How do we help DS? 13, ASD, no idea how to do friendships, daily meltdowns

[SandwichMakerHater]

I wasn't sure where to put this but I know this board is always supportive and good at signposting to the right help.

DS is 13, has ASD. Very academic and quiet at school, avoids having any kind of attention, eg won't say hello first but seems to have a good group of friends and they have a group whatsapp.

If you don't want to read the whole thing, to summarise:
We are lost. We have no idea how to help him develop friendships and see them as partnerships where he is equal and can influence, rather than as a follower who wants to join in but only ever gets to do what others suggest/initiate.

He is very black and white, barely contributes to chats "because i see them every day at school", will never initiate conversation, eg he got upset at Christmas because a planned meet up didn't happen "because they didn't mention it in the chat" but when i suggested he ask them, he said no. If a school trip or club comes up, he won't ask if anyone is interested, so if they don't ask, he'd risk missing out than being the one to ask.
He's in Y8 and has never seen any of these friends outside of school. He's been excited by the idea of meet ups but will never ask about them. At the start of Y7, he would cycle 2 miles to a park near their houses after school (then 4 miles back to ours) and never once suggested they go to the park that's a mile between where they all live. That stopped after a month and he's done nothing with them since.

Things have come to a head: he bought (from his savings) a games console because that's the one his friends use, so it would give him more chances to play with them. We did the research with him, were happy with the games being talked about.
Turns out, the group are all playing 18-rated games. We won't let him play these, as much for the content as for the addictiveness. He is very obsessive, for instance will watch a 15-series programme over a course of weeks then start it all over again. There is also addiction in one side of the family so I'm very consious of trying to keep healthy balances of activities.

So, we are now into our 7th day of meltdowns: asking to discuss the 18-rated games, us trying to calmy explain our concerns, him ending up a sobbing, curled up mess saying it's the only thing that will make him happy, it's the only thing that will keep the friendships going.
He now hates the game console because he says the only reason he wanted it was to play with them. Won't consider asking them if they fancy playing a different game, won't ask if they want to do anything in real. We feel so lost and upset, and to be honest, helpless. His meltdowns are more shutdowns and it's impossible to say anything that feels like it helps. He won't even let us hold him.

Does anyone have any advice please, or books/websites, how to help an extremely passive ASD early teen navigate friendships, and maybe help him to build confidence to ask things to his friends?

I would let him play the games. This is how the teens connect and most of them are fine. What games are the others playing?

It sounds really difficult for you all.

Could he do something ‘else’ that he has control of, Scouts? Swimming? Something else fairly low demand.

These friends don’t really sound like particularly good friends at all and dancing around them trying to fit in is always going to be a struggle and never quite work out. He’d be far better with something that he was in control of.

You have more or less described my son. He doesn’t have ASD but does struggle with certain social interactions. I would say that what you have said sums up what year 8 boys do. They aren’t as social at this age compared to girls. Their idea of socialising at weekends is gaming. Mine plays football and rugby at weekends, and only when he has done that so I let him game with his friends (albeit not 18 rated games).

its hard over winter and limited options for pre teens to do. Last week I took my son and his friends to the local bowling alley to just play in the arcades and pool tables. It killed a couple of hours. I had to initial this with the other mum though, otherwise it wouldn’t have happened. Are you close enough to the other mums to suggest an activity - you may well have to give up an afternoon to be the taxi driver though! Good luck, it’s tough.

Does school have have any social skills groups? Or lunch time clubs he can join?

I’ve been there op. You’re doing the right thing with regards to the games. Stick to your guns he has to understand this is not going to happen. He will eventually accept it. I know it’s hard when they meltdown over things like this but it’s for his own good. These games are so damaging and when you have ASD in the mix and they obsess, then it quickly becomes a bigger problem.

as for the rest in my experience with my dd it just takes time. The confidence grew for ours through year 9. And another thing that helped her was being around other ASD children. We have a local group meet up. Understanding herself by learning more in depth about autism was good for her. But even now in her Kate teens she doubts her social interactions. Doesn’t really want close friends and prefers her own company. But she does socialise occasionally and will ask to join in things.

