Can someone define 'toxic' parenti ng for me please?

[OrmIrian]

How do you stop yourself from being one? Some of the things I see on MN make me wonder, am I one, is my DH one, was my mother one, are some of the not-perfect parents I know are toxic. Is it down to actions or intentions? If you do your best, do everything with love, but still f* up sometimes, is that toxic? If sometimes, inspire of best intentions, you fail your DC, is that toxic?

I am not asking this to be contentious, or to deny that there are seriously damaging parents out there, but because when I read some of the the threads, it worries me. I'd hate to think that in years to come my DC would look back and be labelling me that way.

It seems to go to the heart of the way I parent. I don't follow rules, I do things the way it seems right at the time. And sometimes it proves not to be the right way, but that helps me learn for next time.

Hmm, not entirely sure, but generally behaviour that is self-serving and narcissistic? Evil scheming, that sort of thing...it doesn't sound like you'd do it tbh, I can't think that a MNer would ever get away with it, because she would always check on AIBU first, and One Has To Abide...

one of the main things for me is doing things with the best intentions and being able to admit you have made a mistake.

Being able to see your child as a person in their own right with the right to make their own desicions and own mistakes. not just as someone to fulfill your wishes. Or placing a label on them (e.g. x is the clever one, y is the pretty one) and not being able to see any behaviours that deviate from this.

Not making your love dependant on what they do (e.g. I will not love you if you don't get a high flying job or I will cut off contact if you move away).

there are some deffo toxic parents - as with all lables i feel this is heavily mis-used on mumsnet ( where it prevails)

and is used to whinge and moan about your mum

sometimes people are glass half empty kinda people.

and lets face it - one day your kids will be grown up, and will you be a different person? i think our dominant traits would still prevail no matter what 20 years of life throws at us - so if your pushy now - you will be pushy 0 if your withdrawn - you will be withdrawn

and this can all be construed different ways depending on ones charachter.

any future DIL can say of me - shes ok easy to get on with - or - "aibu, my MIL (custy) is teaching my son to steal by opening baby bel in tesco"

cos thats the kinds person i am -

i hope this makes some kind of sense - i think children remember the rubish things anyway.

thank god for blogs thats all i can say. this generation have it easy - you can go back to your online diaries and say - but we did take you to stateley homes!

If you do your best, do everything with love, but still f* up sometimes, is that toxic? If sometimes, inspire of best intentions, you fail your DC, is that toxic?

No, this is not toxic behaviour.

I think it's a very good thing to discuss, OrmIrian. I don't have an answer for you, I agree with that there ought to be room to experiment (with the risk of making minor mistakes) without being lambasted for it. It seems to me like people (on MN especially, not so much real life), are terrible at understanding the huge gulf between 'toxic' or 'abuse' and simply unconventional or laid-back.

Many lives are damaged by the legacy of parental abuse. Parents who ignored their children's needs or overburdened them with guilt. Parents who were alcoholic or addicted to drugs. Parents who were exploitative and cruel, or simply indifferent and inadequate. When these children reach adulthood the damage done by their toxic parents manifests itself in depression, or difficulties with relationships, careers and decision-making.

interesting question, I would think that toxic parenting at some level involves wanting your dc to feel bad.

I feel it is simple. A toxic parent cannot acknowledge or even understand what hurt has been caused by their actions.

You sound a good thinking parent. No one is perfect, and parenting by myself and dh who have both been parented by the toxic do it by what we deem best at the time. We have reasons (that we can explain) why we do things and if something is clearly not working with our dd and she is unhappy, we look to our parenting skills first, not look to put the blame on her and her genes. Of course sometimes she is just going through a stage which always makes me extra paranoid!

I feel one of the main problems with parents who are toxic is also their inability to see the damage their childhood did to them. You will hear the phrase 'it never did me any harm' ironically you can often tell it has when they go into denial mode. Tis terrible now, since I started therapy (finished now, phew!) and reading various self help books I can usually tell within minutes if someone was toxically parented...have to keep it to myself most of the time tho...sometimes honesty is not the best policy but sometimes a nudge in the right direction helps their thinking go down a different, more fruitful path

Thankyou.

attila - that 'inadequate' frightens me TBH. Because I frequently feel unequal to the task. Isn't it human to do so?

ally90 - but if you don't intend the harm or expect to cause it, isn't it difficult to acknowledge that it has happened?

We all do unintentional things. Tis human to err... its important that the relationship is such the child feels able to come to you and tell you what is wrong or that you have hurt them. And don't think I don't worry about this one often...what if I subconciously make her feel unloved etc...you need to be sure you don't drive yourself mad with this one

I'm imagining maybe you occassionally lose your temper and shout at your kids? I don't think this makes you toxic, just pretty normal. Things that I think are toxic are:

If you shout more of the time than you are loving and kind

If you call your DCs names and say things like "you are useless/bad/horrible" etc all the time

Obvious favouritism towards other siblings

Ignoring all the time

Hitting, kicking, pushing etc, more than just a light slap because you have 'lost it' on a rare occassion

Sexual abuse

If you watch your child being badly mistreated and do nothing about it

If your child tells you they are being abused and you do nothing about it

Ridiculing frequently

Dismissing and showing scorn for most of your child's feelings

Not wanting the best for your child but having the attitude of "I never had it (eg love and affection) and 'just got on with it' so why can't you".

Never showing affection or praising your child. Always finding fault.

Feel very reading your definitions Actingnormal as my mother falls into a few of these categories.

The fact you are on here questioning your parenting OrmIrian would say to me you are in no way a toxic parent.

I think if you love your children and put them first (which doesn't mean you become a martyr) you can't be toxic.

My mother worked when I was a child but I knew that if I ever needed her she would be there. When I was a new grown up (early 20's) she encouraged me to apply for jobs abroad - (she could see they would be good for me) whilst at the same time telling me if I ever needed a bed and room and somewhere to stay I had it. She let go but let me know I was loved.

I hope to be able to do the same for my boys.

I am sorry SweetKitty. Did you think of your mother as being toxic already or are you just thinking about it now?

I suppose I always knew things weren't "right" between us, it's as if she is jealous of me and wants to belittle me as often as she can.

Since being on MN I have learned about toxic parenting and she ticks the boxes unfortunately.

Thankyou all.

This subject has bothered me for a while because when I read threads sometimes I look at things parents have done and I think 'I've done that!'. Not often, not all the time but I have

My mum was a wonderful mum in many ways and there was never a doubt that she loved DB and I with all her heart, but she wasn't good at instilling confidence because she had none herself. I spent the first 20 some years of my life as a frightened rabbit, at least partly as a result of mum's parenting.

DH had a dad that left when he was 6. FIL behaved very badly TBH and all 3 DCs were left scarred (posted a thread about it yesterday). MIL's way of dealing with it wasn't great and made things worse, but hell it was late 60's people were not open about divorce and she had no idea how to deal with it. I am prepared to accept the FIL was a toxic parent according to the definitions I've seen here. But was MIL too? Between they f*ed up their DC good and proper

It's cleared now though. Thankyou. It does seem to be largely due to a lack of love, interest and concern, rather than ocassional failures. Yes? In which case I can aquit myself I think.