Friendship and conspiracy theorist

[Acecarad]

I have a friend for over 30 years. I am late 50s, she is 70. We met as nursing students. We had such a great friendship up until about Covid - one day many years ago we clocked up four hours of talking on the phone. We had lots in common. I lived in Ireland and she in London, and we met up regularly - visiting each other a couple of times a year.

However, since Covid, she has become completely absorbed in conspiracy theories. In the beginning, I didn't mind listening to some of them - I'm open to considering other people's perspective, but now that's all she talks about. If I try to turn the conversation to ordinary everyday stuff, she will turn it back almost immediately to her latest conspiracy theory. Some of the ones are David Icke and his lizard people, that Ukraine deserved to invaded as it was running biolabs to kill people and was involved in the mass sexual abuse of young people, and she believes that this and the possibility of Ukraine joining NATO was justification for invading them. I find this view incredibly offensive as I don't believe any count - being Irish I suppose - has the right to invade another country. I also am quite involved with the Ukranian refugee community at home as I we have a Ukranian girl living with us in Ireland who fled the war, and I often got to the Red Cross support meetings for hosts - neither her, nor any of her friends or the Ukranians I have met at these meetings has ever head of Ukranian biolabs producing chemicals to kill people or large-scale underground paedophillia rings. I have told her previously several times that I find her views on Ukraine offensive, but she still persists - when she phoned a few weeks ago I said this again, she said sorry and just kept going with her conspiracy theories.
She also thinks Trump is wonderful - he's going to drain the swamp and bring back a just world - and Putin too.

She is very antisemitic also - has a major issue with the Rothschilds. In the last few contacts she presented as quite racist stating that she read that the non-Irish population was now 25/% in Ireland - it isn't, it's 12% - and that these men who were coming as refugees to Ireland were fighting men who were preparing to take over the country. I don't like uncontrolled immigration but if someone is a genuine refugee or comes to Ireland to work, I have no issues and welcome diversity.

She also goes on about paedophillia rings in Hollywood and in the CIA. I now feel so stressed when she rings. My son popped in his head in to ask me something as I was on the phone to my friend the last time she phoned. He couldn't believe the way she was speaking to me, described it as 'forceful' bordering on 'abusive' - she wasn't swearing - just loudly arguing her viewpoint.

I don't know what happened to my lovely, kind, non-judgemental, broad-minded friend since Covid. I am so reluctant to end the friendship but she is not the person I once new. Apologies for long post, but if anyone else has been in this situation, I would welcome advice/comment.

@Acecarad what does the friendship actually bring you nowadays? Does it feel like you could turn to her doe support or would she bring her conspiracy theories in t9 everything?

do you dread the calls.
does your heart sink when you see her name on your phone?
does you fell drained and run down after them?
Do you find yourself dwelling on the changes and her behaviour and it’s impacting your overall mood?

I do suggest being honest with her and telling her that you find the conversations one sided and miss the friendship you used to have. If she can’t change or hold back the madness (and I say that with a son sectioned with schizophrenia who also believes putin is our saviour) then maybe be less available and accept your friendship has changed and you are now different people.

if you met her in a group setting nowadays for the first time - would you keep in touch and suggest a second meeting? I think the friend you knew has gone I’m afraid.

I would definitely end the friendship. She is a racist, antisemitic nutcase who supports Trump and Putin. There is no common ground to maintain your relationship.

It's a cult. A form of mental illness even... They're everywhere. People who can't believe some things are random. I met loads of men like this of dating sites even when I said no lizard lovers.

I'm afraid it's a sign of the times. Social media has indoctrinated people and it doesn't take long.

Some people believe anything and there's a lot of propaganda around. I know someone who believes in chem trails and doesn't believe in doctors or COVID.

They get lost in a rabbit hole of bullshit. I would drop her.

It's so hard especially when it seems totally at odds with the person you used to know. My formerly leftie, softie mum is like this now. She's 80 and is a Trump supporting conspiracy theorist too. She went down wellness rabbit holes initially and from there into anti vax and then conspiracy theories.