My DS is 13 and also doesn’t really initiate meet ups either. His friends from school all play Call of Duty, FIFA and Fortnite and he hates all those games. So instead has found his own geeky little tribe online playing very niche driving games, where you have to follow the rules of the road, they have server rules and regulations (eg you have to complete a google form about the Highway Code before you are allowed to join and if you swear you are immediately kicked off the server!) so he has his online life and his school life. We obviously monitor who he is interacting with etc and can hear him shouting ‘use your indicators!’ I think that some element of following the crowd is natural at this age, and boys can seem very passive. Try to see the positives in that has a group of friends and he’s not being picked on at school. As a secondary school teacher, that’s huge. Plenty of kids (particularly those with SEN) don’t. Would I let him play the 18 rated games? Probably occasionally yes, with some supervision and rules in place.

My son is also desperate for a social media app that he claims all his friends use to communicate but I won’t let him have it. It’s so hard to see them upset but stick to you guns and be as clear explaining your reasons to him. One day he’ll understand why you protected him against it

I think finding him other ASD friends would really help. Would he be interested in something like dungeons and dragons?

Nothing useful to add, but this is both adorable and really amazing. There's so much negativity around the internet/digital etc which i think is totally valid, but i love that it means people can find their tribe, no matter how niche their interests.

Also, if it means a whole cohort of future drivers who use their indicators correctly, I'm all for it 😃

My 19 year anniversary of DD has ASD, she was ever similar at school, and very similar with friendships.

My main advice is not to push it with friendships, leave him to it, he’ll find his tribe eventually.

With the gaming, I’ve not policed what DD does on-line since she was 15. She’s a gamer, and her computer and her gaming helps her to regulate her emotions. The deal was that she did what she wanted, but, she had to be (physically) where she needed to be - Drs appointments etc. it wasn’t easy standing back, bit worked for us.

She has friends from all over the world from Gaming, most of which she has never met in real life, but they are a good little community. She finally (at 19) seems to be managing much better either “real life” friends as well.

Parenting an ASD Teen is difficult, you’ll find more advice on the SN Teens board.

Have you checked the reviews on commonsensemedia? If its something like assassins creed / call of duty, there are often settings to disable gore etc.

Let him play the game - this is what you'd be told by an OT! Your son's becoming a teenager and fitting in will become more important than it ever has been.
Whatever it is about the game that puts you off, he's going to be exposed to that in real life either by listening to his friends discussing it, or another way. Better to be open, let him play the game and be there to discuss it and any issues that arise. He may not really like it, he may just use it as a way to connect with his friends, but give him a chance.

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Wow, I didn't expect such a response as it was so long. To answer some questions:

We don't feel like he could handle some of these games, it's not just the explicit content, it's the addictiveness and the tone of them, it's hard to explain. He's a very young 13, I'd say emotionally like a lot of late primary kids, still uses soft toys for comfort, cried at the shock/injustice of someone scamming him in a game of adopt me (he felt rushed into a trade that was a bad deal) as he can't understand why people would do something mean deliberately, etc etc. We watched a film a while ago that was a PG but was a bit sad at the end: he had to sleep with me for a few nights because he couldn't stop thinking about what happened to the characters.

Maybe we will revisit in a few months but he is so emotionally volatile and also obsessed with the next dopamine hit. I can imagine that if we gave in, within a month something that moves the boundary further would be obsessed over.

I don't think the friends are a problem, I just think they are doing what they want and if he's not speaking up then they have no way of knowing he wants to do different.

He won't do after school clubs ("why would i stay at school if i don't have to?") even if it's something he loves. He does do a sport at weekends and scouts which he loves.

I will ask school if there's anything they could suggest, like a 121 session or group social skills. Problem is, if it's optional he will probably say no.
We try to suggest ways to increase independence but he is so fixed on these games, and that they are the ONLY way to improve his friendships.

He is so passive that he has no idea whether any of them are into any of his other interests, and he won't ask them. I think he just wants to fit in and if they are playing adult games then maybe he's aware that announcing he likes pokemon or playmobil could put a target on his back.

Does anyone know if there is something similar to "how to talk so your kids will listen" with help for ASD teens? I feel like we've tried so many ways to communicate but his patience and window for listening is so short, if you get it wrong then you've lost that cobversation!

