I feel like I've sold out my daughter to my mother

[Moiin]

My daughter is 4.

I've always had a difficult relationship with my own mother, emotional abuse in childhood, some getting physical towards me in my late teens. My father is Emotionally constipated, I just get anger or indifference.
However with illness in the family and various things I did end up feeling close to my parents throughout my twenties and felt like I had the tools to deal with them. They were challenging at times but it was manageable, we only really fell out every few years. They did DIY badly on our house for example without asking so we had to hold boundaries with them for a bit.

When I had DD they were very practically helpful. Never emotionally- I know better than that now! They looked after her 2 days a week while I worked up until this summer and her starting reception.

Over time things went from lovely if a little overbearing to in the last 6 months just really boundary stomping. They stopped talking to me for a while when I tried to talk to them about this.

We are talking again but I'm still so so hurt by it all. What's even worse is my daughter demands to see them, says she doesn't want to do things with me and wants them instead. I have kept up her seeing them for my DD's sake. I try so so hard to be so gentle with her and the mother I wish I had. And yet I'm rejected and she wants my mum. I'm utterly devastated. I feel like I sold her out to them and in many ways I've already lost her emotionally. I wish I could cut my parents off but I'm afraid my DD would hate me more. I am so full of regret but genuinely at the time she was born they said all the right things and were so helpful. I have no idea where to go from here. I feel like an utter failure and like the problem was always me.

Please be gentle but I'd be grateful for any wisdom.

You didn’t “sell her out to them.” That’s not what that phrase means.

She has a close relationship with her grandparents. That’s a good thing. You also say you’ve managed to form a closer relationship with your parents, but they sometimes overstep so you have to manage that. You’re describing the majority of relationships between adult children and their parents.

It sounds like you’re actually more annoyed with them because your daughter likes them so you feel betrayed by your own daughter. Which is weird.

As long as they actually do stick to boundaries, and your daughter is happy and they’re not hurting her or being cruel or angry with her, then you should try to maintain the relationship.

What's even worse is my daughter demands to see them, says she doesn't want to do things with me and wants them instead. I have kept up her seeing them for my DD's sake

As they've been emotional abuse to you in your childhood I'd worry they are being emotioanlly manipulative with your DD with parental alienation long term being a real worry. So would be trying very hard to be there when DD is with them at very least.

I'd also let them not talk to you - they'll come round faster if you shrug it off and just get on with life.

If you actaully need the childcare they provide - well then you are much more stuck.

Also kids don't always like you - you are not their friend your the one who keeps them safe and teahces them how to behave to get on in the world - so don't get guilted into not having firm but loving disclipline.

I was a DC with grandparents rather like this. Similarly, parents had no other ‘support’. Parents had relatively low contact with theur parents but did seek occasional help with childcare when they were desperate! (Money issues and both worked full time)

GPs, one in particular, often behaved in ways that were distressing. We didn’t tell our parents. Nothing outright abusive but it would have been better had they not looked after us.

She's 4! This week my 4 year old has sent me for a nap so he can spend solo time with my (lovely) Mum. But I didn't need a nap (and he'd spent all morning with my Mum), so I didn't go! If my kid says 'I hate you', which he has maybe said twice, we have a big chat (i.e a VERY STERN DISCUSSION) about how we speak to anyone, let alone a family member we love!! NOT OK AT ALL!!

Just a question, if your parents are emotionally stunted, why on earth would you want your daughter spending so much time with them, picking up this way of being? Are there any other child care options.

I'd do some deep thinking about if you want your 4 year old to turn out like them in any way shape or form, or else you could be back with a very upsetting thread in 10 years time!! Nip it in the bud ASAP.

Wishing you luck with it all -4 is tough!

Thank you for all the responses and especially from those who 'get' it. It's so easy to get pulled back into the guilt and obligation and to think I'm crazy.

It may not be a surprise that I'm having a depressive episode at the moment hence all the negative cognitions I guess.

This came about as I felt guilted into them seeing DD twice last week. I did have lovely plans with her after and she spent the time complaining she wanted to be with them instead.

I've spoken to DH and they will get to have one day this week that's already been agreed but after that he is going to help me with holding it that there's no unsupervised contact- we will drop into theirs as hoc on a weekend but no more frequently than fortnightly.

I've been in a very similar situation, down to feeling guilted into seeing my parents at the detriment of our family time and seeing other family members.

As my DD got older she saw for herself what they were like and when they started to emotionally blackmail her to do what they wanted we went NC. I have to say, looking back she could see their behaviour better than me and spent a lot of time trying to keep the peace for my sake.

We've not seen or talked to them for a year now and as guilty as I feel saying that, I wish I had done it sooner and it's been the best thing for DD, DH and I.

