smoking

[charlieblue]

Hi

I've always been really anti-smoking. When I was young I lost both a grandfather and favourite uncle to it so mabye that's partly why.

Anyway, when I met DH he smoked off and on. He knew I hated it and always promised to give up. Over the years - 21 of them now, 17 married - he's stopped and started at various points and probably smoked a whole lot more than I know because he hides it from me. Even his attempts at stopping never feel final as he just chews nicotine gum endlessly.

He is a bit prone to depressive/anxiety type episodes and I guess uses smoking as a stress thing (also drinks a bit more than he should).

Anyway, I'm getting really pissed off with it now, particularly as DD who is 10 and is very anti-smoking as children often are, has nearly caught him a couple of times (found cigs in the house etc) and was totally distraught because she thinks her dad will die etc. I've asked him not to smoke near the house, and in particular not to pop out for a fag when he thinks me and DD are asleep as she is going to catch him one day and I can't face trying to cover for him again.

Am I totally wasting my time on this one and should I just let him take responsibility for his own health (which he never does - like most men he's immortal obviously). My main worry is DD and her thinking he's a total hypocrite, or even worse smoking herself. Also (and this sounds really morbid), all our insurance policies say he is a non-smoker which he was when we took them out but if something happened could we end up being left with nothing?

I need another opinion on this, thanks.

firstly can i say i understand totally how you feel. i am a smoker struggling to stop - i hate the idea of my son lighting up and my partner who found it very easy to quit hates that i fall off the wagon and smoking outside is not enough for him either - rightly so.

However without sounding like its making excuses:

nicotine is widely recognised by medical science as being as addictive if not more then heroin. Its not easy to quit. shouting, guilt, fear - nothing will stop him when the cravings hit. Has he tried the stop smoking service? Hypnotherapy. These are my next routes. I stopped for two years then started again so staying stopped is tough. My motivation is how much i love my son so i intend to beat it for good but i dont make illlusions about how tough it is. You have to really really want to and to me it doesnt sound like he does yet. He needs to examine why he smokes and then take it from there.

good luck and i hope he quits for your dds sake if nowt else.

You are so not being unreasonable, you are worried about your partner and you dd and your financial future if god forbid anything did happen to him as you say your insurence says he is a non smoker.

I have witnessed a few close family memners destroy themselves due to ciggarettes and much of my own childhood was tarnished by bad health caused by my parents second hand smoke so i guess i may be an extremest when it comes to anti smoking.

I coudn't live with dp if he smoked.

If it is a big thing for you sit him down and tell him how serious you are and about your concerns also tell him you will visit a gp with him for help or similar, if he is any kind of partner or father he will try his hardest to give up.

Sorry if that sounds harsh.

I know you're right really - me nagging hasn'tworked for years so it won't now. Theone thing I know is he won't usethings like the stop smoking service - he's got this vision of group counselling whioch isn't his thing at all!

if he wants to stop he will try anything.

Tough one. It's an addiction, so rational reasons to stop aren't going to be enough to make him quit. If anything, they are likely to make him feel more guilty and ironically more in need of a cigarette than ever.

Get him to read the Allen Carr book "The Easy Way to Give Up Smoking". It doesn't work for everyone, but even if it fails in itself it will open his eyes to how he is using cigarettes as an excuse for stress, etc. Once those myths are stripped away, many people do manage to give up smoking even if they are still relying on willpower rather than succumbing to Carr's philosophy that you will feel 'freed and never want another cigarette again'. He has also published a book/video on how to prevent your children from smoking, even if you are a smoker yourself.

