when do you draw the line with toxic PIL's ?

[ShanBrod]

Im really struggling with if i should cut my PIL out of my life due to their constant strain on my marriage and my emotions since i got married 9 months ago but been together 10 years. I honestly thought i had a good relationship with my MIL(although difficult at times)and had her looking after the children 2 afternoons for 4 hours while i and DH worked(they offered this)so can only think her actions towards me since marrying DH are a jealousy of me or hatred

To give some back ground as to why im thinking this way below is a list of things that have really upset me since i got married and has me really wondering if PIL are really needed in my and my childrens life.

1. FIL used to call me fat arse which upset me as it was done in front of others and i once rang MIL to hear him refer to me as "fat arse is on the phone".I had addressed my upset about this especially since my 5 year old started calling me it.

2.We bought our first home and invited both family,grandparents & friends to our housewarming which they didn't attend as "Its not MIL scene hanging with young couples".

1. At our wedding they turned up 50mins late to the reception even though the church & reception next to each other and all guests arrived on time They did put in money for the wedding 2k which i was very gratful for but never got us a congratulations card or did any speaches at our wedding.

4.We all went on holiday together with Us,PIL,BIL & SIL after our wedding and two times while following them by car FIL drove off so fast we lost them in traffic and they rang 30mins later to see where we were once they arrived(FIL told us to follow him)
We were angry by this stage so didn't contact them to see what their plans were and we did our own thing, that night we went over to BIL/SIL room to find out that they were all going out for dinner together as PIL/BIL/SIL were leaving the next day and we hadn't even been invited! The next morning they all got up and left without even calling,coming up to our room(same hotel) or sayinfg goodbye to their grandchildren who were expecting to see them before they left.

5.We didn't talk when we got back for 8 weeks due to this as I and DH were so angry with their behaviour that i finally rang and asked what is going on with them and why they did the things to which i coped a mouthful of abuse calling me a greedy who expects DH to do everything around the house,She bagged my parents as not contributing to the wedding money which was untrue as they had given us the same amount i just never told PIL as its none of there business. I take all DH money and thats why he hides it from me(this is from years ago when DH was hiding money in a horse racing account) and just general nasty comments about my relationship,wedding,children and my personal character.

6.After the 8+ weeks of not talking we threw them an olive branch and phoned(FIL answered) and invited them over christmas morning to see the kids to which MIL text back later that they were not coming over but DH & the kids could come over to their house which DH declined.
Then at easter they invited all the family to their house for good friday but not us, when DH rang to ask why FIL told him to Fuck off and hung up on him(lucky i was at work).
FIL then 10 mins later turned up on our door step to apoligised and DH ask him why they were acting so nasty and cold and he felt they just didn't give a shit to which FIL responded thats not the case at all and saying that I am the one with the problem with them.Their excuse for not inviting us to easter was they thought we must of been busy but remembered to invite their other 2 sons.

7.DH turned 30 just before christmas and PIL never even rang or got him anything for his birthday.

I really don't know where to go from here as their behaviour has been a constant upset for me and for the last 9 months caused nothing but constant fighting between I & DH to the point of me wanting to seperate just to escape them, i feel nothing has really been sorted with anything and they just blame me for causing trouble in the family and hating them. I feel they are so sly with DH and different people when they talk to him when im not around that DH sometimes feels sorry for them.
I really don't want these toxic people in my life anymore or our marriage as im sick of being in tears over them and watching my marriage detoriate due to there constant slyness with DH and MIL playing me off against DH, I feel like im fighting his mother for his affection.

Oh this really is a messy........any wise words would be helpful please

I think you need to lower your expectations too, and stop sulking and ignoring them. It seems rather childish.

Miggsie- I can relate to the eczema thing as that is exactly what MIL said about my kids skin and my mothering skills.

2Rebecca- I agree some of the things could of been a misunderstanding but to happen so often one after the other left us wondering if it was now being deliberatly done out of spite towards us. With Christmas we rang them a week before to ask if they would like to see the kids christmas morning as we knew they were going out at lunch to wich DH got a text back.

I know i need to lower my expectations and i've slowly come to the realization they will do anything to cause a fight between I & DH.I've resorted to ignoring them as if i show a response to there behaviour they run a mile with it so i no longer bother playing the game.

