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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Sorry me again, but can anyone advise...?

20 replies

ShinyHappyPurpleSeveredHeads · 28/10/2008 11:25

I must be getting boring now. But re my recent split from H in early Sept after years of his on/off texting/cybering of other women/porn addiction that led to it and his general on/off withdrawal from family life/moods etc.. I am now in a situation where I just don't know what to do.

I posted here a couple of weeks ago about how best to manage our separation since he moved out which was only a couple of weeks ago because he didn't have another place to go to until then.

I thought I was managing things ok - I've been seeing lots of him on a pretty much friends basis (and he never stays here!), mainly for the kids but also I have been enjoying his company. I like the new H and I want to believe that this IS the him he is going to be. He says he is determined to be this person, that he feels more positive than he has in years. He is going back to work (got a Back to Work interview today after a DECADE "off sick" wallowing - in some respects - in his medical condition although I am not denying his arthritis flare-ups are very painful when they do occur but fact is, he can work, at least part time, and wants to.)

He is having two lots of counselling for his addictive tendencies, one lot privately, one lot on the NHS through the mental health service. He is different in so many ways.. the miserable old git is gone replaced by someone who laughs and plays. The kids have been in their element. And he never stops showing me how much he loves me, regrets everything, would do anything for another chance at a future together (although I've made no promises). I want to believe him and trust him but I'm afraid to. I know he means what he says but he's meant what he said in the past too when he's "given up" his behaviour and then reverted to it. But he's never made a "new start" like this before. But then the stakes have never been this high and he we've never split up properly before.

But my family can't handle that he's been over here at my house so much. They say they can't visit when they want. My sister came over yesterday, then drove off in a strop when she saw his car here. My mum sends me emails detailing all his nastiness of the past and reminding me how people rarely change. My best friend is trying to bite her lip but agrees with my family wholeheartedly. I know there's nothing they'd really like more than for me to divorce him and move on. Prefetably meet someone else (the thought to me, is laughable).

But I love him. And now he's treating ME with the love I craved from him for so long, it's very hard for me to relegate him to my past as "just the father of my children".

What the bloody feck do I do? I can't have counselling yet; am on a waiting list.

There's been a show-down this morning. I unwisely told him last night that him being here so much was causing problems and he even more unwisely text my mum and sister asking them not to shout and me and give me grief and that he is only trying to be there for me, to help me out with the kids and housework (we have a severely disabled child who is lots and lots of work and it's been agreed all along that he would share the care as much as possible with him.)

Sister kicked off big style demanding that I tell him NOT to contact her or our mum again and that they want nothing whatsoever to do with him or his opinions. I text him this. He came round. I felt so confused and stessed that I shouted at him, "why did you have to behave the way you did for so many years? You had us, you lost us, now go.." and he did.

He even mentioned divorce if that's what I want. I don't.

I can't stand all this. My brain feels like it's exploding. I know I must be getting boring and tedious but there is noone else to ask about all this. Counsellor, booked - can't afford private and family/friends all too involved.

Please help if you think you can.

OP posts:
Carmenere · 28/10/2008 11:31

Oh god, you poor thing. All I can say is that history usually shows that the people closest to you who have no agenda are usually right. I know you still feel love for him but they are seeing the pain he put your through and want you to have a better quality of life. sorry for you though.

ShinyHappyPurpleSeveredHeads · 28/10/2008 11:38

And if he CAN be this better person? He has always had many good qualities, it's just that in recent years, he had got himself into a self-centred, self obsessed rut and that had reflected on everything else.

If he really can be who he wants to be, then I will have deprived my children of a happy family home and myself of the only man I've ever really loved.

Impossible.

Just want to run away. And I'd thought I was feeling better.

OP posts:
choosyfloosy · 28/10/2008 11:43

I would say don't do anything at all for a bit, and ask your mother and sister to back off a bit (not with the help! just with the advice).

If you are seeing a better side to dh, that's fantastic. You are in a better place than you were, by the sound of it. if he presses you to make a decision that changes things, just say it took a very long time to get to breaking point, and it will take a long time to do any mending. Don't be forced into a timetable.

Have not been in your situation though, only you can know. But if you are undecided, why not stay that way for a bit.

Can I advise not texting each other anything emotional for a while? It is so hard to work out what someone really means by a text, without all the other cues.

Buda · 28/10/2008 11:48

What a nightmare. I have been wondering how you were doing since you had your initial thread pulled. Missed your last one as I was away.

I think it is far too early for you to believe that he has changed. As you say he has promised before - many times. Yes the stakes are higher now but he needs to prove that he has changed for quite a while before you contemplate trying again. I would certainly not be thinking of it this side of Xmas. You need him to have more counselling and you need your own counselling too. Then I think joint counselling would be helpful too.

