Right , I am fed up with being socially-backward...

[tigana]

I cannot start a conversation iwth a stranger, or even someone I have met a few times, for toffee ( and I like toffee!!).
No matter how much a shout at my self ( inwardly that is...) to just say something...I freeze and clam up.

Once I know someone I can just about start a conversation iof I try hard.

If someone else starts it I am fine and can jabber away like a 'normal'.

I think it is down to self-esteem and a fear of rejection perhpas.

Does nayone know of any genuine self help books/tapes/CDs I could use to sort myself out? I don't fancy standing in front of a mirror each morning telling myself I am worthy...

bless you! The trouble is, I think you could read loads of self help books but in the end you just have to go for it, you just have to feel the fear and say "Hi". Just try it. Once you have done it you will feel such an achievement and you will want to do it again and again and again. But whn you notice people crossing the road to avoid you you will know you have gone too far

PS ake sure you say "hi" with a nice big smile too. You won't be rejected, your happy greting will be most welcome

Not sure about books but a good idea is to have a few questions ready in your head that you are comfortable asking.
If in a group, try 'open discussion' questions:

• what is your dream job? - money no object
• which 4 people, dead or alive, would you like to have dinner with?
• where in the world would you love most to visit and why?

These kind of questions initiate lively conversations and whilst you don't necessarily have to say much, you can look interested and be remembered as the person that got it going! Ask friends that if they introduce you to someone they do so with a fact - e.g. this is Fred and he breeds dogs/lives in Malta/works on an oil rig etc. At least then you can ask 1 relevant question, then ease into a conversation.

I am terrible at picking up 'cues' too (unless I know the person well). You know, things people say that normal people would pick up on and use to continue the conversation. Is usually when I am talking with someone I don't really know, I am so busy trying to be polite and normal and not be nervous that I don't relax into the 'chat'.
[lost cause emoticon]

With a stranger though, you can stick to the basics can't you? "Hi how are you" or something about the weather. That seems to me to be normal for strangers - or something about the kids if you have that in common.

Yes, I know I should just go over to them and say " hi, how are you" - that is what I tell myself, firmly, to do, but my feet won't move and my throat seizes up.

Practise in situations where it doesn't matter much. Like when you go to the shop, say to the lady/man who is serving you, 'nice day today' or (if you live in England) 'look at the farking weather'. Some people will answer you some will not. That's life. You can stab the ones who don't later.
It's probably the rejection you fear, or you may not be very interested in other people generally?

I do fear rejection, am also terrible at confrontation.
I think it is less about not being interested and more about being unable to engage enough.

Relax tigana. You have to remember that everyone is in the same boat.
Just say whatever comes into your head.
Talk about the children, schools, whatever.
If you are interested in people, why?
What do you want from them?

whatever comes into my head is... ....
Even if the day before I had an icebreaker all planned out...
and even if I can remember what I planned to say...I am too nervous to say the fricking thing out loud!

Maybe you should just leave it then and let people approach you.
No point trying too hard, if it is just not in you then you will come across as odd

hi. i was looking for info only yesterday on self esteem for a girls project i'm working on.... these links are nice and eay to read, with some really good tips.

www.netdoctor.co.uk/sex_relationships/facts/selfesteem.htm

www.utexas.edu/student/cmhc/booklets/selfesteem/selfest.html

most people like a chat, so don't be afraid to speak to people. if they have children with them, use that as the opener..."i love your little girls hair!" or "how old is your son...mine is 10 months old " or whatever.

people also love to talk about themselves...ask them if they know of a nice local coffee shop, or a good mother and toddler group....
tell them you love their hair cut, would they mind telling you where they had it done...

obviouly you don't want to look like a stalker, or appear too desparate, but if you're already sitting near someone, and already done the opening hello, nice day/awful weather thing, then its fine to start chatting and often a converstaion will start to flow naturally.

if you do chat nonsense, don't worry about it! put it down to experience and remember it for improving next time.