I had another incident on the weekend where MIL was sent an invite to a baby shower for me but "forgot" to tell me
I still attended once i found out from the host the day before and just kept away from MIL yet she still started so i ended up leaving with my DD when i saw my escape.

DH has seen how his parents are in all this and does agree with me they have been far from accepting of me but i get the feeling when hes around his mother he just sits and listens to her belittle me instead of fighting my corner and telling her shes wrong. DH is more of a sit back,listen & agree person rather then an answer back & set the record straight person.I think its all just to hard for him to be honest so he would rather we just sort it out between us and he has little involvement.He avoids any confrontation with them unless he really has to say something.

I will say I do feel that our marriage could be over in the next 12 months if this continues as even though i love DH dearly i feel i have lost some respect for him when it comes to his mother and his lack of input.

Another thing that makes me feel these actions are not a missunderstanding is when i confronted MIL about the dinner invite and the driving off on us MILs response was and i quote "Your only pissed off Shanbrod because you wern't the centre of attrention anymore as your wedding was over"

Do people really think im over reacting? Please tell me as i have honestly wondered if i am the problem here but maybe can't see it

Hang in there ShanBrod with regards to you marriage. I have been in a very similar situation and I don't know how I managed to stick at it but somehow I did. DH and I have now come out the other side bigger and better and stronger than ever but believe me it wasn't without going through at least a 18 months which was the worst time of my life.

We lived next door to PIL before we got married (I know,I know, what on earth were we thinking!). MIL used to make snide comments to me when no one else was around, we rented our house from them and had a proper tenancy agreement but PIL would only put DH's name on it not mine too, they would change the rules all the time so we never knew if we were coming or going. Mil even hid behind a bush once to avoid me and would ignore me all the time. When we got engaged MIL was in a serious strop for a couple of weeks and was really nasty during that time. She is a real attention seeker and would relish DH and FIL's attention. If she didn't get enough she would get in a strop and then DH would go around to their house and spend hours there trying to find out what was wrong!!

Things came to a head when one Christmas MIL's sister came to stay and my parents came to stay with us. MIL's sister had taken an instant dislike to me anyway (hmm wonder what info she'd been fed prior to meeting me?). FIL invited us and my parents for drinks on boxing day. We went and MIL and MIL's sister (although to be fair it was mainly the sister) were so rude to me and my parents making it perfectly clear that me and my parents weren't welcome that my parents left and went home even though they were supposed to be staying with us another night. DH and I had the mother of all rows and I told him I wanted to move but he point blank refused. I spoke to my dad about it and he was ready to help me and my DC's find somewhere on our own and put the deposit down for me, but the stubborn side of me wouldn't let PIL win, because I knew that I would be playing right into there hands by leaving. I stayed but I definitely can say that at that point I really didn't like DH very much and I certainly had no respect for him.

Things quietened down for a few months after that until one night I came home to find DH sat in the dark drinking whisky and immediately told me that we were moving!! Apparently FIL had come around whilst I was out and proceeded to slag me off to DH (and infront of DC's). I had landed on my feet and if I didn't buck my ideas up I could move out!!

When we found somewhere new to live, Dh told his parents and FIL stormed around to our house and started shouting and pointing his finger at me. He was calling me names. I was blamed for everything. DH just sat there and didn't say a word. Now that took me a while to get over because I had nightmares for 2 weeks after that event because it frightened the life out of me, I'd never had a man shout at me and be so aggressive towards me before. I started suffering from panic attacks and still suffer from them to this day. But the hardest thing to get over was the fact that DH just sat there and let his father shout at me and call me names. I do believe that it's how people make up for their mistakes that counts and luckily DH came up trumps. He demanded an apology from FIL, he apologised to DH but point blank refused to apologise to me, so when we moved DH cut contact with them and made it perfectly clear to them that he wouldn't budge until he had an apology from them.

It's been over 2 years now and the apology has never and I guess will never come. Only now there are more things to add to the list. Like PIL trying to ruin our wedding, making sure that everyone knew they weren't happy about Dh marrying me and causing such an awful atmosphere it was embarrassing. FIL wouldn't even stand near to me to have a photo taken!

I have to say that our lives are so much better now that PIL are out of our lives. When we moved house away from them our arguing more or less stopped and our relationship is fantastic now. Looking back I now realise how depressed I was because PIL made me feel like I was nothing. Nothing to them and not good enough for their son. I even contemplated suicide at one stage. It was awful and I never want to go back to that place.