I would then sit down with your family and tell them that you are not contemplating taking him back but that for the DCs sake and esp your DD and the work involved that you NEED him around. Tell them that you know they mean well but that it is not helping. As Carmenere says they have no agenda and have seen the crap he put you through.

I would give myself 3 months and tell everyone involved that you are not thinking/talking about it till then. That gives you till the end of Jan and you will have Xmas out of the way, will be feeling stronger and will have more of an idea of how real his promises are.

ShinyHappyPurpleSeveredHeads · 28/10/2008 11:49

H texts me all the time. He even writes me loves poetry now which is absolutely unthinkable for the old H!

If I hug him I feel guilty and that people would not approve. But I stupidly enjoy the closeness so much. And he is acting like he lives for these rare moments of physcial contact.

Or at least he was until I told him to go this morning.

If I'm honest he is sometimes making me feel a little crowded but at other times I think want him here and think I'll just live for the moment.

Choosy, if anything, my head is telling me waht you say, to do nothing for now, but I was trying that but my family say we're too close etc. And that they can't get a look-in (because they won't tolerate him being around him for one second.)

How could it ever work again anyway in those circumstances? My family hate him.

OP posts:
soapbox · 28/10/2008 11:50

I think it is much much too soon to be making any kind of decision on the future.

Keep contact friendly, why would you not given that there are children involved. But make contact about the children and him, not about you and him. Make him take the children out rather than sitting in the house under your feet.

Tell him that you would like to think it is possible that you might in time get back together again but wish to have time now to get your thoughts together. Set out a time frame that you would be happy with - perhaps 6-12 months time.

I think people can change given the right motivation but it is just way too soon to tell whether your DH is one of those people.

ShinyHappyPurpleSeveredHeads · 28/10/2008 11:52

Buda, I was in no way planning to have him back any time soon, I was just enjoying spending time with him and living with a "hope for the future", nothing more.

But perhaps even that is wrong. My family certianly seem to think so and as you say, they have no agenda except, just an interest in my happiness.

It doesn't help that "his place" consists of a cold bare room without even tv reception in a house that is v. pretty but is in the sticks with virtually no mod cons.. crap heating and hardly any hot water. I feel bloody sorry for him having to live there every night.

Which makes me a fool I am sure.

OP posts:
frekkles · 28/10/2008 11:53

my ex continually said he would change for years, and the first time we split up he did change for a while, and so i took him back. But then after a couple of years the same problems were there. now we've split again, he says he's changed again, and to be honest there are times that i look at him and fall in love again and want him back, as all i ever wanted was for him to be the person he becomes when we split up. but i think i'm coming to terms with the fact that he can only be that person without me. it's going to be hard, especially if he does manage to stay changed and some other girl has all that i wanted from him, but i need to remeber that for some reason our relationship wouldn't work, he couldn't be the person I wanted him to be when he was with me.

ShinyHappyPurpleSeveredHeads · 28/10/2008 11:55

Frekkles that's so sad. For you and him.

I am afraid that H is like your ex. And then I'm afraid that he isn't and that I', going to make a huge mistake and ruin all our lives.

OP posts:
frekkles · 28/10/2008 12:08

i understand that fear, i still have it everyday too and i'm not sure I can advise you, all i can do is say how i feel and maybe it'll help to hear someone else articulate their experience.

i do worry he's my true love, and that i've given up on it, i get really can't up in the romance of us and the way we seem so entwined that it must be meant to be.

but sometimes it feels clear that I've realised that although i share a very deep love for my ex, that that love isn't good for either of us. It doesn't help us to be better people and we don't get the best out of each other. Somehow we encourage each other to act in ways that aren't good for us

I associate the love i have with my ex with pain and passion and sadness.it feels really big and powerful and overwhelming sometimes.

but i think i've realised i actually want to be calm and happy and i want that for him too. so we can't be together

i'm really hoping that eventually the love we have will be a good thing, and we can be friends and love and care for each other without the pain anymore

good luck sweetheart, i'm sure the counselling will help

RantinEminor · 28/10/2008 12:20

I don't know your history. But reading your post the thoughts that come to mind are:

Give it much more time before you make a decision as to whether he has really changed and whether those changes are going to last. Get some counselling yourself before you make any such decision.

Do not rush to a divorce if you do not want it.

Do not let your mother and sister dictate the terms on which your H visits you or your children. He is their father, he has the right to see them and as long as you are happy for him to be there,then they should respect that and support you.

Obviously, he has been a total shit and they are only trying to protect you. But that protection should not extend to demanding that there right to see you is more important than his. He has a duty to look after his disabled child and he should be encouraged to fulfill that duty not obstructed. Obstructing him will only alienate him and make him wonder what the point of getting his shit together actually is.

I vehemently disagree with anybody who says that people cannot change. I know from personal experience that it is possible. With the right conditions people can change. You booting him out has already triggered a change, no? He sounds like he has realised what he could lose and is doing his best to get back on track. That's great, but don't stop that process by (a) allowing your family to persuade you into alienating him or (b) by letting him back into your home to soon.

