Not sure I can cope with stubborn husband any more....MASSIVE row about a nosebleed FFS!

[FluffyHamster]

we had a MASSIVE row today about a friggin' NOSEBLEED of all things!

DS (6) has had a few recently, and last time he had one I saw DH getting him to tilt his head back.Ds was getting all panicky about the blood running down his throat, so I stepped in and told DH that this wasn't how you handle nosebleeds - should be head tilted forwards to let blood run out etc so child doesn't vomit. Anyway he went all huffy on that occasion, saying that was what he'd always done/ hadn't harmed him etc etc.

Thing is I work in health (although not a nurse etc) and I have done first aid courses etc, so it's not as if I don't have some reason to know what I'm talking about.

Later on I showed DH our children's first aid book, saying 'look - things have changed, and this is now the recommended way to handle nosebleeds, OK'.

Then today DS has another one, and I find DH with him HOLDING HIS HEAD BACK again, with DS getting increasingly hysterical about the blood in his throat etc.

I just lost it with DH. WHY would he do this, when we'd had a conversation about ti previously. He just kept saying 'well there's more than one way to do things'/ 'it's what my mother always did'.../ 'never did me any harm'/ it's what I've always done, and it works etc etc.

He simply WOULD NOT accept and acknowledge that I might know better than him on this one. It's like he COULDN'T acknowledge that he might be 'wrong' or at least out-of-date.

I simply cannot understand why he would be so stubborn about something affecting DS's health (albeit in a minor way on this occasion).

When I took over he then started making snide comments about 'oh yes, you've got to do it Mummy's way, I'm afraid DS....'

When I asked him why he'd done the same thing as last time, even after we'd talked about it, he just kept saying 'there was no evidence it was better' and I needed to prove it.

I can't believe how angry this has made me. It's a petty example, but similar to a whole load of similar examples -

• he really is a stubborn prat
• he will not accept that I am ever correct about anything
• once he's 'made his point' he will NEVER step back and say 'OK, maybe I was wrong'.

I feel like leaving him tonight

He went thinking it was me that needing fixing. He genuinely thought that as he was always in the right the counsellor would see this and agree with him. I think hamster's dh and my dp are very similat. He also knew that if he did not go we had not future.

Mistlethrush - I was just about to post with the same thing!

DH really doesn't seem to realise how significant this is - i.e. a type of bullying really.

Later today he was talking about getting architects roudn to discuss an extension, and all I was thinking was "I can't imagine continuing to live in this house with you if you keep treating me like this"

Twinset - did you have some really big 'bust up' which meant that you had to begin to do something different?

I don't want to split up at all, I just want (back?) my husband who loves and respects me and stops playing mind games!

Hamster - its not just for you though - its for your child (children) too - would you want your ds growing up to think that this is the way that husbands should speak to and act around their wives.

yes we disagreed over dd walking to horseriding, there is a thread on here about it. It had been brewing for a few years though, my mum came on holiday with us and was shocked at the way dp spoke to me and how I was clearly frightened of him. She said i needed to do something about it for dd sake.

I agree mistlethrush I realised that while I may have thought I did not deserve any better than a bullying partner my dd did deserve better.

I also made him read a thread on here where mumsnetters were telling me that he was a bully, he went absolutely ballistic and walked out, but from then on small changed started happening. I will try and find the thread.

[[http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk?topicid=relationships&threadid=544897-am-i-victim-of-abuse-or-is-it-al l-in#11122587 here I namechanged for the thread but I am the OP}}

Sorry haven't read all of the thread. Can't be depressed can he? Just a thought?

twinset

didn't see your last posts but my question still remains (it might be inappropriate?)

sorry my old thread is here

It is not my dp this time, thanks God!

Sorry if I go against the flow here. OP, I totally understand how hard it must be for you. I think my DH and I were stuck in the same rut for a while. However I did have the clarity to see that I did nag him and was a bit of a control-freakin wanting it just so when it wasn't a question of life and death. I think it came at a time when I was adjusting to being a SAHM and the only way to keep in control was to control him and wanting things done my way.

I appreciate the issues with the over-dose and clearly there needs to be a very one way chat about that but you know, you do sound like you pick him up on things all the while -no offense-, but no one likes to be told what to do all the while and how they're doing it wrong, etc. Also, the snidey comments he makes in front of your dc have to stop immediately, no doubt about it. It's hurtful and does nothing for your dc!

I agree with other posters that there's much more to it than these back and forth comments. Clearly your husband's obstinate behaviour is a result from being picked up on stuff all the while and he's getting defensive and then offensive making these hurtful comments directed at you.

To get respect you also have to give it and I think both you and he should sit down and talk about how you feel at the moment and what you want from the other one. If you don't break this vicious circle, it'll only get worse.

FWIW, I think sometimes we are too quick to tick people off as being depressed or manipulative/abusive, etc. Try to find out more before you stick a label on someone just because the going gets tough.

Tilting your head back when you have a serious nosebleed can be very scary. I can remember my father doing this when I was about 12 or so (I also had a series of nosebleeds), and the blood clotted in my throat and a really struggled to breathe. I can still remember completely panicking about it, and the relief when I clawed the clot out and could breathe again. My mother told me to always lean forwards, so I don't think that that piece of advice is particularly new (I don't know why my father was looking after me tbh, very unusual).

On the arguing front, dh and I do this too. We are both very opinionated and stubborn, and not very good at backing down, but you do have to learn both how to back down, and how to allow the other person to do so graciously.

I think nooka has just used a really good word: graciously.

