Bereavement - 11yr old - exp

[snemrose]

I think I am being totally unreasonable here as in my head whatever exp does will be wrong.

Exp mum has just died. Dc was very close to her. Exp lives over an hour away. Whilst exp and I haven’t always had the best of parenting relationships I have been supportive in his bereavement, e.g. he couldn’t have dc due to the death, didn’t pay maintenance as he is self employed and not worked much the last few weeks due to parent being ill which I have said was fine (even though he finds many reasons not to pay and currently owes me over £3k)

The problem I have is two fold. Firstly the funeral - nothing has been discussed yet but I am of the opinion that 11yr olds are old enough to attend a funeral. However, and this is where I know I am being unreasonable - I don’t imagine exp will be able to come down and collect dc in order to attend the funeral and even if he does exp won’t be in a fit state to watch over dc which means he would leave it to his new partner (if she attends) the thing is - we have it agreed via a CAO that she is not involved in dc life. But - I will be annoyed if ds isn’t considered to attend the funeral. I think exp can’t win with me in this case.

The next issue moving forward is according to the CAO all contact between ds and exp is at his parents house and, again, his new partner is not involved. This worked whilst exp’s mum was alive but now I am worried how it will change and what that will look like. I still stand by exps new partner should not be involved but if exp is unable to take ds to his parents now his mum is gone then he may suddenly push for it despite reiterating to court and ss that he agrees it is not a good idea.

I realise there are no answers as none of these things have happened yet but it is how my mind works, already thinking of future problems and wanting to be prepared with answers/solutions.

Fwiw I like and respected exp mum a lot and am gutted she has died and even more devastated my dc has been left without an amazing nan.

My DH's exW came to my (our) MIL's funeral. We are all on good terms. She wanted to pay her respects too.

Would it be an option for you to attend with your DD?

Unfortunately I can’t - that was my first thought. I would genuinely liked to have been there to pay my respect and thanks but it just isn’t possible.

With regards to the funeral then as you can’t attend I think you have answered your own question - it won’t work to let your DC go. Your exp is unlikely to be in a position to look after them or collect them and you are clear his partner should not be involved - realistically how do you envisage it working unless there is another relative who could look after DC - but do they know DC sufficiently well ? I think your expectations about being annoyed if DC isn’t considered are in reality being unreasonable , particularly as you can’t go yourself. DC doesn’t need to be at the funeral they could light a candle to remember nan, lay some flowers at a place special to them.

Regarding contact perhaps you should speak to exp once the funeral is over and everyone can think a bit more clearly. Why are you assuming exp will be unable to take DC to his parents house now his mum has gone - is his dad still alive and there ? If so the arrangement might be able to continue. Take a deep breath and allow yourself to grieve exp mum and agree on the funeral first. Then speak with exp about contact to understand what his thoughts are - this won’t get resolved immediately with the funeral still to take place and you aren’t helping yourself by jumping several steps ahead in the immediate aftermath of her death.

I think any potential solutions people here can suggest will be down to why your cao is written as it is. Why is the new partner legally forbidden, highly unusual, at 11 normally dc are allowed to decide too

I wouldn’t let an 11 year old go to funeral it’s not emotionally appropriate, your ExP will not be able to look after him/her and as you can’t go it would be better if you and child mark the day privately just the two of you. Maybe make a memory box together. Children (which 11 years is) are not emotionally equipped to navigate these emotions alone as a mother id have thought you would want to be there to support him/her if they get overwhelmed. This would be a absolute no from me as a parent

Well it sounds like your Ex will be damned if he wants DC to go and damned if he doesn't so not sure what it is you want to be honest! Your ex is likely to have his partner with him for support so if you don't allow DC to be around them then I don't see how DC could go?

I would wait until funeral is over to discuss contact details with ex and where contact could take place - it's obviously going to need to change and both of you need to agree something that works for DC.

It's rather unusual for a child arrangement order to specify that ex's 'new' (I assume they've been together for some time) partner must not do any step parenting. What's the reason for this? Do they have child abuse convictions, on the sex offenders register?

