how to cope with sever lack of passion in long term relationship...

[regularlyoverwhelmed]

I've been with my OH for 16 years now and we have two kids. We've been having a hard time lately and been going to couples counselling. A lot of stuff came out and there was a period of about 6 weeks when he was in the spare room and having to decide if he wanted to give it another try or not. He announced in one of our sessions that he did. We had been over the issues again and again and he said he would try to change some of his habits (heavy drinking) and attitudes (fairly unemotionally connected with me and kids, little demonstrable interest in sex).

He is now back in our bed and I expected a bit of passion to rear its head once that happened. We'd spoken much more openly over the time apart about sex, desire, fantasy etc and indeed has sex once or twice in that time which was exciting and different to our usual (fairly mundane) scenario. Well, it just hasn't happened. We've been back together now about 4 or 5 weeks and I think we've had sex 2 or 3 times.

Initially I was wearing sexy undies etc thinking that'd turn him on but he just ignores it. He spoke when we were apart about buying me some slinky undies but nothing has happened there either. Again when we were apart he'd talked about a certain type of dress he'd like to see me in (nothing too risque, just one that buttoned down the front) but when I bought one and wore it when we went out last weekend he just said very noncommitedly "you look nice" as though I was his mother or something.

I went back to our counsellor alone to talk about it and she asked if I thought we had different sex drives - I guess that must be it (it's always been the case to a greater or lesser extent) she suggested we schedule in times for sex, so that I know when to expect it and end up not being constantly on edge wondering and being disappointed and so that he doesn't always feel under pressure from me and that I use my rabbit the rest of the time so I don't end up getting tense and frustrated sexually. I finally raised this with him as an option the other evening and he said "hmmm...ok" and then yesterday we started to talk about it and I just broke down in tears. I feel like some kind of monster who is trying to force him into something awful. He just seems so disinterested it is starting to really upset me, but I feel I can't talk about it as then he feels under pressure and we couldn't have that.

sorry, I don't know what exactly what kind of response I am expecting here but I just had to let it all out. I feel irritated, angry, undesired, fedup, sad and unreasonable all at the same time. Part of me just wants out now, which seems like an overreaction to a lack of passion...

I meant to type severe...obviously! now I'll have that typo haunting me...argh - hate that

please somebody, anybody, am I going bloody mad or is this quite normal in a ltr?

counsellor thinks I should buy another vibrator "to have some variety" in my sex life...I'm beginning to feel like one of those men you read about on threads, constantly pestering their poor wives for sex...I don't pester him (least i don't think so) but I would like a modicum of passion...

I couldnt read without leaving a post. I too have a lot of problems getting my partner in the sack - and we have only been together 5yrs!! I got so annoyed, I ended up buying a few kama sutra type self help books, sex games etc. It has encouraged him slightly. We have also tried body paint watching 'soft porn' together etc. It has helped somewhat, but we will continue to persevere.

HTH

(bloke posting)

Seems like biology taking its course. I went through several episodes of total lack of interest in sex in my 30s, and I'm in another one now that has so far lasted about 3 years. Interest always came back, till now, but I guess one day it just doesn't.

It's a real pain. I get accused of wanking or getting it elsewhere, as though I still have the appetites of a 17-year-old. TBH, if we do get the kids into bed before 10pm, or out of the house for a few hours, I'd rather sleep, watch a DVD, read a book, make myself an elaborate cocktail - lots of things sooner than a shag.

It's not me, it's everyone. The Inner Circle* are all the same. We just don't even talk about it any more. Can't be arsed, not interested.

A mate who got divorced in his 40s got re-interested in sex, because it was with someone new, but he's now lost interest again.

I don't know what the answer is. I can see how you shouldn't have to do without, but it's going to stop at some point and maybe that's now.

If you took a lover, would he leave or would he shrug? Would you contemplate doing that?

• Those male cronies who know everything and whom I would trust with anything

This is prob not helpful but I had exactly the same problem in my marriage and it left me feeling exactly the same as you. Like total shit!