No idea what you should do but I do know it's hard.

I assume you’ve been flatly correcting her all along, saying ‘No, the percentage of the population of Ireland not born in Ireland is 12%, not 25%, Barbara’ and ‘No, Barbara, your information is incorrect — unlike you I’m sharing a house with a Ukrainian and meet Ukrainians regularly and none of them has ever heard of bio labs or large-scale paedophile rings’? I think I’d give her one last chance. ‘Barbara, I will no longer be picking up the phone if your conversation is a torrent of offensively stupid conspiracy theories. Unless you can save that kind of thing for your fellow nut jobs, this friendship is over.’

Well she won’t change so you can either accept her crap or let go of the friendship.

What a shame.

It doesn’t make any difference whether she’s a conspiracy theorist or not really, you don’t share any interests any more.

I’m so sorry, OP. It’s so very sad, but I’m afraid it’s rarely possible to fix things like this, and you have a responsibility to yourself and your own sanity here. This has happened to someone I’ve known for years, too. He’ll spew any amount of nonsense but when anyone questions his opinions he claims he’s being bullied; it’s as if his opinions are sacred things that mustn’t be disputed or analysed. You’ve asked her to desist. She doesn’t value you enough to do so. That speaks volumes.

This friendship is gone because the person you were friends with has gone. Her views are now frankly offensive.

When it gets to this stage it’s like a low level mental illness and calling it out will unfortunately just make you part of the conspiracy. I’m sorry this has happened to your friend.

I've been in this situation. We were friends for 37 years since we were toddlers. The friendship has now broken down and it was very very difficult as she was like a sister to me but I was always in fear of it happening anyway. She had turned into someone I didn't recognise any more and when I look back she wasn't a very nice person. I miss her but it wasn't healthy.

Also she kept making me watch videos and quizzing me on my thoughts and would get very angry if I hadn't answered the right way or she could tell I hadn't watched it all the way through. Some were an hour long. My mum who was upset we had fallen out listened to one of her voice notes and agreed it was stressful to hear.

I’m so sorry for you Op. This has happened to me with my son. He is an educated health professional. It has destroyed our family. He told me “you are not my mother “. Covid took my son from me even though he didn’t die. I don’t believe I will ever get him back

Thanks so much for all the replies. Yes, I have tried to correct her in a gentle way, giving an opposing view and opposing facts, but she still reverts back to her beliefs. She has become quite arrogant, like she, and those like her, have some secret knowledge and the rest of us are just sheep and don't know really what is going on but have instead fallen for propaganda. When I mention that the Youtube stuff she watches endlessly is also propaganda and people are making lots of money from it, she totally disputes this. I do feel it's like someone said a 'low level mental illness.' It feels also like she has become like those religious zealots but a conspiracy theorist one. I think I will just leave it and not contact her again. I have tried to discuss it with her and say I do not like talking about her beliefs that I find them depressing and stressful to listen to but she just continues. It's sad, but she is not the open, non-judgmental, liberal minded fiend I had for so many years. Really, she is unrecognisable to me now.

Whitebunny1 - I am so sorry that your son has gone down the rabbit hole of conspiracy theories, and to lose him and your relationship with him to this madness must be so painful.

Thank you. Yes the pain is excruciating and there is nothing I can do. Everything you have stated I have heard exactly the same. It is a cult and key thing that cults do is separate the inductee from their family and friends. I agree there seems to be a need to feel superior and different in some way. That’s all part of the thinking.

My uncle has gone down this track too and I just can’t pick up the phone to him anymore. He’s not as zealous as your friend, but every conversation seems to come back to a tone of him trying to convert me. It’s sad, and I agree it’s a low level mental illness. I think David Icke is projecting his childhood trauma onto the adult world. Like others have said, you need to look after yourself and consider what the relationship is really bringing to you.