constant snidey digs and control issues - how do I handle this?

[bohemianbint]

And this is surrounding our wedding and from my SM!

Just to fill you in - we've been planning our wedding for 10 months. SM and father refused to talk about it, and call me paranoid but I think were hoping if they ignored it it wouldn't happen; they have utterly refused to discuss it for the last year and even said they assumed we weren't doing it and were going away that week instead.

Anyway - it is going ahead and my mother has been really supportive and helpful, we've booked it all and there's really not much but minor details to iron out. My parents (dad and SM) have said they'll pay, but then still wouldn't discuss it with us until they found out we were inviting my mother at which point they said they wouldn't come. I refused to get drawn into what was clearly emotional blackmail and said it was up to them. They've now seen my mother is coming and clearly is more involved than they are, and so have suddenly decided that they are going to jump in with both feet and take right over.

I'm really pissed off at the moment, because:

• as soon as they saw the invite SM was straight on the phone wanting to take over the organisation - which we have had in hand from day 1. She wanted to phone the venue and discuss food but DH told her to wait until we could discuss what we wanted - we have 3 weeks before we have to finalise it yet. She phoned up yesterday like she hadn't heard a word of what DH said on Friday; she's phoned the venue and started asking them if they will cook x,y and z, and started asking them to do things that we already know they won't.

What really* pisses me off is that she has asked the hotel for a list of guests that are staying there - it's mostly our friends but my mother and grandmother are also staying there, which is what she will have wanted to find out, but I just find that a bit shocking that she would do that.

When speaking to me and DH she refuses to pronounce the name of the venue, acts like she can't remember it and makes a big show of saying it wrong. (Which, incidentally she did when DS2 was born, she said "what've have you called him, xx? Insert stupid random totally off the mark name here) She's not stupid, again this just seems to be a way of undermining what we've chosen because it was our* choice and not hers, despite the fact that we gave them so many opportunities to be involved.

• She has also finally spoken to the ILs to discuss the arrangements (after leaving them hanging for over a month) and when we saw MIL yesterday she said "we're paying for your food but you'll still get a say in it". ??!! (you might have spotted my thread about a vegetarian wedding and the MIL who says we can't possibly only serve veggie food as not everyone is veggie )

• When I said we need to find out if there will be a dry run of the ceremony she said "god, how american, I hope we don't have to do that" and when I invited them over for dinner as the ILs are coming and it would give them a chance to discuss she was all cagey and wanting to know what we would be cooking because they "might not be hungry."

I'm just so furious that we have done all the donkey work alone here and all of a sudden when they realise it really is happening and a shedload of people are coming they suddenly want to be seen as the good guys at the centre of it and are taking over, telling us we "need to get on top of things" (ffs! We've been on top of it for months!) and that we can have a say in our own wedding and going behind our backs to the venue.

How do we make her behave without having an apocalyptic fall out? These things in isolation are quite small and appear quite petty but they've always been the same, they will peck and pick at anything they don't approve of in a really snide way and just generally try to undermine me and make me feel like shit. (sorry - this has turned into a lengthy rant!)

phone the hotel and tell them they are only to discuss things with you and no one else
they shouldn't be giving out lists of guests to anyone else but you, very unprofressional

Compo - that is a good point, I hadn't thought of that. I don't think as a guest I'd be over the moon that my presence was being broadcast to god knows who.

She sounds hideous, but I can't see what you can actually do about it. Just ignore, ignore and ignore - and keep it in perspective: she's meddling in just one day out of many many days of a long and happy marriage.

And yes, of course it's a very important day - but that's all the more reason to not let her spoil it. Go for the water off a duck's back approach - you know that you've done all the hard work, and it doesn't actually matter what anyone else thinks.

thanks - good points. I think we'll ring the venue and tell them to only deal with us and then she's limited in what she can do.

I know they're paying for most of it, but I still don't see that gives them the right to do this. I tempted to tell them to shove it but it would cause a massive rift. Unbelievable the bother a "happy" occasion can cause eh?

Is your Dad like this as well or is all this coming from your SM? If it's all originating from her, then it's time to have a quiet word with him and ask him to call her off.

My dad doesn't speak much at all but they seem to work as a combined entity; you can't question the actions of one without being seen to criticise the entity as a whole and then it will turn on you.

I'm being a bit tongue in cheek there, but it's a fairly accurate description.

Oh - and the logic of inviting them all for dinner later, as well as giving us all a chance to get things organised is so that both sets of parents have to discuss things in front of us, rather than saying and doing god knows what behind our backs. Half an hour on the phone with my SM seems to have done strange things to MIL...