Perfectly normal for DGC to want to be with Grandparents especially if they provide daycare. I look after my DGC two days a week and have done since they were 9 months old. When I drop them home they hang around my legs and neck saying, "No, I want Grandma" and once or twice have said, "Go away Mummy, I don't like you". Heartbreaking for my DD.

Just to clarify, I have boundaries and adhere to how their parents bring them up but I do have time to play and go out into the woods and visit the park, bake cakes and tell silly stories etc. Something I couldn't do with my children when I was working so I get how hard it is for working parents. My DD laughs when they ask is Grandma coming to play. They think I'm a playmate! I am not their parent. Completely different relationship.

As first, it was hurtful for us all but with time, and working together, we have made these outbursts less frequent. We don't give the outburst attention now. We just calmly handover, have a cuppa have a chat about the day then I'm on my way. The DGC can see that I love their Mummy and Daddy too.

You sound like a amazing grandparent, truly.

I think I like to fantasize that my parents are like you but then they don't listen to a word I say at all- I'll find out they've been giving her a dummy or a potty behind my back for example.

Thanks- I did try the 'under reacting' and found she dropped it very quickly! I think she was trying her luck / trying to gauge my reaction.

Thanks for saying nothing is wom or lost. Hoping to keep up more of an arms length relationship whilst I work on things.

Would you mind sharing a bit more about what they did?

My ultimate fear is they turn her into a version of my sibling- golden child- on steroids. Totally acopic and unable to lead a normal adult life but it's everyone else's fault.

You are very wrong to allow toxic grandparents near your child.
She's 4.
Stop contact and she will get used to not seeing them.
You have made the classic mistake of being conned into thinking a relationship at any price.
This is wrong.
The price of contact with toxic grandparents is too high.
Better your child is not around them.

Why did you let them provide childcare for two days a week if they are so toxic? What will you do in the school holidays or if she is sick?

You are ultimately going to have to be no contact with your parents. These people were not good parents to you when you were growing up and indeed you mention both
emotional and physical abuse. Your relationship to them finished the first time you were abused. You owe them nothing let alone a relationship here. They’ve never apologised to you nor have accepted any responsibility for their actions have they.

If they are too toxic/abusive/batshit etc for YOU to deal with it’s the SAME deal for your child too. And the harm to her will be done and is indeed being dove right in front of your very eyes. I presume you only allowed a relationship because of some forlorn hope they would behave better this time around despite your own experiences to the contrary.

Your DH likely comes from an emotionally healthy family himself so he does not really get it at all. Even going there fortnightly to them is a visit too many and you really do need to cancel your daughter seeing them this week. They are trying to steal your child’s heart and mind from under your very noses. After all they are older and likely have more disposable income to use. They will and indeed are using your DD to get back at you.

Moiin

People like your parents as well do not like boundaries so will ignore them (hence all this about giving your child a dummy etc behind your back. They really do want to undermine you and your H as her parents). They also see you as incapable and they will continue to patronise you by stating they know best for your dd. Your mother really does want to play at being mother again to your daughter.

Stop going to your parents home; it’s triggering for you emotionally and physically and is akin of walking into the lions den with only a chair. Both your h and you need to present a united front when it comes your parents but really and truly they are not worth bothering about.

I'm not sure what GPs have done wrong, regarding your DD? It seems to me DD has developed an attachment to them, surely that's a good thing that benefits everyone. Dd and GP make each other happy and you get childcare. I understand you have issues with your family but you can still balance things like reduce the hours DD spends a little and make sure they are not the ones who get to do the first big moments with her. Your DDs love for GPs is not a reflection on you, it's normal at that age and actually good for DD to feel so happy with them. I think your reaction to DD wanting GP is something of concern, you understandably hold resentment from your own upbringing. Honestly I think cutting contact wouldn't clear the ghosts of your past and would damage DD and hurt your parents, it would achieve nothing but hurt.

Cutting contact and therapy will help the op no end. It is saying no more to being abused.

Who gives a damn frankly about ops parents supposedly being hurt?. Such are incapable of those feelings.

Children can also be pretty indiscriminate in who they love so need guidance. Not all relatives are nice and kind.

Do not forget that op herself was abused both emotionally and physically by her parents, mother in particular. They could not give a fig about hurting their daughter even now and are actively using her child to get back at her. And it’s working - her child is already wanting her grandparents more. Poor parents like ops often make out for being poor examples as grandparents.

@Dontlletmedownbruce It’s usually not ‘a good thing’ for people who were abusive parents to have sole charge of grandchildren.

@Moiin It’s inconsistent to have those fears (understandable given your upbringing) but to allow your parents unsupervised access to your DC.

In our case, as the children, it wasn’t (I don’t think) malevolence but wasn’t great. It was things like harshness, coldness, mean comments, more subtle digs, comparisons, inadequate supervision then blaming us for things that happened in which lack of supervision was a factor, eg getting lost in public places, minor injury. Behaving differently when alone with us than when there were other adults around.