We all like to keep our dignity intact. Maybe allowing your DH to reconsider is a better way to get him to agree rather than telling him off like a teacher. Your his wife, not his Mum

Do you ever say you were wrong, and back down? It's good if you can model the behaviour you want to see.

That being said, he sounds deeply deeply insecure. The idea of admitting wrong, of admitting fault, obviously terrifies him.

I'd think Relate, or solo counselling for him (unlikely, I know!) are the only likely fixes.

Yes the op should make sure to behave graciously towards her husband whilst he upsets and scares their child by forcing him to do things in a medical emergency that he knows are ill advised. She should make it easier for him to back down when he accuses her of causing him to overdose their child because he cannot be expected to listen or behave with basic care and attention

Bullshit. He needs to be man enough to be able to admit that he is wrong occasionally. Dancing around a bully in the way suggested is counter productive - it just confirms to them that their feelings must be considered paramount in all situations.

So, Dee, do you think that day in day out telling him what to do and how to do it and bollocking him when it doesn't happen is healthy for a relationship?

No one is disputing the fact the the over-dose is a serious issue that leaves no space for discussion. My opinions are different on the nose-bleed, I agree head forward is the correct way to handle it these days but I grew up tilting my head back and I'm still okay. If it scares a child it will automatically refuse to hold the position and it doesn't say in the OP that the DH forced the child.

If you are married you should consider the other parent's view and maybe not be so aggressive about getting him/her to comply(I'm not saying the OP is, but your post seems to suggest aggressions is the only way forward). No one suggests Hamster should kiss her DHs arse, but rather be an adult, model good behaviour and expect it back.

I dont think you can tiptoe round people's feelings when you are talking about you dc's well being.

Nose bleeds can look horrific, my ds suffers from random nose bleeds even has them in his sleep sometimes and looks like a stuck pig when he is having one. Your dh may be stressed by the blood and if your son is feeling distressed.
Titing heads forward when having a nose bleed is current first aid advice for good reason. if the blood goes down the throat it can easily make the sufferer nauseus and vomit. Furthermore if the bleed is serious if the blood goes don the troat there is no indication of just how much blood is being lost.

To get round this particular problem you could talk to your ds about his nosebleeds. If he is like my son he could easily have one when either of you are not around so if he is prone to them it would be wise to equip him with theknowledge of how to deal with them.

Sit forward elbows on knees head tlted down piching the soft tissue just below the bridge of his nose.

With regard to your dh, in Elizabethan times lead was considered good for the skin and not so very long ago smoking was thought to be good for those with chest problems and so on.

Would your dh consider it resonable for you to do those things to your dc just because it was considered the thing to do in the past.

"Dee, do you think that day in day out telling him what to do and how to do it and bollocking him when it doesn't happen is healthy for a relationship?"

I don't know what straw man you're arguing with, but don't bring me into it.

The OP's description of her husband makes him worryingly unable to admit he might be wrong about anything and overbearing in his insistence that everything is her fault.

I just can't see how graciousness is going to work on somebody who treats you like that.

As for "modelling good behaviour" - that is what you do with a child. I don't model good behaviour for my husband. I treat him with love and respect because I love and respect him. When either of us is having a shitty day and behaving less then optimally I expect it to be quickly sorted with apologies made and accepted and blame taken where it is due.

I'm really struggling to see this aggression you're apportioning to the OP. Telling someone they're wrong when they're wrong is not being aggressive. Telling someone it's their fault that you overdosed your child because they need to assume you don't ever listen to a word they say is pretty aggressive though.

Why must she be gracious when he is such a dick to her? Do you really think someone that blames everything on her is going to start being nice because she becomes more of a walkover?

OP, i haven't read the whole thread but your DH sounds rather like mine. We have discussions about things eg DS's birthday party, when to have it who to invite etc. We agree on things. Then later he tells me he has asked people on a completely different date to that agreed previously and has a completely different idea to who we are inviting also compared to what was agreed previously.

I so far have found no way around this. DH openly admits his brain is only switched on whilst at work and whilst at home it is switched off or on 'standby' or something like that. I don't think he is exaggerating as he is very good at his job and is doing really well, he is just a complete disaster at home.

The only thing that does work is to write things down. But of course that is not always practical and i don't always think i need to write things down after we have a discussion where he has agreed certain things.

Sorry not much help but you are not alone! I have recently succeeded in getting DH to apologise though so all is not lost!

OMG fluffy, your DH sounds a lot like mine too.
Until recently I felt v close to walking out as this type of behaviour just wears away at you over time.
The really annoying thing is that mine is generally a good guy except for this stubborn/unreasonable streak.
I've always seen it as a type of bullying too and I swear sometimes I really feel like I dislike him intensely! That doesn't seem like a good way to feel in a marriage.
Lately what seems to have changed things a bit is me either a) ignoring him and just saying anything to make him shut up, or b) really standing up to him and not getting upset but rather not caring (or trying not to care) about what he's saying/doing.
Remember that bullying only works if you are victimised, so in theory if you act as though you couldn't care less then eventually he may stop behaving this way and/or you may actually not care less!
I think it must be something to do with confidence as my DH had a difficult childhood and often has low self-esteem issues, not that this excuses him. But it does help in understanding and maybe accepting certain behaviour.
Every time you have one of these arguments, or if one is brewing, decide whether the actual issue is really worth persuing and if you know it isn't then try to let it go. If it's still bothering you down the line then try and pick a time when things are calmer between you to try to discuss it. I know from experience that this is easier said than done, but sometimes if they feel cornered then men really don't respond very well so picking your moments is crucial.
Yeah i know it shouldn't have to be this tiresome and why should we be the ones to have to put in the effort etc etc but men are tricky and often total prats, what can you do...