I think if you cant bring her then she doenst get ro go.

It obviously all depends on the reason why she is not allowed contact with your dc.

If it is an established relationship and she is not a bad person then I think it is probably a good time to revise the CAO.

Is the reason you can’t go to the funeral the same as why the new partner can’t see DC?
If so, what is the issue? Is it something that’s solvable or can be moved on from? It seems to be causing more complications when everyone would benefit from simplifying things.

I can’t go to the funeral as I am unable to take the time off work at short notice for a non blood relative plus my car is in the garage so I have no transport.

Exp and I both, independently, put in our recommendations for the CAO that his partner should not be involved due to her instability and her children - we represented ourselves at court and the reason we went was so that we had everything in writing and official and neither of us could be arseholes to each other with future arrangements. It has worked very well for us and enabled our co parenting relationship to improve.

Re the funeral I agree that exp can’t win - I think it is annoying me that ds maybe not even considered regarding the funeral so a conversation wouldn’t even happen and that upsets me because ds nana basically did the majority of care for ds from when he was a baby on the times exp had him. I feel as though he is being forgotten but I recognise that is my issue. E.g. exp gave up his weekend with ds when his mum died (understandable) but exp and his siblings met up with their dad with their dc in tow so my ds was the only one left out but I get that is harsh of me and I won’t raise it.

I disagree that 11yr olds shouldn’t go to funerals - unfortunately I had to accompany my oldest dc to his dad’s funeral when he was just 11 and it really helped his grieving process. But in this situation I can’t see how ds can attend.

Moving forward - yes I am borrowing tomorrows troubles today regarding future contact so I need to stop my brain going into overdrive and overthinking. It’s just a lot, she was my ds’s only nana and she was wonderful.

The issue is you won’t allow your exp girlfriend to be in the picture. You may have valid reasons for that / but that’s the problem

I think he can still watch his child. I had both my kids there at my dad’s funeral. I’d think at 11 he is old enough to attend.

It’s a mutual decision between exp and I, more driven by him.

I agree he is old enough. I will have to think more if I can make it work to attend so I can be the one to support him there if exp can’t. I would probably have to take unpaid leave which alongside maintenance issues and transport issues make it a real headache which I appreciate sounds callous of me.
Ds may not even want to attend - he hasn’t asked about it and exp hasn’t said anything about it so it’s probably my brain giving me problems that haven’t even happened yet. I’m just gutted. Gutted for ds. Gutted for ds nana who adores him and was so close to him. And selfishly, gutted that the almost pleasant status quo we have worked so hard to achieve could possibly change. Exp mum was a sensible woman and never took sides and didn’t take any crap off exp and I am worried how the future looks without her influence with regard to ds and exp. Again, probably overthinking it all massively - so I will just wait and see what happens and deal with it whatever comes up.

If your DS can't attend in the end, can you (and whoever else in the family is appropriate to attend) hold a semi-formal service of remembrance/thanksgiving/something that feels like a proper cathartic occasion?

I think that’s the thing - I feel as though her death needs to be marked for ds. His day to day life at home with me obviously hasn’t changed but when he next goes to see his dad (no idea when that will be at the moment as exp dad isn’t coping well with loss of his wife obviously) it will be like a wall of grief hitting him I think. Again, I am probably overthinking it.
I can definitely do a rememberance type thing with ds here at home, that’s a good idea.

Sorry for your loss OP.

A lot of funerals are live streamed and can be watched back these days - it’s become a lot more common since covid. This might be something to check with your ex as it could allow DC to watch the service with your support?

It’s a mutual decision between exp and I, more driven by him.

It's driven by him that his current partner shouldn't have anything to do with your DC? He must think pretty lowly of her, why is he even with this woman if he thinks she's too 'unstable' to be around kids??