After DS2 was conceived in 2000 we had sex once yes once, before splitting in 2006. Towards the end I would

I tried everything and still to this day don't know why he didn't want to, he would not be honest to me about it. I don't know whether him not wanting to was indicative of problems in our marriage or if the lack of intimacy caused our marriage to fail. It's a vicious circle imo.

Sorry I don't know what to suggest you do. Perhaps it will come back again with time rather than immediately.

sorry distracted by a lovely little baby visiting our workplace.

towards the end I would have happily taken a lover had the opportunity arisen

It's sad when your partner is disinterested. I have always had to initiate sex in our 23 year relationship. From time to time it really gets to me - why is he so "take it or leave it". I even lost 3 stone in weight, got down to a size 8, had a make-over etc but it didn't make any difference really. Basically, he is tired with running his own company and prefers to go to sleep at night. However, if he is ever working from home through the day while my daughter is at school then he seems up for it. Is this a possibility for you?

thanks for the responses

interesting to hear a bloke's perspective - y'see society would lead us to believe that you lot (men) are always up for it and so we (I ) start to think there is something wrong with me when he is not

I don't know what he'd think if i took a lover - I always thought I'd never do that, and that it'd be too complicated etc etc etc but am starting to think that one just for sex would be ok actually

but surely not every man's sex drive goes to nothing???

firway - we are often both at home when kids are at school and could easily organise it as we can both work from home but I don't think he's up for it then either. To be frank I am sick to the eye teeth of being rebuffed so don't initiate it anymore, so it is all on his terms...I feel I have no say in things at all

losthorizon - how does your dw/p feel about it?

definitely a vicious circle in my book - I firmly believe if we had a bit of passion/affection/sex we'd get through lots of other stuff easier than we do

went to ann summers this afternoon and looked at all the vibrators, just felt a bit sad really

There isn't anything wrong with you RO. It's not you personally he's rejecting, he's just off sex, but that doesn't mean he gets to discount your needs / happiness. If he doesn't want it and you do, he can physically impose his will by not playing ball, but he needs to understand the risk he faces - i.e. affair / divorce - in doing so.

I'm surprised about the counsellor's idea of booking an appointment for it. Sounds a bit clinical and would deffo put me off.

MrsLH would like it a bit more often, but I've pointed out that if the 5- and 2-year-olds slept in their own beds this might be a more frequent possibility. Also it's always about what she wants (eg haven't had a BJ in 6 years because she can't bothered...so neither can I).

Would he, ahem, sort you out short of actual sex? Is there anything he's never tried that you could arrange for him to try?

Has he tried Viagra? A mate told me what fun it was, I wasn't too sure because I felt like I was admitting to inadequacy, I tried it anyway and BLARDY HELL!!! is all I can say. 19 again!

The heavy drinking. Really bad habit for his wallet, health, sexual appetite, and mood / confidence.

Have you tried something along the lines of -

"You're obviously not happy, you're not in good shape and you've lost your joie de vivre. I won't let you settle for this crappy life, because I am your wife, you have a loving family, and all four of us would be bloody miserable and so worse off if we just gave up. It's also making me miserable. I'm not hearing what it is you do want, if it's not this / us. So why don't we both get into shape, lose some weight, eat better, drink less, carve out some 'us' time, and make a joint effort to have a better life in which we're healthier and happier? And in which you occasionally rip my undercrackers off masterfully while I gasp 'Oooh Sir Jasper!?"

-- in other words pitch it as concern for his happiness, if he were happy he wouldn't treat you all like this, etc.

you mention that your dh is emotionally disconnected from you , as well as having no sexual desire.

Could there be more to this. Is there any chance that there is low level depression happening here? Worth investigating I think, does he cope with work, is life generally getting him down?

I am also concerned about the LOVE in your relationship. You want sex, but do you love him? Do you show him you love him? Are you able to show each other affection?
My dh has had bouts of depression, and as long as we can keep the affection going between us (hard when he is at his depths), we get thru it.