I'd stop covering up your DH's smoking as far as your DD is concerned. At 10, it is only a matter of time before she works it out for herself. You could do more damage by lying to her than she will sustain from worrying about her father. God forbid, but if she ever started smoking (or doing drugs) herself, she will have learned that it is only a problem if other people know about it. Better out in the open. You never know, her concerns about his health may help focus him. It will also help her stop the hypocrite feelign. If she knows he smokes but he can explain to her how much he hates the fact that he does, that he is addicted and he is a miserable slave to nicotine, she will be less likely to see him as a hypocrite and more as someone with an illness that she herself is determined to avoid at all costs. Most children of smokers start smoking because they buy into the idea that it is adult, and that it provides release from stress, helps to relax you, etc. If your DH can demonstrate that while he can't give it up, smoking actually does none of these things, you're halfway there.

As for insurance policies, what about setting a time limit on the smoking? Give him a 6-month window or something, and if he hasn't stopped by then, change your policies. They will go up, but not as much as you think, and at least you will be covered if the worst happens. Let's hope it doesn't.

Ultimately, smoking is a dangerous addiction that causes a lot of harm, to the loved ones of the smoker as well as the smoker him/herself. However, it is a legal vice and there are a lot of worse things he could be doing. It is his body and his choice. It would be fantastic if he could stop, but if he can't, he can't.

Hope he quits! Good luck.

Tough one, I am an on and off smoker also.

The thing is, even when you get all the crap out your system, you still crave it, its a lifelong addiction.

Thats why prettyfly stopped for 2 years and started again.

You can't really make him stop, however when he isn't smoking all I can suggest is praising him for it etc.

This is really helpful in terms of me trying to rationalise this a bit - I think I've built everything a bit out of proportion over the years and gone at it all wrong. That said, I do want him to stop, we do need to agree a clear postion re DD and what she knows and I need to sort the financial side.

Going to talk to him this weeked and try and and avoid falling out about it for a change

After reading all the posts it sounds as if you have it all cleared up with the good advice given .Even though I know this, smoking cigarrettes is something that is so close to my heart that I have to post. Hope you don't mind.

Nicotine is a stronger drug than heroin (so they say). I smoked 40 a day and smoked for 20 years before I gave up. I never wanted to give up.

The thought of giving up brought me out in a cold sweat. In the november I got a terrible cough (one that I had been getting about 2 or 3 times a year for about 15 yrs). The cough was actually debilatating,sp. I had ticket for Miss Siagon and knew there was no way I could go with that cough. Then thought,"well lets try and give up for the next 3 days to see if it eases the cough". Dh was so supportive. He had given up for about 12 years at this point. he kept telling me that he knew I could do it (even though I knew I couldn't)
I

It was one of the worse experiences of my life. I thought about smoking every minute of everyday for the first 8 weeks. Gradually it would reduce to maybe, just every 5 minutes. I had to reexamine everything in my life. How to have a cup of tea, use the phone, drive the car.

I use to get 2 baths a day just to take my mind off it. I ended up conceiving a baby, sorry tmi, because I just didn't know what to be doing with myself, I ended up pestering him every night. After a year I just thought about it every few hours. But I read Allen Carr, not word for word but during my many baths. He preaches and it is so true, that as an ex smoker you may occassionally think "I would like a ciggie" but as a smoker you have that feeling every hour. YOu are like a drug addict really, permenantly thinking about when you can get your next fix.

I used nicotine patches, a god send, allan carr book, and the most helpful (although mi told me she found this cheesy), but then she is still a smoker, an american based website on giving up smoking. Sorry can't remember its name. I am sure if you google you will get it.

I am so proud of myself. It is the hardest thing I have ever done.

If your dh was an alcoholic or crack cocaine addict he would get loads of help. Which is quite galling, considering nicotine takes far more lives than heroin, crack cocain or hiv does.

I know because he is a man he may find it harder going to group counselling etc, but honestly why shouldn't he. Every other addict gets this choice.

I am sure your dh will come to a realisation at some point. The other poster was right, you don't need to cover up for your dh to your dd. Let your dh explain.

Sorry if I sound like the typical ex smoker

Interested in the comments about it being a lifelong addiction. Never smoked myself, never got it.