I was going to say something similar to littlewoman - practice all the time. Ask someone if they have the time/for a light (if you smoke)/for directions. I know it's not exectly the start of a meaningful conversation but it wil get you used to talking to people. Give yourself a target like, today I will ask one/ten (how brave do you feel?!) people a question. Comment on the weather to every shop assistant. You'll soon get bored and think of something new to say!!

Sorry, my last post sounded more abrupt than I meant it to.
The point is, there is nothing to fear- what is the worse that can happen?
But if you really can't face it, then don't and just work on looking smiley and approachable as a first step

I think most people find talking to strangers difficult. Consequently, if you do have a go the other person is unlikely to judge you.

It is much harder if you are too concerned with what other people think (about you). Try to remember that what other people think about you doesn't diminish you in anyway. Also remember that most people are so concerned with what you think of them that they are unlikely to be forming opinions about you.

Think of a situation when you would like to talk to someone (at toddler group, in the park etc).

Like Mrs B said talk about the kids. In the park / toddlers I nearly always either talk to their child or talk about their child (He's very good on the slide, how old is he?). Then follow their lead (they will ask about your child etc make comarisons). The next step is to voice a concern ( DD can't climb the steps yet and she's nearly 3, I wonder whether I should try harder with her..) It gives them chance to offer advice etc (people love to offer advice).

Then if you see them again MAKE SURE YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THEM even a smile/Hi across the street.

If it sounds like a formula, it is, i have taught myself social skills (v. shy child / teen). Practise, practise and it works.

sorry x posts with lots of people.

how old are you tigana? a lot of people say, and it's true in my case, that as you get older you get more confident and less bothered about rejection. remember if someone doesn't want to speak to you, it is a reflection on them, not you.

ask questions and genuinely listen to what they say. always a good tip.

have to say, though, i sympathise. i've gotten better over time but am still v shy and not great in large groups. though people who know me or meet me in a place where i'm comfortable, e.g my workplace would and have described me as a 'strong personality and a bit larey

Sorry, didn't mean to run out on conversation ( am not that awkward!) but am at work..and busy...and no pc at home at moment... (and am about to post and run as have meeting to go to!)
Thanks all.
Mrsruffalo - no problem, I know what you were trying to say

scatty I like the formula approach and am glad to read that it works!
I'm 30 soopermum1 and, like you, people I know through work etc would say I was fairly confident/chatty. Sort of makes it even more frustrating as I know I can do it once I get started, but just can't get the guts to get started in the first place!

Tigana - you make me laugh. (in a good way honest).

am late for meeting now!!

Oops sorry.

I have always been very shy and throughout my life have often been mistaken for stand offish and rude.

I often wish I could be the loud funny one but have started to accept that that just isn't me.

I hate bumping into acquaintances as I know I will have to make small talk and I'm really bad at it.

I read a few of those self help books when I was a teen but did not find them to be of much use. They were all about writing good things about yourself etc. Thing is, I know there are good things about me and I don't think I am dreadful and boring - I'm just very crap socially.

No advice really, just sympathy.

I was excactly the same as you tigana. At one stage I guess I 'gave up'. I wasn't depressed, just suffering anxiety. Once I 'gave up' and just accepted myself for who I am - a friendly person who likes other people but ultimatley likes my own company - I found other people came to me. It is crazy, but after realising I don't need other people to make me feel good I have actually formed friendships & bonds with other people without even trying! My advice is don't get hung up on feeling you have to interact with everbody - if friendships are meant to be then they will be formed slowly & over shared interests. You cannot expect everyone you meet to be like you or to like you, but when you do meet those people you will find the conversation flows naturally. Rest assured there are many many people like you out there, some are just better actors than others.

Agree with what everyone has said, we all feel shy sometimes just jump in and make conversation. If they don't respond, that's their problem not yours. It does get easier the older you get, I am 42 and I used to be PAINFULLY shy but now I will speak to anyone
You sound like a really nice person, I'm sure lots of people would love to talk to you.

I think littlewoman's advice is spot on. That's how I got rid of (some of) my shyness. Practising in neutral situations. A group of Mums of your own age, where you feel you "ought" to connect and be friends, can be a bit too much pressure. Easier to start with the lady in the shop or the bus driver and work your way up.