I don't know what advice to offer- all I can do is give the other sdie.

My Dh and I have not had sex for years as I have gone off him- i feel we just don't connect, and for me it is an emotional issue.

He would want it every night if I was willing. when he makes advances I just get annoyed.

Maybe you need to back off and see what happens.
I agree that it might be emotionally based. Is he impotent with all the drinking? Has he confidence problems with his performance?

Most sex therapists would suggest touching each other in a non-sexual way- no below the belt allowed!- for weeks, then gradually getting close, until you have full sex. This is the standard "therapy" for couples who have sex issues or where one has gone off the boil.

I don't think demanding it is the right approach.

thanks again

honest friend - is interestng to hear about from the other perspective. I don't feel i demand indeed I don't even suggest anymore. I was getting tired of being rebuffed and he was feeling under pressure. It was good for no-one. This is really one ofthe things that brought us to the brink of separating two months ago or so. I asked him to be honest about what he wanted, whether it was me and kids or something else, his freedom perhaps. It took him a while to mull it over and he decided he wanted to stay. He is being more affectionate now, which I know is hard for him. Not VERY affectionate, but it's a good start. I suppose I am not all that affectionate with him. He's never much liked being touched, he gets jittery. I'm a very tactile person but I suppose I now aim most of my affection at our kids, since he didn't seem to want/value it.

clumsymum he is almost certainly depressed - the counsellor thinks so, I think so, he thinks so. He drinks as a way to self medicate this depression. He has admitted this both to me and to our GP to whom he went to discuss his drinking. Nobody apart from me seems to see the drinking as a major part of the problem. The gp just told him he should try to get it in moderation. He is trying to do this, to give him credit, and now manages not to drink a lot on mon-thurs at least. It certainly affects his libido, the only times we do have sex are on evenings he hasn't drunk at all (very rare) or in the morning if there is a miracle and we are both in bed with no kids.
Meanwhile I am on anti-depressants to try to help me through it all!
To answer the question about whether I love him...you know it is so hard to say in the light of everyuthing that's been going on. I am not sure I know what love is right now, or believe in it anymore. I most certainly like him lots, fancy him loads, find him amusing and funny (and hugely irritating at times!), enjoy his company most of the time, don't particularly want to be with anyone else, want him to feel good and happy. Is that love?

LH - he isn't in bad shape though, rather amazingly! he does a lot of sport and is tall and in great nick really. I fancy his socks off. He'd never let himself go to seed. I'm a bit chunkier now than before kids but still in ok shape, look after myself, care about my clothes, hair etc. Have recently started exercising again and am toning up now. I think I look alright. Recently when we were out he told me I looked fabulous.

Funny you should mention the BJ - I recently (last 9 months) starting giving him BJs having never done it in 16 years . I was on a bit of a surreptitious mission to spice things up as things were REALLY bad back then. He seems to like them but again, it's take it or leave it. If something as simple as that would rekindle his interest I'd be totally up for it. But there just seems to be nothing...

ps LH if you are around - can you tell me more about the viagra? does it make you want sex psychologically as well as just giving you an erection? or is that a stupid question? although how I could suggest that to him without it feeling like a demand I have no idea!

Would your DH go for counselling on his own? It sounds as if he has self-esteem issues that are the cause for drinking too much.
ADs are not the way out for you either- they may blunt your emotions but they are not the answer as you know.

Men's sexual responses and appetite are very much bound up with who they are and who they think they are. If he is depressed then it is not surprising that he doesn't want sex. I don't think it is any reflection on you at all, but on what is going on in his head. It sounds as if he doesn't like himself much- and maybe that is why he rebuffs affection- he doesn't feel worthy of it, or he has put up barriers to "protect" himself as he feels vulnerable.

I think the answer is for him to get himself sorted- whatever the reason for his depression he needs to find that- is it getting older, an unfulfilling job, a mid-life crisis? all are possible.