But BF did smoke when I met him, he declared he was giving up and in all the time I have known him I have never seen him smoke, but I know he does, very ocasionally I think.

He admitted tonight he uses patches when he is out for a drink because he still gets cravings, I annoyed him a bit because I said he must still be smoking quite e bit if he needs patches after so long, but I suppose it could be true.

Hi charlieblue,

Here's my contribution (if you still want other's thoughts):
the fact that he promises not to smoke but then you find cigarettes is not a sign that he's an untrustworthy liar, it's a sign of the addictiveness of cigarettes. I know because I'm a nicotine addict and know that the best intentions and most heartfelt promises to those closest to us can go sraight out of the window when there's a nicotine craving. Threats and ultimatums are unlikely to work (because we're already giving oursselves ultimatums all the time!) but that shouldn't stop you from reminding him of how unpleasant etc etc his habit is - my husband does and I agree with him!

Evenso, I don't agree with smoking anywhere near children and I hope your DH doesn't.

Wishing him and me lots of luck and willpower to overcome the evil weed.

No comment on the rest, it is between you and him, but, DO let you insurance company know. Many of then carry out a standard blood test which can tell if you have had a smoke in the last X long. If they perform it post mortem and find he has been smoking you will get NOTHING.

It is important as it knocks out all of your protection planning.

Must be frustrating for Charlieblue. Some of my friends have succeeded with the Allen Carr book mentioned before. Also a couple succeeded with hynpotherapy. I went cold turkey myself. I think the key thing is not the method of quitting but really wanting to yourself, and sadly you can't do that for him. There's good advice above on that though. It might help to explain what KingCanute says about the health insurance - help kick him out of denial.

But I do have to take issue with a couple of comments. The 'nicotine is more addictive than heroin' thing gets trotted out so often that people assume its true. But have you ever seen anyone in heroin withdrawal? Vomiting, pooing all over themselves, crying and screaming, not able to stay still for even a second... Giving up fags was quite hard, but I didn't shit the bed at any point. It's hard to give up smoking, but it's not that hard. I'm a bit concerned that saying it makes people thing 'What's the point in trying to give up smoking, it'd be as difficult as giving up heroin'. And also when people have succeeded in giving up heroin they have people saying 'Oh yeah, I know how you feel because I gave up fags and that's supposed to be just as addictive' (You think people are too sensitive to say such things? If so sadly, you're wrong...)

Also as a recovering alcoholic, I have to correct you Colie - there's about the same amount of effective help available from the NHS for giving up smoking and giving up alcohol. A GP can easily refer you for help to give up smoking, much more easily than finding a place in rehab for alcoholism (I didn't get a place in rehab - cold turkey again. Not pretty, but a long time ago - I've been sober over 10 years). So charlieblue your DH can, and should, ask for help from the NHS. He's far more likely to get it than I ever was!

And sorry I've hijacked a bit!

The outward symptoms of withdrawal are not the same thing as the level of addiction held IYSWIM. Yes the withdrawal is worse from heroin, but that is something different to addiction!

I am in the process of stopping smoking and it is THE hardest thing I have ever undertaken. Wish I'd never started but there is no point in dwelling on that. Excellent post from Collie, that is just the type of thing that someone trying to stop needs to hear - motivational stories from people who have actually done it including the difficulties.

My DH supports me 100%, he doesn't freak out when I fail and rush outside to have a smoke because the addiction overtakes my motivation (I never smoke indoors). He encourages me. He never say's anything negative, I don't need anyone to tell me that it smells, that it's disgusting and dangerous, we smokers know all that. Just be as supportive as you can. If DH was mad or frustrated with me when I fail, then it would stress me and make me want to smoke even more. His support and positive attitude has helped me to halve my consumption and I'm proud of myself. Plus, every penny I save in cigarettes, he matches it and puts it in a jar. I WILL do it!!!!