I would recommend that as long as he is being supportive and making an effort to change and improve himself that you report the good stuff that he does to your mum, sister and friends. If you can see the potential in him, then help them to see it too.

Also, never tell him the nasty stuff they say about him (and vice versa), it doesn't actually achieve anything, except for driving a bigger wedge between him and them. What they think of him is, actually, irrelevant. What you think of him is vital and you need to get some counselling to help you sort out how you do actually feel.

Good luck love. Stay strong.

ShinyHappyPurpleSeveredHeads · 28/10/2008 12:25

Thank you RE. That was fab. I am hovvering round the PC like a saddo waiting for some help to come via Mumsnet. I am such a mess. Each time I think I'm getting my shit together, one person's negative opinion undoes it. It helps to talk to strangers or people who are at least somewhat distanced from the situation.

He has just text me "sorry" whatever that means. I am so confused I don't even know how to reply. Or if to reply.

And I need to take my kids to the park as promised.

OP posts:
ginnny · 28/10/2008 12:27

Shiny you shouldn't feel guilty about upsetting your family. Its your life and he's your husband at the end of the day. He shouldn't have texted them but they also shouldn't be putting pressure on you. Whatever happens between you two he will always be the dc's dad and will spend time with them and your family may well bump into him from time to time. They will just have to accept that.
Obviously it will take time and you shouldn't rush into any decisions, but imo there is nothing wrong with enjoying the moment and hoping for the future. If he is making you happy now, in whatever way, just enjoy it.
Your family love you and want the best for you, and in their eyes to get him out of the equation is the best solution, but its never that clear cut.
I am trying to make it work with my dp after a few years of hell. It took a very nasty break up and him meeting someone else for us to realise we wanted to be together and now although its early days, we are very strong. If my friends and family had their way I'd never have seen him again after what happened, but then I wouldn't be where as happy as I am now if I'd listened to them.
Sorry, that's really rambling isn't it.

ShinyHappyPurpleSeveredHeads · 28/10/2008 12:29

That's encouraging Ginny. Good for you (both).

God I must feed these children.

OP posts:
ginnny · 28/10/2008 12:30

Just seen RantinEminor's post and it was exactly what I wanted to say ... except mine came out in a long jumbled mess

RantinEminor · 28/10/2008 12:31

It's hard to close your ears to what your friends and family say. But sometimes you have to. If I'd listened to the opinions of my mum and sister, I wouldn't be where I am now which, fortunately, is a very good place. However, through my difficult patch I did have the support of an objective therapist who had no personal involvement or agenda and with whom I could be 100% honest. I really, really recommend you get yourself the same help.

RantinEminor · 28/10/2008 12:33

Cross-posts with Ginny

frekkles · 28/10/2008 12:46

every situation is going to be different and there's noone here who can advise you what your husband is likely to do in the future. but having thought about it and read rantinemor and ginny's posts my advise to you would be to realise that it's within your power to feel ok, regardless of what your decision is. Take ownership of that decision, be honest with yourself about the reasons why you've taken it and make an effort to back yourself up when you have arguments in your head.

bamzooki · 28/10/2008 14:13

Shiny - I totally agree with everyone who has said to give it all more time, and that the counselling for both of you will be vital.
With his addictive behaviour I would imagine that it will take quite a while for him to 're-program' as it were, in a lasting way. If he were to be allowed back to a familiar setting too soon, it may be too easy to fall back on old habits. Just like you wouldn't expect an alcoholic to spend nights in the pub after a brief spell on the wagon.

BUT - alcoholics do recover, with the right mind-set and support, and I personally don't see that you should write-off your H just yet. Give him a chance to demonstrate that he has the will to stay with the program, while keeping yourself in a safe enough place mentally in case he cannot maintain this current stability.

And can you find a way to tell your family to back off, while also expressing that you understand and share their reservations and aren't going to rush into anything before you are satisfied that your H is far enough along the road to recovery?

You are managing this so well so far, keep strong, and I'm sure no-one is fed up of hearing from you.

HappyWoman · 28/10/2008 16:29

shiny i am glad you are back i wondered what had happened to you.
I do believe people can change too - i hope to god my h has - and so far he has.
I took my h back and even now cannot bring myself to make a promise to him that it will be forever (i did that once when we married - so i dont need to do it again anyway).

Dont feel guilty if it does not work out - he has continued to destroy it all over and over again, please dont forget that - this is not your fault.

He may have now realised what he may lose/has lost.
unfortunately he and you may have to accept that other relationships will have already been lost forever (this too has happened for us).

Take each day at a time and dont fret that you are doing the wrong thing - time will tell if it is meant to be and if he continues to be the lovely h you want him too i am sure your family will learn to accept this.

Take care of yourself - you have been through a lot and will be grieving for the marriage you thought you had and had worked so hard for.

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