I think it is not the lack of sex that is bothering you but the lack of emotional closeness- and sex is only a part of that.

Viagra is not the answer- lifestyle changes are. Viagra is for men who are impotent for all kinds of reasons- but not self-inflicted through drinking too much. Viagra can also be harmful if people have health issues and if he drinks a lot he might have high blood pressure- Vaigra can cause further problems and even heart attacks .
What strikes me is that it is YOU who is doing all the worrying and taking responsibility for all of this- what about him?
Maybe the real issue is not lack of sex but his lack of desire (sorry) to make things better. When is he going to take responsibility for his life, his drinking, his relationship?

If he won't try, then maybe you do have to walk away, but you need to put that to him and give him the chance/choice.

ps- no, Viagra does not make you feel psychologically like sex,it just gives men a whopping erection within a certain time of taking it, then they have to use it. it does not replace desire.

thanks - he is going to the counsellor on his own next week and has another session booked for a fortnight after that - then we are due to go together to review how things are going. The whole thing is definitely bound up in me feeling he needs to take more responsibility for his life, his mental/emotional health, our family, our relationship. It feels like it has always been just me trying to hold all together and I can't do it anymore...he is trying now I think, but I guess maybe I am just being impatient...I want some closeness and I want to feel loved and desired without feeling pathetic and like I am hounding him. I have told him during the course of the counselling that he needs to be in this 100% or we should split. He says he wants to stay and he wants it to work, but I suppose I think that words are easy, its actions that count.

RO: Viagra won't sort out someone who's genuinely completely not interested. It works on those who are interested, but just physically can't get wood. IManecdotalE, it is widely recreationally used by those who are perfectly capable, but want more / better sex per session.

When you're 19 sex is desperately important. When you're 40, yeah, done plenty of that, can't do it as much / well as I used to, and there's a lot of hassle anyway, so...thanks but no thanks. Not enough pleasure in it for the hassle involved. So...if DH just can't be arsed, it could possibly make a difference.

Look away now if this is TMI.

20 minutes or so after taking one, if you are played with, you get an instant, irrepressible chubby. It doesn't really completely subside even after you come. That is, although it's not really comfortable to do so, you can come, pause about 30 seconds to a minute later, then carry on.

Yep. Really.

A third of a 100mg tablet, which is the most I've ever taken at a time, lasts for about 12 to 15 hours, although you can still feel the effects 24 hours later.

I and others have noted a bit of a retarded ejaculation effect after the first one. If using a condom, I find I can't usually come more than once. If I take it off then I can, but more than three times is hard work (for one of you).

Woman are usually fine with this, but if you coaxed DH down this route it could mean he gets pissed off at being almost, but not quite there for ages (less familiar territory to men than women, I guess). By about the fourth or fifth time, I usually find myself pleading pathetically for a bossy BJ to get the job done.

On the positive side, I've been offered / tried thigh fucking, bagpiping and anal sex as solutions to this state of frustration. So it's a nice problem to have.

Of course...I am not a medical professional, blah blah blah. Usual caveats apply. Stonk ons that won't go down can result in injury, etc...

sorry.... what's bagpiping? i have lived a sheltered life.

bagpiping = intercourse with the armpit.

of course it is!!
thanks losthorizon!

Although I've never figured out who should face which way. Luckily, this doesn't arise with thighs.

i would be tempted to hum a scottish bagpipe tune whilst engaged in this activity, i don't think i would be able to stop laughing.

I've heard of humming during cunnilingus but not during bagpiping. I agree though, a bit of this or better yet this would definitely improve the mood.

"I've only been unfaithful to you twice, dear - once with the milkman and once with the Royal Scots Dragoon Guards"

pmsl.
right i'm off to try it tonight. just digging out my ky jelly and tam-o-shanter!!

aha...so that's where I've been going wrong all these years...sod the sexy undies I obviously just need to get me a tam'o'shanter and he'll be gagging for it