Tell me what you think about my relationship

[ForPlumDreamer]

We’ve been together for 7 years (F33 M38), when we met I was doing a second degree, had lots of friends and social life and was in a very good, very independent place.

He had lots of hobbies and opened my eyes to things I’d never considered doing before, I was drawn to the adventure, but wasn’t entirely sure about the man, he was very good looking and was very determined to be with me, but I didn’t have an overwhelming desire.

We didn’t see eachother constantly as we had our own hobbies and we just sort of fell into step with a relationship.

A year in, I asked if he wanted to live together as we both were living in shared places and he said no. I moved out of sharing with friends and rented my own flat. He was there so often that I gave him a key, he’d come round and cook while I was at fitness classes etc and it was nice to come home to but the space wasn’t really big enough for 2 and he was there most of the time.

So when he bought himself a bigger flat and , he asked if I wanted to move into his place. It was the logical thing to do, but it didn’t really feel right and I really struggled with the decision and whether to leave my lovely studio and my independence. I wished we’d got a place together rather than my stepping into his.

I moved in in March 2020. We were almost immediately locked down together and it was awful. Our hobbies had to end and we were forced to be together 24/7 and it was unbearable. I broke social distancing multiple times to go and see and stay with my mum to get space.

On an intimacy level by this point we already had a slowed down sex life, and very minimal intimacy outside of it. He doesn’t hug or touch instinctively so it was all driven by me. I wanted to leave him but the fear of the pandemic made me stay in the safe place.

I don’t really remember what happened that summer but my the end of it I felt like it was us against the world. We went on a holiday to wales and had a great time, we really connected with the nature and eachother and I remember it feeling like we were committed to eachother forever.

A month later, I was pregnant.

At first he suggested an abortion, I couldn’t bring myself to, and we were in a good place and committed to each other now anyway, and it felt right to go ahead. I realise now how ill prepared we were, we had to move house, buy everything and mentally prepare for parent hood. We got there and it was okay! But motherhood was soo much harder than I expected, I felt so responsible and lost a lot of independence and autonomy.

I recall my mum asking him if he was going to make me an honest woman, and he said “if I didn’t love her and want to be with her, then I wouldn’t be. So it’s proof that I love her that I’m here. Marriage is just paperwork” that has always been his attitude. That his presence is enough.

He was and still is a good hands on Dad, he got involved in everything. I could tell he was smitten with our daughter from her very first second on the planet.

Our relationship was now centred around the baby and we became sort of dutiful and habitual parents. I struggled with the financial dependency during mat leave and felt like although he was a high earner that I didn’t really want to brave asking for money to get regular highlights like I did pre children etc and really let myself go quite a lot. He stopped doing his hobbies in lock down and didn’t pick them up again once it stopped, so we both sort of lost ourselves and let our appearances slide a bit.

after 18 months I raised the question of trying for another baby, I’d never wanted an only child and we were in the thick of it now anyway so why not go the whole hog, it’s not like we were going anywhere!

We did it, but by this time we’d moved to a rural renovation and I was feeling incredibly isolated. All our local friends were his, I wasn’t working and I felt like I had to ask him for money to look after myself, renovate the house etc etc. I threw myself into renovations as it made me happy but I felt so overwhelmed and unlike myself.

i realised when my first was born that I wished we’d married so I’d have her name but whenever I mentioned it, he went quiet or would roll his eyes and tell me it’s unnecessary. I grieved the wedding day dreams and said no more.

Eventually, I realised I needed to get back into society. Get a better job, move closer to my network, and try to regain a semblance of my former self.

I’m now a year in to the new version, well paid but full time job, kids at school and nursery and I’ve lost the baby weight, starting getting my highlights again and feel like I recognise myself again.

our relationship has definitely suffered through this as I’ve less time for him, for the kids and I’ve got more social events in my calendar so can’t just mush on the sofa every night side by side anymore. He heavily encouraged me to leave my job as it’s very demanding but I remembered the feeling of being financially dependent on him and refused.

I really thought that me returning to something like the person he first met might be good for us, but honestly, I don’t think he’s noticed. We still have a stagnant sex life and I’m not touched outside of it. He’s still never offered me a hug and hasn’t complimented my new appearance once.