Sorry if I've missed it, but when does your ds want to do about the funeral? Have you asked him/has he expressed a preference? If he later looks back on it and feels he was prevented from going/wasn't given the option, then it may cause some resentment. If he says he doesn't want to go then problem averted, if he says he does want to attend the funeral then you and your ex need to find a way to make it happen. If you're both in agreement, then you can deviate from the CAO (get something in writing though, even if just a text message).

@cool4cats2020 because exp knows she is unstable, there are issues with her children, no safe place for ds to sleep at their house and their relationship is volatile. Why they are together is not for me to question as it doesn’t impact my life and exp still got to see ds every other weekend (Friday to Sunday) at his parents house. This is as per the CAO and has worked well for years.

Ds hasn’t mentioned anything about the funeral - I will be honest I don’t think it has occurred to him. This is the first death he has encountered. I have been thinking about it this evening and whilst I think it is important to go to funerals I don’t actually think he will want to. Unless he finds out his cousins have gone (younger than him) then I think that would upset him. I am leaning more towards doing something special at home - planting a shrub, writing a letter, remembering her. I will just be annoyed if ds attending her funeral is not even raised but that is my issue and I will have to suck it up.

As I said previously, I am ok that exp can’t pay maintenance this month due to bereavement- but he has already defaulted 4 times this year for various reasons and now owes the cms £1.5k whilst owing me £1,5k from before cms got involved that I will never see - my worry is that now his mum has gone, who was somewhat of a steadying force on him, he will literally go rogue and decide suddenly his new partner is better, he doesn’t have to pay maintenance, and all our good work will go to waste re our co parenting relationship. But again, I am borrowing tomorrow’s troubles today and I really need to stop doing that.

I trusted ds would be looked after going up there every other weekend because his nana was there. Even if exp had to work at the weekend - nana would care for him. That has gone now.

11 year olds are absolutely old enough to attend a funeral

My dd is now 12 but was 11 when my best friend died in January, we have her the choice and she chose to attend. From the day my friend died to the day of the funeral I think dd uttered about 5 words at home. She was devastated by it. The funeral gave her closure and she spoke for the first time in weeks.

@snemrose is there a friend you trust who could take ds? A God parent maybe? My sm took her godchildren to their dads funeral when they were very young, he had told so many lies about their mum that she was banned from attending but mum has always remained close friends with them both.

I agree 11yr olds are old enough to attend a funeral. All my friends work full time and I honestly can’t think any of them could take a day off at short notice to drive ds an hour away (and back) to a funeral where they know no one?

Even when I took my older ds (also then 11) to his own dad’s funeral (his dad and I weren’t together) he was very much sidelined and ignored despite being the only child. This time with my ds3 there are siblings, cousins etc so ds isn’t pivotal to being there if that makes sense? I think he would find it awkward as there is so much family on that side he doesn’t know that the more I think about it the more I think we will do something at home. Obviously if exp raises it then we can discuss it and go from there.

Another thing that I am really upset by - I told my dad that ds nana has died (my mum died long before I had children) and my dad knows how close ds was to his nana but my dad hasn’t acknowledged it to ds which I think is really sad. Even just a ‘mum told me about your nana, what was your best memory of her?’ But no zilch. Yet I know if it was my dad who died (older than ds nana) she would have absolutely acknowledged it. It’s just shitty because we are such a tiny family - again that’s probably me overthinking and bringing my own issues into all this. Need to get out of my own head 🤣

I think men of a certain age find it very difficult to know how to deal with complicated situations. I would try not to be too hard on him.

My dh is having similar issues with his own father. Mybstepsonndied unexpectedly 19 months ago, he was 16. My fil has repeatedly told him that he has had more than enough time to grieve and he needs to get over it and move on now. I cant decide if he is just being very clumsy in his attempt to support fh or if he is just a twat.

Your work should give you Compassionate leave, she was a form of parent to you and your sons grandparents, I would at least explore it even if you have tontake as unpaid leave. If your ds wants to be there then you need to make it happen.

On another note, talk to ds's school. If he isnstill in primary a lot will have staff members trained in counselling skills and will support. If hebis at high school it is less common but worth having a chat alright hisnpastoral team abd seeing what support there is.