What is this behaviour from DH?

[Thisisntme1]

There's so many things I could mention about DH's behaviour when he's in a mood but for the sake of keeping this short I just want to focus on this one thing.

DH won't make decisions. I mean he will sometimes and is good at his job and does stuff for the kids and around the house etc.
But if I say things 'what do you want for dinner?' Or 'what should we do for date night?' Or 'where should we go on our family holiday' He replies with 'I don't care' and won't really engage and I end up making all the decisions.
Which is fine day to day (sometimes, although sometimes I just wish he'd have an opinion!)

But then other times I might say 'what should we get the kids for Xmas?' And he'll reply 'I don't know/care' so I'll push him a bit more to help with the decision making and he'll then say something completely unrealistic (and a snappy tone) like "let's just spend $5k on this item so they're happy!"

I point out it's unrealistic, unaffordable etc and clearly we're not doing that, which he knows but then he comes back and says well you asked me to make decision and I did but now you're not happy with it.
And again, I end up making all the decisions.
I always run things by him and he never gets mad at me for the ones I make. But he makes out like he's so easy going but then I become the default decision maker for everything. Plus he's the grumpiest 'easy going' man I've ever met 🙄

Please explain it to me, I can't have a rational conversation with him to ask him because, well he won't answer, or doesn't know and it ends up in an argument or a circular conversation.

Do you think he actually wants to go to McDonald's or pay $5k for the kids Christmas present. Sounds like weaponised indecisiveness. Make the shittest decision so you push back and then he's validated that he can't make any decisions.
Have you tried calling his bluff? $5k for the kids? Your decision, you order it. McDonald's? Your decision lets go.
Does he ever feel the consequences of having no opinion or making deliberately obtuse ones then he's never going to change.

@StuckInHove yes! This is exactly it!

his answer to anything was ‘I don’t care, you know I’ll eat anything. You know I’ll go anywhere’. He just didn’t care enough to make any sort of effort.

That's what he does and that's how I feel, but he takes huge offence if I point this out to him and then I feel like the bad guy.

He's so good in other ways, but when it comes to our relationship any effort seems to have gone out the window.
Our kids are between 13-20 and we've been married for 20 years (we're 40 & 42).

I was spontaneous recently and told him to meet me after work at a bar so we could have a drink etc and he came but his demeanour was like he didn't want to be there. I felt like I was forcing him to spend time with me but when I called him on it (days later) he took offence, got annoyed at me and seems to think I'm never happy and he was totally fine.
Then I start thinking I'm the crazy one and imagined it. But you know when you can just tell when someone is 'off'.

And before it is mentioned, I'd just like to say that no there's no affair or someone else.
I know no one is ever 100% but I just know. He works alone, shares his location on his phone and is completely open with his phone etc.

What happens if you say "OK you're making dinner tonight" and you just leave it with him?

Or you go "OK your choice of date tonight, I'll be ready at 7" and just leave all the arrangements to him?

It sounds like you discuss and also end up doing all the work for it, maybe just step back and leave it in his hands.

@EverestMilton

Make the shittest decision so you push back and then he's validated that he can't make any decisions

Yes, this is exactly it too.
And yes i do just give up and make the decision in the end.

Why on earth do you think he does want to go on dates/nights out with you? Nothing you've said would suggest he does. Quite the opposite in fact.

He sounds disengaged, uninterested and bored. Why do you keep pandering to him? What happens if you stop making all the arrangements, does he step up or does he get cross? Or worse, does he not notice?

He sounds more like a child than a husband.
What a baby! I wouldn’t ask his opinion on anything because he’s clearly not playing an active role in your partnership. To say “I don’t care” is so dismissive.

I wouldn’t be married to someone with that attitude.

Almost exactly the same for me. His version of easy going was actually complete lack of care or interest in me. We were together almost 15 years and I look back now and realise how unbothered he actually was. Would never take any initiative to do anything remotely helpful or romantic or anything like that. Seemed annoyed when I asked him why he’d never gotten me a bunch of flowers. Would make out that I’m a control freak and never satisfied, so he leaves all decisions to me. Lazy basically. He was just (and still is) lazy. His mum was a sahm his whole life. She never worked after having kids, even as they got older. Very traditional. I think he just expected me to be the same, even though I went back to work full time after each child. I just woke up one day and realised I was a single parent with an absolute man child and as I was doing everything on my own anyway, I might as well get rid of the dead weight and make it official! He did not take it well and still maintains that I broke up our family.

Why not take turns to decide on date night?
And if he says McDonald's, then fine - go there. Next time you pick what you would like and then it's back to him.

Don't critique his choice, just go along with it. That will soon tell you whether he can / wants to make an effort / go out with you. Or is not bothered.

I think really differently about this, because this was my Dad. Not because he didn't care, but because from earliest childhood he'd be blamed by his mother for any decision or opinion he had.

