Lonely with second child

[pinklemonade215]

i had my first baby quite late in life, and I did the NCT course when I had him. It was helpful in that it gave me ready made friends. Nearly five years on and we’re all still friends.

But none of them have had a second. I did; consider myself very lucky and blessed but I do feel somehow alone in dealing again with toddler tantrums and teething and other issues while everyone else has moved way, way past that stage (as obviously I would have if I’d only had DS.)

I don’t quite know how to explain it. I have tried to make friends at groups but while I chat to people and they are nice it’s superficial and I never really get the impression anyone’s interested in lifelong friendships!

Join a toddler group. That was where I made my friends.

Is your eldest child about to start school? If so I’m sure that you will make mum friends at school. That seems to be the place where lots of people make friends for life. Do you have a partner to help? What is their social situation like? What about work friends?

it’s not always baby / kid groups that are the answer…. I hate them

I have never had lasting friendships from these to be honest. I think I mention in my OP we do go but just doesn’t really go anywhere.

DS is starting school but it isn’t so much lack of friendships, it’s the fact none of them have two children I’m struggling with. I get that probably makes no sense; I just feel like I’m very much alone with them.

Ah ok that makes sense, are none of your other noneNCT pals with 2 kids? Or do you mean with kids at similar age?

my 2 sound like they’re at the same age so more than happy to chat! Although I know mumsnet isn’t quite the same as real pals

I have a second child and lots of friends with just one. Yes, it's hard work sometimes and I do envy them being past the toddler bit, but honestly I'm very happy being a family of 4 (as I hope they are being families of 3 - obviously, I wouldn't dream of interrogating them for their reasons for stopping at one, as that would just be dreadful).

How is your mental health generally? I went through a period of having anxiety and burnout, and found I did fixate a lot on things like this and got very anxious about missing out and being excluded from things. When your DC starts school, things will be easier and they'll start to develop their own friendship preferences which you then try to support, and it takes the pressure off.

I had a similar situation in reverse - I had a group of friends made through dd's preschool and we all had 1. One woman went on to have a second when our DC were 5. Obviously that's great for her, but it really changed the dynamics. Where we were at that point being spontaneous in meeting up, being a bit more laissez-faire about things and generally able to do more, she was not so much. The friendship drifted because she refused things that wouldn't work for the baby. I think she was hurt that we weren't as interested in the baby. Are you prepared to do things and leave your youngest with dad? That way you can focus on older DC and conversation.

@LimitedBrightSpots i think it’s the sense of being left behind a bit. Ideally I’d just like to know people in my position and it’s crazy I don’t really!

@Eastendboysandwestendgirls my ‘baby’ is now two, but you’re assuming dad is around 24/7. I obviously don’t know quite what happened but from the way you’ve described it it does sound a bit like you all just shot off, which I get but it isn’t very nice when it happens to you (and especially to your child.)

How close are you to the friends you made through having your first child?
I only ask as in my groups of friends I have some with no kids, some with 1, others with 2 and even a few with 3. I found that I could share my issues with my 2nd and be welcomed and get lots of perspectives. Friends don't have to be living the same situation to be supportive.
I know it may feel like you are doing something alone but I think if you open up to close friends about how you feel then true friends will try and be there for you.
Are either child at nursery? I made some amazing friends there and I'm super shy. Try to make eye contact at drop off, open conversation in some way.
It's all really tricky but there will be people that come into your life to fill little gaps but it can take some well placed intros and time. I know what it's like to feel quite alone. I moved away to be with my now ex and it took 10 years for me to start to make friends who were lasting. Not saying it will take that long, it was having kids that suddenly opened things up for me.

I know what you mean @Freeflight . It’s just that they aren’t in that stage, it’s hard to talk about toddler tantrums and potty training as they’ve left that behind, just as my pre children friends have. It isn’t that they aren’t friends, just that they aren’t in that position I suppose.

I think that's the thing to focus on. Accept from your NCT friends what they are willing and able to give in terms of friendship, leave the little one with others when you can and enjoy some time just focusing on the older one and also suggest some activities (a picnic in the park near some good climbing trees for the older ones, for example) where actually you can supervise two children including a little one without it being a complete chore.

I have had many of these moments of sadness come and go over the past few years. When your child starts school, you will get them too as there will be events and meet-ups that you and your child are missed out of, not because anyone is being mean or excluding you but simply because friends are meeting up or it was convenient to invite one child and not another child or the families gel better together etc. It feels a little sad but it's not personal. And how I respond to it depends very much on how I'm feeling personally at that moment - if I'm on form and things are going well, I just shake it off, whereas if I'm having a tough patch and feeling low, it's harder.

What you can do is admit to yourself that you need more human connection in terms of shared experiences with two children than you have at the moment, and actively put yourself in situations where you might meet similar families. And you might not succeed but actually it might turn out to be good fun trying a few new things.

You really can't have friendships with mums of just one child??
Look, I'm a mum of one and lots of mums with two or more kids have rejected me socially so... Swings and roundabouts 🤷‍♀️

@pinklemonade215 do you try and talk to them about these things and they clearly don't want to discuss it or do you think you are assuming that they won't want to as they are past that phase?
I'd happily talk about potty training even though my youngest is almost 6. It's harder if someone has never had kids, but they do understand some aspects of what you are going through. And actually it can be really beneficial as they can remind you what it was like first time, the conversations you had then and how you all made it through.
I constantly say "my first was never like this", but actually they probably were, I just recall it differently now I have another.
Don't write them off just because they only have 1. At some point they may start having 2nds and you'll be this fountain of knowledge and understanding.
Friendships come in waves. Some moments you will be central to a group, other times a bit more sidelined, but it's all about what people are needing at different points.
Don't be afraid to speak out, talk about the stuff you are going through, say how you find it hard because you are the only one with a 2nd so it makes you feel lonely. If they are friends they will rally round to give you support.

This is where I do face palm with Mumsnet. I clearly have indicated that five years on I’m still friends with my NCT group, that I have friends from work and from before children; school, university. I’m not claiming I don’t have friends! What I’m saying is I don’t have a friendship circle with a toddler at the moment!

A lot of replies seem to be assuming I’m not wanting these friendships any more and that’s not the case. It’s just that as much as you need other people in the 3am club when you have a newborn it’s also nice to have people in the same stage as you.