Op I just wanted to comment because my daughter is autistic and I live in a permanent state of anxiety and heartbreak about the social side of things - so I hugely hugely sympathise.

I'm going to make a few suggestions and if they are useless just ignore

There are autistic /ND friendly gaming groups and clubs - I don't know the names but you can google and find people for him to play with -

Is it possible to check with the other adults /parents if there is any game they could all play?

radical thought - sometimes I think I need to let go! Could you just let go of this? and accept he finds it too stressful to do the social stuff outside school at the moment? it sounds like he does a couple of clubs - is that enough for him? He must find school exhausting

How big a town do you live in? I live in a smallish city so we have ND / autism family support groups - I go on facebook and can ask 'any other ND 13 year olds who want to do X and X'

If there isn't a group like this - set one up?

I help run a group that supports ND girls and their parents - its amazing - my child has not made a friend throught it but I have made friends!

find your people/ his people/ your tribe

and try not to worry about him not connecting with others in the same way - it literally may be that he is not able to at the moment but he will find his way in time.

also - could school connect him with some other ND kids?

https://the-a-game.co.uk/

https://mindjam.org.uk/

two online groups for ND kids

These are unlikely to be healthy friendship for him to develop if they are playing 18+ games and he's 13 and ASD for a whole pile of reasons.

Whilst he's desperate for friends capitulating and allowing him to play them just so he can fit with this set of friends isn't going to end well.

He wil hate it but it's your job to protect him and parent him. This isn't an easy situation for you to navigate but you are just going to have to ride this one out unfortunately.

What games are they? GTA maybe not but other 18 are more violent than sexual so maybe those be ok.

I'd let him play but with
Boundaries you're comfortable with. Teens boys socially particularly revolve around gaming so it's cutting him off from that.

@waterrat your post resonates quite a lot.

He does find school exhausting. He is "perfect" according to his teachers, quiet, ignores banter and just stares at the teacher until class resumes, but then at home he has to lay down, eat and relax.

I'm happy with the amount of sport/scouts, but apart from that, he does seem lonely. He will ask to meet up with his bestie from primary, but he's a lot busier than us. So he's showing he wants social interaction, but only with the friend who knows him best and is quirky too.

and try not to worry about him not connecting with others in the same way - it literally may be that he is not able to at the moment but he will find his way in time.
I try to keep this in mind: his idea of friendship won't be mine. Up until now, that's been fine, he's seemed happy with not bothering with friends but it's like this gaming has made him hyper-focused on the idea that it will get him closer to them.

I don't know the parents and have only seen a couple of the boys in passing, none are from his primary so there's never been a chance to meet. So i have no idea if they are nice kids or actually if they might be ripping him to shreds for our parenting rules. I only have snippets to try and piece bigger pictures together, he tells us very little but for instance his mate will swap yo-yo fruit packs with him and the whatsapp chat is full of pretty silly, innocent stuff, nothing inappropriate, no sign of deleted messages, etc.

I will talk to DH about it to see how we can try to encourage different groups or gaming forums. I will also look into the 18+ games further, for my own education. It's COD and GTA that he wants.

@RedToothBrush this is how i feel instinctively. It's the passive following that worries me more than the specific subject of the games being requested. We need to foster a feeling of self-worth and having a voice that can be valued by his friends, itherwise who knows what he might be pulled into in a couple of years.

Thanks for all the ideas so far. I will do some reading up.

oh I really hear you on the pain of things like them wanting to see old primary friends - but that child is busier/ has other friends - it's like you just can't ever relax with these kids as they need so much more support with friendships than a 'normal' 13 year old.

I also think that in a more gentle smaller society my child would be more social/playful - and that modern life, huge secondaries, distant communities - just make it hard for these kids as they can't quite manage what is required of them...

Kids with ASD tend to be younger for their ages than the average. So the friendships may not come till GCSE years or even 6th form.

One of my nieces, who I think is probably on the spectrum, didn't have any friends at all at primary or secondary but she did Latin and then Greek summer schools at the end of year 11 and year 12 and met like minded people. She moved to a new 6th form, made a bunch of friends and is now at university studying Classics and seems to have a great social life.

MindJam: Emotional and SEN support for Young People https://share.google/snqTjnWyp3G1CSh0u I often see this recommended on here.