I don't know if any of that helps, I just wanted to say that I recognise exactly how hard a habit it is to break and say some of the things that ave helped me so far on my rocky road

Good luck to everyone on here who is trying to stop, I feel your pain

KingCanute - yes, you're right that withdrawal is something different to addiction (although I'm not sure people really distinguish between them in common usage). But is nicotine addiction worse than heroin addiction? Surely not - Heroin kills faster and more gruesomely, and people persist in the addictive behaviour much more compulsively against greater barriers to service their addiction. I might be wrong, and maybe a clever person will come and correct me, but it's my understanding that the statement that nicotine is more addictive than heroin came from a statement in the eighties by the US Surgeon General at the time, but wasn't based on a specific comparative study. I think he was stating his opinion. Maybe I'm wrong about that - if you know about a specific study, tell me and I'll stand corrected.

I personally have quit smoking, and empathise with the OP's plight and her DH's, and I am very anti-tobacco companies etc.

But I have heard with my own ears, three times, people trotting out that statement to recovering heroin addicts so it really gets my goat! I don't believe that it's true, and I think it trivialises something much scarier than nicotine addiction.

[end of hijack I promise!]

I agree bec (sorry, how do you shorten your name?) the idea of stating that to a heroin addict is laughable. I doubt that there can really be many (if any) comparisons made, I think the usefullness of the statement is more aimed at explaining just how difficult an addiction it is to break when talking to non-smokers.

Common thoughts seem to be that breaking an addiction to a "legal" drug is in some way an easy thing, simply because it is legal! The fact is that this particular legal drug is highly addictive and breaking this addiction is omething people fail at every single day.

To the Op, as has been said you getting stressed at your dh won't help him or you. I agree that it is not nice and I can understand your concern that this affects your daughter too. However, a parent smoking is not the only thing that will start her off. If the parent in question is as ashamed about it as your dh appears then I would expect it to reinforce her understanding of just how bad it is. If she finds out she may be dissapointed in her father but it will not be the end of her world as you seem to think.

Personnally, I would explain your fears to your dh and tell him how this will affect your life insurance (it will cost a LOT more). Tell him your worries about your daughter and her reaction should she find out. Finally tell him that you want to support him as much as you can and then BE supportive. It is hard to bite your tounge but you need to if you are going to be helpful to him.

becstarlitsea- cancer research say nicotine is as addictive as hard drugs. Link below.

scienceblog.cancerresearchuk.org/2008/09/17/smokers-underestimate-nicotine-cravings /

Sorry if I said nicotine was more addictiv andhave caused you offence. I was only trying to explain to op how hard it can be to give up smoking.

Because nicotine is a legal drug many people feel that it cannot be compared to illegal substances and it can and should be. Nicotine takes far more lives than heroin.
Possibly if cigarrettes were illegal and as highly priced as heroin people would go to the same lengths to get their hit of nicotine.

When I gave up smoking 4 years ago I couldn't get free counselling groups or free nicotine replacement therapy. At the time other drug addicts could get free help

I would imagine telling a recovering heroin addict that nicotine is more addictive is highly insensitive but I also think it would be highly offensive to say to a recovering nicotine addict that heroin is a much more addictive drug.

Wasn't aware there was any competition about your choice of poison. I was only trying to give advice from the point of view of an ex drug addict to op.

Charlieblue wrote:- "He is a bit prone to depressive/anxiety type episodes and I guess uses smoking as a stress thing (also drinks a bit more than he should)."

CB, you need to go easy here. Fags contain a natural anti-depressant, so for years, he's been getting an AD fix without realising it. When he quits, he also quits a natural form of AD. If he's prone to depression, quitting will take his legs out from underneath him as sure as being hit by a bus.

Please ask him to consider Zyban. Originally developed as an AD, it was given to American prisoners and it was noted that these prisoners all started to quit the fags! If he uses Zyban, he replaces the natural AD in fags and that will help - a lot!

Oh, and completely by the by but Zyban is feckin' marvellous for PMT!