Managing relationship between DM and DD

[drspouse]

DD (who is 10) loves her granny but my DM can be very overwhelming and does not understand DS (who has SEN) at all. When DM comes with both DD and DS I can't discipline DD (because it's always DS fault) and she winds DS up.

DM bombards me and DD with messages - I just mute her, or don't reply, but DD isn't mature enough to ignore things (she also can't ignore DS winding her up).

DD is more keen to see DM and spend time with her than DS or DH/I are. We're thinking of arranging for her to go and stay for a few days, and also hoping DM might see that DD is not the little angel DM thinks!

But I do want DM (who has form for getting upset over perceived slights, it's not just me/DD) to understand a) that DD is a child and can't be expected to show all the communication niceties that adults do b) we will discipline her if she's being rude, it is not DD's job to manage DM's emotions around people finding her overwhelming and c) DM can be a bit too much.

That sounds like you’d be sending your child into the lion’s den-why on earth would you do that?

You need to manage your mother’s behaviour and make it known that having favourites is not on

It sounds like it might be good for your kids to have some separate time if their needs are different. I'd give this a try.

I think an afternoon or day out with granny might be better than a few days if it is practical. And I would do it so they can enjoy each other's company, not so that gran can see dd is not an angel and vice versa.

DM in person with DD is pretty good - when DS was admitted to hospital and I was away for work, DM came to stay and managed DD fine. We feel a longer stay will help DM to see that DD is not the perfect child she thinks she is, and also possibly to satisfy her need for information about DD's life!

We are also potentially separately thinking about having my DF (they are divorced) to stay with us as he is DS favourite (not surprisingly, Mum, if you don't pay attention to one of your grandchildren, they won't prefer to spend time with you).

Unfortunately she is far enough away that this isn't practical unless she stays with us...

Okay so clearly your DM has some very frustrating behaviours around both your kids, and is possibly playing favourites. That's really annoying and I sympathise. But it does sound as if you want to send DD to stay with her as a way of proving to her that you're right and she's wrong? Rather than for DD and DM to enjoy a nice time together.

So no, I wouldn't go ahead with this visit. It's not fair to use our kids as a way of proving a point to our parents, however irritating they're being.

I just think your thinking behind this is SO wrong “to show her she’s not an angel”

Id far rather have your mother in sight and jump on every transgression re your son…by having your FIL to stay for the reasons you’re saying is perpetuating this unhealthy relationship

Tbh this sounds like you have a problem with boundaries with your DM and are not managing her appropriately.

I don't think this sounds a good idea, you're avoiding an adult conversation with your DM.

You are also escalating a toxic game of favourites.

Yeah, I get all your points - we do think they'd have a nice time together - and DS will enjoy DF staying more than he would enjoy DM staying. But I am listening to the advice.

I find it very hard (yeah, I know it's my job as a parent) to keep DM in line regarding DS partly because the best way to deal with DS messing about is to ignore him, she doesn't, and making a big fuss with DM when he's present is also rewarding to him. He has ADHD and thrives on excitement, fuss etc. which gives him a massive dopamine boost.

If I leave her to it and bring it up later she'll deny it, and totally ignore it if presented as advice (DS would have just put his seatbelt on if you hadn't shouted at him and had just sat quietly... I didn't shout at him, he was being a pain, you let him get away with everything etc. etc. - and she'll just do it again next time).
I am trying to respond less to her in general (I'm not going NC or even LC, but just not to respond to her endless communication and ignore her mad suggestions - she has form for it in other areas e.g. family arrangements where she decides we're all meeting at X, then we're meeting at Y, then we can all stay at my DB's, then we can't but she's sure I have a friend I can stay with, then she's not going... So I wait till she's stopped changing her mind. Leave her to talk to herself until there is a final plan. Have her to stay less, and try and get her to meet halfway (this has not yet worked, though, as she thinks halfway is too far).

But now she is sulking because DD once said her emails were too much, and I'm trying to work out how to manage that aspect of their relationship, now DD is old enough to message her separately, so they will have that relationship that isn't through me. She's in her early 80s and in good health, but I'm aware she won't be around forever and I want the DCs to have some positive memories of their GPs.

10 isn't old enough to be managing relationships via a mobile phone imo. . Your dm is abusing her having unsupervised contact....

Why are you letting your Mum bombard your DD with emails? She's 10 and from what you say, has difficulties with dealing with it. Tell your Mum to stop for now.

We thought it would be nice for her to be able to send photos to DM, like she does with friends (she doesn't have WhatsApp, just email and phone/text). Clearly we were wrong.

I'm going to have to put up with my mum sulking - but I'm used to that.

Sorry, I think this is a terrible idea. She doesn’t have a need for information about your daughter, she just wants it. She shouldn’t be bombarding your daughter or anyone else with messages. In trying to appease her you’re enabling her behaviour.
It isn’t your job to create experiences in an attempt to give your kids what you call positive memories about your mother when she’s gone. They’ll remember her as she was, and that’s as it should be. The responsibility for giving a positive impression of herself is on her.
If your daughter is very keen to go and stay with her GM, fine, let her go. If not, don’t send her in an attempt to manipulate their relationship.

Oh, DD is keen, but may be thinking Granny will let her stay up late/watch too much TV/not help round the house which will probably not be the case.

But your DM is known to be too much, you are leaving a young child to manage a person you as an adult can't manage. You're using your DD as a shield!

now she is sulking because DD once said her emails were too much, and I'm trying to work out how to manage that aspect of their relationship you don't 'manage' it, your tell your DM to stop pressuring a young child and remove any obligation from your DD.

From experience, my DM will not stop pressurising her, so it will be a continual exercise in pointing out to her that DD does in fact find this too much, however much she denies it, and reassuring DD that yes, indeed, Granny is often too much. She has just told me "it's hardly too much" because she hasn't emailed her in a few months. Anyway I have let her know that even if she feels DD is being rude, it's our problem to teach her how to behave, and it isn't personal.

DM, since things are usually about her, will turn this into "DD doesn't want to talk to me", "DD doesn't want to see me" or "you don't want to see me".

When it is just me and DD and DM in person (or, I believe, DM and DD without either of us - I can only speak to that when I or DH witness it from the sidelines) they are engaged and enjoy themselves. It's just so fraught when DM is around DS but DD seems to enjoy in person visits - so it's hard to navigate what's best for DD and DS.

Mothers eh? Mine is a nightmare too. Seems to think she is a third parent to my dc and as such should know all happenings and “have her say” in all decisions, often trying to gainsay what we the parents decide. That with many other problems from my childhood into adulthood has resulted in me being low contact and she gets nothing much at all now, when she could have been included in the, you know, grandmother way that she actually is. She is very huffy about it all, well angry really but no change there. Now I’m LC I don’t have to hear it very often. I wish you luck. The favourites thing is so damaging though. It’s all through generations of our family and one of the reasons for all the dysfunction. (M was a scapegoat, so am I. No awareness from M at all.)

Would your DM read something about ADHD and dopamine? I’m guessing not, they are always right anyway sigh.

I suspect she'd think "you are right not to make a fuss about things but I am correct that DS should be robustly told off for not doing something that he'd do if you ignored him".

I think I'm probably towards LC but I do communicate when it suits me, at which point I ignore the 10 Whatsapp messages she's sent in the interim, and DH ignores all the emails she sends him (I don't tend to answer her emails, so she's given up).

To be honest it all sounds unhealthy for your DD. I'm sure it's difficult for you but you probably need to devise strategies absorb the pressure and just keep it away from your kids.