He married a woman just like his mother, and let her do whatever she wanted. It wasn't that he didn't care, it was that he didn't dare.

He too never complained, and would always try to enjoy everything she chose.

I was somewhat the same. I'd generally say 'whatever you want' or 'I don't mind', but if pushed I would decide. But I would be trying to please others with my decisions and it's only since a very abusive relationship that I've learned to please myself.

That was part of my Dad's indecisiveness - he couldn't predict what would make his mother or wife happy, so he gave up trying.

That could be why your DH was the way he was with the 'spontaneous' date - couldn't say 'no' for fear of displeasing you, but didn't want to do it, so was 'off', because he didn't have time to build up to it.

This is not to suggest that you are like my mother or grandmother, OP, because neither were many of the men I dated, or the man I married. But it didn't change how I never made a decision I really wanted. That was my pattern, and your DH's is to not make a decision, like my Dad's was.

If he would go to counselling with you, I think this would be really helpful - I think an outside person would be able to help you understand eachother. I also think the alternatinng date night suggestion from the poster above would help - but with the support of an outside person and as part of a whole exploratory approach to this.

I may be way off, but it's the way he doesn't ever complain about what you do choose (most cba people do complain, whatever you choose) that makes me think this.

The three words I heard the most from my ex husband were 'I don't know'.

And those words are easily in the top three of the reasons why he's my ex husband.

I totally understand how utterly irritating it is to constantly hear them. I also agree with this from @StuckInHove : His version of easy going was actually complete lack of care or interest in me. We were together almost 15 years and I look back now and realise how unbothered he actually was. Would never take any initiative to do anything remotely helpful or romantic or anything like that.

Others said I was lucky to have a husband that was so easy going. But they did not have to live with it, to feel how dismissive this behavior actually is. I was a very young woman and came to the conclusion that I couldn't face decades of constantly hearing 'I don't know', so I left and we divorced.

He thinks it's not his job to think about that kind of thing. It's not important enough for him to bother his mind with. You're supposed to just know what he'd like for dinner and what the dc want for Christmas. Women just know those things - it's their job to, obvs. He probably hopes that if he's dismissive and snappy and doesn't engage when you ask him about stuff, you'll stop asking.

Mine is like this a bit and it frustrates me too. I reckon it is an avoidant tactic so if something goes wrong (gift not wanted, train cancelled, lacklustre restaurant, dodgy plumber, whatever), he can't be blamed for it having gone tits up.

Easy going = lazy, cba, disinterested in the person/family. Sometimes selfish, usually passive aggressive. Can turn into weaponised incompetence.

Took me twenty years to realise the above. He is also a stbx.

He is being very disrespectful of youband extremely lazy.
Say nothing but start making plans for yourself.
Join things, take up a class or sport.
Start going out with friends on a regular basis.
Say nothing but build up a life of your own away from him and the home.
Every woman should do it.
You do not need him to be your sole companion.
The most successful marriages I know are those that spend a bit of time separately.
They have a life beyond each other and the home.
Not 5 nights a week, but they take a bit of space and time for themselves without it screwing their spouse.
I would suggest that you alternate booking and organising date night.
If he makes no effort, then you know it is not important to him.

OP, does he offload all the rest of the mental load onto you? Does he ever make a doctor's appointment or sort out kids' clubs or after school activities or make up packed lunches if you are going out anywhere? Or does he, like my ex, delegate ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING to you?

Mine couldn't even tell you when his own kids' birthdays were or what we'd got them for Christmas. He didn't even help wrap up the gifts. He had a Job you know, which meant he didn't even have to carry a plate through to the kitchen... There was no putting him right - and people outside the family even had a go at asking him how he could just get away with doing nothing. He was convinced that I enjoyed doing everything.

Passiveness in a partner doesn't necessarily mean they have checked out of the relationship or never cared to begin with. Some have checked out or were never there but OPs DH takes part in family life in other ways which a checked our partner may not.

I am fully aware that people will slap me for this one but when you want something to change it needs to start to go from 1 to 2, 2 to 3 etc not 1 to 100, he is not going to change overnight.

Breaking down decisions into smaller ones can be helpful. If it's where to go on a date night, it could be something like:

Lets go on a date night in X town. I fancy either Itallian, or Greek restaurants

Can you check the reviews for me please and let me know which are the best for each type?

Then when he does that ask which has the best menu, even if he falters here, he's made a step towards the decision by limiting the choices available. Practise in this way can stop decisions looking hard or scary and take some of the baggage off you. Hard to start but it can get easier in time.

Turning decisions into smaller task can be helpful and it save you from having to make all the decisions.

In truth he is almost never going to change that side of him to full on masterly decision maker but it can ease your burden when he works out he can easily help. With practise he might even decide to do this off his own back.

As it's driving you nuts it might be worth getting a bit of therapy even if its just for you and your piece of mind