At home, he is so good with the kids, and our life centres around them. He cooks fresh meals. Does all the grocery shopping and the dishes. We do one drop off, pick up and a bedtime each every day and the household work feels manageable. We still keep our finances separate which is fine now I’m paid better, but I know we’d be better off sharing budgets.

the one thing I struggle with is autonomy, with him cooking for me, I feel obliged to be sat waiting for my food at the same time every day and then obliged to stay there till bed time and go to bed together, just for him to start snoring before I fall asleep so I’m stuck there awake. I just want some control over that side of my life without seeming ungrateful for his cooking.

I see so many posts about women leaving bad men, about single parenting in their marriage so going solo was no problem.

I sometimes dream about separating and trying to find a loving partner. .

But would I be stupid to leave him, when it’s functional, low conflict, we have a nice house together and the kids are still little and he does 50% of the work?

I dream about being with a man who loves me and takes interest in me and gives me the physical affection I’m severely lacking. not one who couldn’t care less about my interests, who couldn’t tell you when my birthday is and dismisses my needs and who has domesticated me and made me dependent, basically made me a wife, but won’t marry me as he’s well aware that this isn’t love.

My needs are so suppressed that I know we could do this for decades. But I’m only 33, I still look young and now I’ve sorted myself out, I can turn heads again. Do I idly let my romantic life disappear for the sake of the kids ?

I don't think you want advice, I think you want validation.
It sounds like you want to leave and you should if you're not getting what you need and want from the relationship.
But maybe voice how you're feeling in case he can make some changes?

This sounds like an uncomfortable, lonely existence, OP.
Your thoughts, feelings, needs and desires are all valid, and utterly reasonable. Would it be helpful to write him a letter, expressing your needs, couched within what is good about your relationship and things that you appreciate about him and your current life?
It sounds like counselling, on your own, with a relationship expert, might be helpful in finding validation, and ways to be heard. And in considering what happens next if you are not heard.

What are you getting out of this relationship now?.

What do you want to teach your children about relationships and what are they learning here?.
You would not went them to have such a relationship as adults and it’s not good enough for you either.

What does he do the rest of the day?. Does he work outside the home?. Cooking etc is not taking up all his time. What is the situation re the property: is it jointly rented or mortgaged? .

He has done well for himself at your expense and the kids have his surname. That was yet more power you all too freely handed over to him along with subsuming your desire to get married before kids. His decision not to marry you is also deliberate: he basically thinks you’re good enough to live with but not to marry. I also think your relationship is low conflict because you do not say anything to otherwise annoy him. He still wields the greater amount of power and control in this relationship and you are dismissed accordingly.

If you stay with this man for your own reasons you will never achieve your dreams. And the kids won’t say thanks mum for staying with him either. The kids also should not be used as glue to keep the two of you together; the only good to have come out if this union at all are your golden. You had your doubts back then and went into minimise them.

I’m not sure how much the kids see as he’s very open and funny and loving with them! And we don’t row or bicker in front of them.

He has a full time job, remote, so he works from home every day. And we have a cleaner so my workload isn’t too bad.

We share the house 50/50.

I didn’t click that he held a lot of power, but it made sense when you said it. It’s low conflict because as soon as he has an opinion, I don’t feel like it’s worth the row to go against it

This is quite sad to read, OP.

It sounds like you weren't certain about it from the start but he ticked some of the boxes that were important to you (good looking, a well paid career, interesting hobbies that you also took an interest in) but ignored how he actually made you feel in the relationship. It sounds like you pretty much sleep walked into your current situation and now that's just got too big for you to ignore.

That's not a criticism; just an observation from what you've written. You're not the first and you certainly won't be the last to do so!

Lockdown possibly contributed to this - a very unnatural time when time seem to pass by but also stand still.

And now you find yourself living a life that you passively accepted rather than actively chose in some respects.

He does seem to hold the power but, to a degree, this is because you have allowed him to. You had children with him despite the fact he wouldn't marry even though that was what you wanted. You didn't have equal access to money when you were on maternity leave but chose to have a second child with him.

None of this is to put the blame or responsibility for the situation on to you but to point out that you could have made different decisions at every point. And you do have agency in your own life.

Have you actually talked to.him.about this?

You seem to have achieved so much on one hand - a second degree, a nice home, two children, a good job/income but are lacking the foundations of a really strong and good relationship to have built it all on.

Your life/relationship seem functionally good but it doesn't meet your emotional needs at all.