If DH wants a relationship with them that's fine by me. They are his parents after all but I want nothing to do with them. They have made it clear on many occasions that they do not like me (well they've told me to my face) and I will never be welcome in their family so I get the message loud and clear!!! It's just sad for DH that his parents hate such a big part of his life.

Just hang in there ShanBrod, your DH is worth it. Don't forget that your DH has been brought up by these people and will be oblivious to their behaviour. The hardest thing for my DH was seeing them in a completely different light because they'd only been loving towards him and very controlling but he didn't realise it at the time because that was what was 'Normal' to him.

Hi Shan

Re this comment made by mampam:-

"Just hang in there ShanBrod, your DH is worth it. Don't forget that your DH has been brought up by these people and will be oblivious to their behaviour. The hardest thing for my DH was seeing them in a completely different light because they'd only been loving towards him and very controlling but he didn't realise it at the time because that was what was 'Normal' to him"

I would totally agree with the above. Your DH has been conditioned (yes I would use that word) by these people to accept your ill treatment at their hands as somehow normal, its what he's used to and that is his "normality". It will hit him very hard when he does realise the full enormity of what they are doing. My guess is that he's never had to challenge their authority before now because they've never let him do so.

If you separate or divorce they will win. Do not give them the satisfaction, this is exactly what they want!!!. BTW its not you, they would have acted the same regardless of whom your H married.

Such families like your H's are truly dysfunctional; they do not and will never play by the "normal" rules of family behaviour. Coming as you likely do from a background where all this toxic crap within the family unit did not happen, all this is very alien and difficult for you. It's also very difficult for your H as well.

Your H's parents will never take any responsibility for their actions oe even say sorry; a typical toxic parent type response is that shown in Point 6 of your original post. Infact all their actions in your original posts were done out of sheer spite towards you and your family. They hate you you see because you're a "threat" to them.

I would hazard a guess that one or both of his parents has an untreated personality disorder.

BTW did you read the book called Toxic Inlaws that I recommended?. You need to. This is equally your H's problem as well as your own; he cannot take a back seat any more. You both have to stand firm and protect your children from their malign influence.

I can so relate to everything its like reality of the situation has hit me in the face
Since the baby shower im now so over it all i just can't be bothered with wanting an explaination,Shes out to bring me down to her level and im just not playing the game hence her throwing me off course with the Baby shower invite, She said to DH she felt awful about forgetting the invite for me and she hopes i don't think she deliberatly didn't give it to me but she never even approached me at the baby shower to say shes sorry or it wasn't done intentionally(especially after all the other things we have spoken to her about in my first post)
she was just her plain cocky self trying to out do me again with everything..... but i got my suttle revenge by leaving when DD ran outside so i had to go while she was over the other side of the room.

If we could sell our house and move i honestly would but we have only owned our house 2 years. We have not heard from the IL's since i saw her last weekend and life has been calm all week(funny about that) but im waiting for the call or message to DH.

AttilaTheMeerkat - I've been looking for that book in shops(im in Aussie) but will need to order it online i think.

And with the disfunctional family MILs sister who has a brain injury is totally rude to me at family gatherings calling me lazy,useless etc...so i know shes been fed by MIL.
They are the type of family who are always fighting with someone in the family and MIL older brother & wife never come to family functions or see DH cousins as they just keep away from MIL's side(I wonder why)
DH grandfather(MIL's dad) is the type to hold grudges for years unless he receives an apology or the other person gives into his demands.

ShanBrod, are they still babysitting for you whilst you are at work?

No we have not had them babysit since the wedding disaster and they have not offered either,we now use childcare or DH & I work around each others shifts. DD did sometimes go stay on a saturday night occasionally but that has also stopped which DD(6) has noticed and asked why to which i respond that nan is really busy lately on weekends.
I do feel bad for the relationship with the children as DD loved spending time with her but i also don't want DD coming home repeating things they have said about me either in front of her or to me directly. I will not allow DH to go there alone with DC as i feel thats exactly what shes wanting and it causes more division between I and DH. DH will also not say anything to her if she does start on about me in front of the children.

I think you're doing the right thing, stick to your guns, they sound awful