your postings. They are really helpful. I'll keep this updated just in case anyone goes through anything similar.

Swannmum - IF your Ex did ever refuse to return your child after contact, you would need to make application for a Residence Order in your favour. This is the new name for "custody" and if granted would mean that by order of the court, your child's permanent home would be with you. Interim Residence Orders can be made whilst awaitng the hearing for a full Residence Order.

In my experience these kind of fathers don't actually want the responsibility of their children and as you say he isn't really that interested, sounds like a bit of huffing and puffing maybe encouraged by his mother. So I would try not to worry about events that haven't yet happened and are unlikely to happen. You sound very balanced about the need for your child to grow up having contact with his father. As others have said, so long as you keep the child's best interests at heart and do not indulge in any "point scoring" re your Ex you should get a sympathetic hearing in the courts. Judges get annoyed with couples who are only interetsed in "slagging each other off" and trying to score points, and not taking into account the needs of the child, which is what these cases are all about.

yes focus on child's best interests - but you would need to show you concerned about his behaviour around the child - the fact he lies on dating websites, well - doesnt everyone?

my ex represented himself but ended up paying £360 per time to a "mckenzie friend" - i guess

a "profrssional" "friend"??? so be careful who you ask - but as far as i can see a mckenzie friend can be anyone you chose, so doesnt have to be a "profressional" mckenzie friend. look it up...

my solicitor was not much more in fact.
because we only had hearings total costs this year for two hearings around £1200. got final order at last hearing as he didnt turn up...

now moving to financial stuff tho so more costs as need a barrister - but as is financil ther eshould be some money a t end of it hopefully coming from sale of property.

Just wondered how you got hold of "doctors' records (about his porn addiction)" . Cheers mate!

just stumbled onto this thread and i could have written it! down to the copper ex and mother being behind wanting contact.
I had the same crap as you, but he was always very careful no text or evidence of his behaviour.
When i went to court i applied for a residence order in response to his contact order. I stated i thought he may not return him once contact was unsupervised. He gave the i'm a policeman bullshit in return, but i was very persistant i needed 'peace of mind'. I used it to bargain really they got my agreement to unsupervised and i got my interim residency.
Mines gone to court 4 times so far with contact being gradually increased each time, usually agreed outside court through sol.
Final contested hearing next month AARRGGHH!
Good luck xx

Hi could you please contact me i am planning to represent myself and final hearing is in Jan..
I am respondent and my case is about relocation and children living with me.
He is a policeman and mummys boy .
I had 5 hearings. 2 represented myself and 3 barristers which were okay.
But i want to represent myself as i agree you know your case more than anyone and all you have to tell is truth.
Section 7 report is done she supports children to live with me and find relocating finely balanced but want court to decide.
I need help with position statements.