I would suggest, in the first instance, an open and honest conversation with him. Share how you feel rather than criticise him (eg "I feel..." statements rather than "You always/never..." statements).

Your relationship sounds very low conflict because you don't challenge or tackle issues rather than because there are no issues.

Does he really know and understand how you feel about sex and the lack of physical/emotional intimacy otherwise? Does he know how you felt about not having access to money for highlights etc? If you'd mentioned it, would he have talked about 'his' money? Or would he have been shocked you felt that way? Did he think if you'd wanted those things you'd have just asked without realising you didn't want to ask?

You're right, parenthood can feel like a huge shock if you've always been a very independent person and suddenly you're not. You didn't anticipate it. Did he? Did he see it? Did you show him? Or did you just keep everything to yourself. Basically, does he know how you feel?

At 33, you're so young and you can't go on living like this indefinitely. It will destroy you.

I think the only thing to do in the first instance is to talk openly and honestly. You need to understand each other rather than travelling through life with blinkers on only looking at the parts of it you each want to see.

Only then will you know whether this is something you can both put right or not.

Yes but he’s not open or loving with you and the kids will eventually pick up on that. You’re both setting the blueprint for their relationships as adults and this is not a relationship model to be showing them. You’re showing them a loveless example of a relationship. S

He’s learnt from you also that what he says goes. There’s little to no conflict precisely and only because you’re not saying anything to upset the apple cart. You keep quiet and subsume your own reasonable needs and wants. You perhaps did that in childhood too,

From the sounds of it you haven't really wanted this relationship since pre COVID and now feel trapped. Why on earth did you give the kids his surname if you weren't married? You are still young. You have time to be with someone who wants you. Life is too short.

I think if you were happy with the relationship you wouldn’t be posting on here. You need to decide if you want to save the relationship or move on. I don’t think you will be happy coasting along.

I also think either you have either rewritten history for yourself or you’re very passive in your life but the split finances, new job, weight loss and highlights doesn’t sound pasaive to me.

Life is far too short for this mediocre existence.

I agree with this.

I would also suggest that there is sometimes a tendency on MN for women's choices to be put down to an upbringing and socialisation that can't be escaped but then to also blame men's upbringing and socialisation but hold them to a higher standard of accountability whereby they should have realised their worldview was flawed and not fallen into it.

But this is why I think you need to talk to him.

As an aside, my marriage broke down when I was 37 and my children were fine. They would obviously have been better with two loving and happy parents who were together but we couldn't make that happen. Our incompatibilities didn't really emerge until parenthood or we got into our 30s and things we'd each been able to ignore until then suddenly felt 'bigger'. I'm not really sure which it was. But they have both said their dad and I were both happier and the atmosphere at home was lighter once we'd separated. We didn't show them the unhappiness, we didn't criticise each other to or in front of them and he was also very good with the children and around the house. But they still knew.

But it was another few years before either of us were really able to see our own contribution to the breakdown of the marriage. Or where we could have made different decisions when we were younger and first together.

Because its easy to just ignore stuff and push it aside for the greater good and day to day functionality of the relationship/family.

The older you get, the less easy it is to do though.

Difficult to advise but make sure you prioritise the children whatever your decision. So many threads on MN where woman leave their DC father and go in search of the perfect relationship for themselves (it almost never happens), regardless of the DC. The children are left trying to navigate a yo-yo situation (50/50, EOW whatever) when all they really want is one stable home and two parents. And if you do leave don't even think about having more DC with someone else without reading all the trials and tribulations of blended families aired on MN. Personally I would not consider becoming a single parent for want of hugs.

Why did you give the DC his name? That was a crazy move, it is really the only leverage a woman has at what is an extremely vulnerable time in their lives.

I would have your last name added to the DC's names. If he won't agree you can apply to court to have your name added. Take control of your life. I would make the names my first step, as sharing a name with my children is extremely important to me.

I can’t understand why you’ve carried on if you had doubts? Brought a second child into it etc?

He sounds like a decent human, but if he’s not the one for you then split and you can both go and find new partners. I get the impression you’ve got grass is greener syndrome tbh, and overly romanticise life. But perhaps you need to see the other side to be content with the next decisions you make.

I feel for you as it seems like you've been unhappy and isolated for a long time despite the joys of children and getting some independence back.

My advice is that you deserve to be happy and fulfilled too, whether by yourself or with a new partner. It's not an easy decision but you only get one life and have to make the most of it.