"I tempted to tell them to shove it but it would cause a massive rift"

There is a massive rift anyway between you - your Dad and SM have gone all out to undermine you as a parent and adult by their toxic behaviours. This is all about power and control.

Inviting them all over to dinner may backfire badly and end in recrimination.

You have to break free of them (your Dad and SM) completely otherwise they will try to dominate you and your family for the rest of your days.

Your Dad is likely to be the bystander in that particular dysfunctional relationship. They often act like this out of a sense of self preservation and wanting a quiet life for their own self. He has failed to protect you his daughter from her worst excesses. That also makes him culpable and as bad as she.

I think Attila has a point. Good parents do not make their children a battleground.
Their behaviour is anything but loving

BB - could you manage without their financial input? If you could I would be tempted to politely (and I mean politely) decline the offer - it seems to come with far too many strings and is making you potentially very miserable about the choices you are making for your wedding.

If they're paying they can do whatever the hell they like. If you want to do things your way, you have to pick up the tab.

If they are paying the hotel directoy then she can insist they don't deal with you.

You accepted their money, unfortunately now you are beholden.

Sorry DeeBlindMice the money should not have come with strings attached.
I do however agree that if it was obvious that they would want something in return it was unwise to accept the money.

It doesn't matter whether it should have come with strings attached, it's their money, they can (and appear to have) tie it up in giant bungee cords and decorate it with doilies if that's what they want.

The options are to cancel existing plans and do something you can afford independently of them or play as nice as possible until after the wedding and never take their shilling again.

Yep those are options.
Personally I would not have taken the money in the first place.

Well - no money has been spent yet, apart from ours. We have paid for the venue, and as such they have only dealt with us, but we can't afford to pay for much more than that. My mother has offered to pay for the rest, so we could refuse their offer and take up my mother's, but that would cause a lot of trouble.

I'm going to a counsellor to deal with how my parents treat me - she said that if they offer a gift of money to pay for a wedding then it is just that, a gift, it doesn't give them license to take over, so I was working off that. We had arranged a small wedding we could afford but they insisted they would pay and so we have sent the invites and there isn't long to go. My mother's offer doesn't come with strings, it will just send SM and father berserk.

And the thing is - taken in isolation these incidents don't look much. If we decline their offer it will just look as though we are being funny to anyone else (them included, I expect, as they think they are jsut totally beyond question and "only trying to help".)

This is really useful though, it's good hear that their behaviour is crap, rather than just being swept along with it and being made to feel like it is an unquestionable norm.

Well, what happens if you let them go berserk? That's their choice. What's the worst that can come of it? They won't come to the wedding? From this and your previous threads that sounds like a good thing to me - and remember that will be their choice not your fault. I'm sorry you are going through this and how dreadfully torn it is making you feel but really none of this is your fault and I would be tempted to call a halt to their interfering right here and now.

i would drawn the line actually. i suspect the fall out will be surprising. they will rant and rave and generally carry on, trying any trick to get you to change your mind but when they see you mean business they will tow the line. or not come.

def phone the venue and tell them under no account to deal with anyone else.

there is no way your sm should dictate the menu. totally off. and fwiw, i love vegetarian food even though i'm not a vegetarian.

I totally agree with Franke's post.

Decline their financial input so you are beholden to no-one and don't have to deal with the interference, emotional blackmail and "taking over".

Your wedding was going ahead and you were on top of all the plans when they supposedly weren't coming, so you don't actually need their input - financial or otherwise.

Definitely phone the venue (and anyone else you think she might call) ..... maybe even consider using a password ? (I know that sounds a bit paranoid but it also sounds like your SM has no shame either)

They need to be kept busy. Give them a hugely responsible major task to 'control' and hope that way they stay out of your hair.

Can your SM cook? Get her to make the cake, ask for extra cherries or something so she has to deviate from the recipe and do trial runs. Ask for a couple of 'tricky' specialist things for her to spend hours making or sourcing and then give her creative lisence. I promise you you won't hear a peep then til the day and she can have the glory she is seeking on the day when people compliment the cake (which the always do, even if it looks like a warehouse in south london).

This is what we did anyhow. MY parents got to design the table decorations, leaving me and DH to do the rest.

Actually, tes, as things relationship-wise couldn't get much worse, there isn't much to lose. I think we'll see how tonight goes and play it by ear. Really appreciate the input.

bb that is great that you basically don't need their money and have not actually spent any of it.

I agree with franke about just letting them go berserk. You make your own choices - it's perfectly valid to refuse an offer of help, no matter how well meaning, if you'd rather manage yourself.

Your counseller sounds a bit dim. You were clearly never going to get an uncomplicated present from these people and it's standard that if someone contributes to your wedding you take their views into consideration