Him cooking every night is one of those things that looks good and helpful on paper but once you add in that it is at the same time every night and you have to be sat there and then stay in, it sounds controlling. It doesn’t matter whether it is intentional or not, you have to eat what he cooks, when he cooks it. Eating is a basic human need, which he is controlling. I also think the finances aspect is somewhat controlling and unfair if you are a partnership. To what extent have you discussed a more equal or flexible approach to these aspects of your lives? I personally don’t agree that not having highlights is letting yourself go, but I could not cope with someone else cooking for me every night, and you should be able to discuss finances and not have one partner going short if there is money.

It also sounds like he lost some of his sense of self and who he was/is during the pandemic and parenthood as well, and has gone from an outgoing, adventurous person to one who is in a very small bubble now. Working at home, remotely, looking after DC, cooking every day, it is a safe routine. And it also sounds like the pandemic and parenthood has caused this. So I also wonder how much you have discussed this.

It is difficult to know what to advise here for the best because in some ways, I think you have driven the relationship - you asked him first to live together, you kept the pregnancy (as is your right, I would have done the same thing) and you wanted the second child - as much as him, if not more. This man provided and became a loving father, and I am thinking he probably assumes he is doing the right thing now with the cooking fresh meals and so on, whereas you feel this traps you. The issues now are that he has a family life in a location where he has friends and a routine, and you are lonely and isolated and wondering why on earth you signed up for this. I just wonder how much you have talked to him about all this.

By the way, it is okay to separate if that is what you want to do, but it sounds a bit like to me this man has been trying for the most part to do the right thing and is just not personality wise as flexible or spontaneous or tactile as you want him to be. And has never been, but it was easier to overlook when you fell pregnant and then wanted a second child.

At this point him marrying you won't change him being more affectionate towards you, he seems like a good hardworking guy and loves you and the kids...but unfortunately his just not the affectionate type ...have you ever talked to him about this? About what you need and want from him ...
The grass ain't greener on the other side, yes you might find someone more fun and pays attention to your needs, but they will lack in other departments....try to talk to him and make him understand your frustration..maybe he needs telling.

Maybe you could elaborate on what you said about it not being worth the row to go against his opinion.

One of the things I learned on a course once which felt enormously helpful was that conflict can lead to creativity. It is not pleasant but if you are looking for a solution which suits both people, it is necessary.

The other thing I learned on a course years ago was that taking things apart is also useful as you can then put them together in different and better ways. So this meant looking at all the different components of a problem separately and if you can change any of the separate parts to make a new whole. Of course, it also means you can separate everything entirely (split up) and make a different looking whole (two houses and shared parenting) which works better but it also could mean breaking up the components of the situation as it currently exists and discussing what can be changed to see if things can be improved (which comes back to the first point about communication and conflict).

The way you wrote your post makes it sound like you knew all along he wasn't the one for you. But is that true, or have you put a spin on it with hindsight? If true, why did you let it continue in your mid 20s? If it's not the case, what changed along the way - circumstances obviously changed a lot, but which made the most impact? I understand the lack of affection is hard but have you ever tried to address it? With both of you working full time, two young children and no attempt to maintain hobbies, life can seem more like a job, and the fun things get pushed out. The only aspect that stands out to me in a more clear cut way is his refusal to marry you. I'd feel disrespected by that and that we weren't truly partners.

I'd suggest you need to talk openly and honestly - counselling would help you to do this.

This reads like you are looking for validation for a decision you have already taken.

It sounds like you don’t really communicate. You bring up marriage occasionally but you haven’t really had a conversation about what the long-term plans were and long-term ambitions. It sounds to me like you and stumbled into a dysfunctional arrangement and are now thinking about stumbling out of it.

Staying as you are seems like a bad idea, as you will build resentment (you seem to have a lot already) and eventually this will become untenable. I’m not sure the usual MN advice to jump ship straight away is a good approach. You don’t seem to have tried much in terms of fixing things. You seem to have expended a lot of time and effort in things that won’t fix the situation and consider that to be sufficient. Given the level of dysfunction I’m not sure being married is a great idea but this seems to be a bid issue for you.

Perhaps there is a lot you haven’t mentioned, but if not I think there are things you need to be thinking about doing before hoping out of this and seeing if you prefer the 50% custody single mum life is preferable. Perhaps you would be better off but you may find there is no going back and you wish you had been more certain.