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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Am I being selfish/unreasonable?

27 replies

AndreaWest · 14/04/2008 13:15

I am married to my second husband. I have 2 children from my previous marriage and we now have a DD who is almost 5.

Its going to sound petty and unimportant but please bare with me.

Basically I have been involved with karate for over 15 years. It is a huge part of my life. My elder children also joined as soon as they were old enough and it has become a huge part of their life too. I feel it is vitally important and I always said any child of mine would train.

Anyway I always assumed DD would train automatically when she was old enough. That time is now as she is coming up to 5 and DH said no, she can't go. I asked why and he said he doesn't agree with girls being taught how to fight and that its old fashioned now anyway I have a feeling DH is jealous of the time me and my boys put into training and competition etc and its something he can't feel part of. I think he thinks that by putting DD in too I will alienate him further.

I really do not want to give up on this, I feel she will miss out on so much if she doesn't train with us, I can't imagine having a teenager that doesn't know any martial arts and I know that will be odd sounding but thats how much a oart of our lives it is.

I really have 3 options, try to talk him around which has proved useless so far and just makes him anygry. Take her anyway and tell him he's being stupid or let him have his way and leave her out of it.

What would you do?

OP posts:
SheWillBeLoved · 14/04/2008 13:21

Well personally, i'd ask DD if she wants to go. At 5, i'm sure she's old enough to tell you whether she wants to be involved with it, or stay home playing with her toys. Then, if she says she would like to go, then take her.

But thats just me

littlepinkpixie · 14/04/2008 13:22

I agree with asking DD, she will be able to tell you if she is interested or not.

Tanee58 · 14/04/2008 13:24

Does your DD want to go? If so, I would try explaining to him that martial arts are excellent for building self-confidence - irrespective of their sex. Is there any chance of your partner becoming involved too?

Anniegetyourgun · 14/04/2008 13:25

What a sexist. "...doesn't agree with girls being taught how to fight" indeed - isn't that the old-fashioned attitude, rather than yours? Presumably if his daughter were attacked one dark night, in about 15 years' time, he would prefer her to scream for help in a sweet girlish way rather than be able to defend herself.

I reckon your guess is right, he's feeling like a karate widow and is looking for any excuse to keep the youngest with him. Cue suggestions of regularly doing some kind of activity he can relate to so he can feel like a part of the family instead of the sponsor of a professional team.

Original poster
AndreaWest · 14/04/2008 13:33

Thanks everyone. DD really wants to go, she has a suit and everything and is always prancing around in it (it's my sons first suit lol so its years old, I'd need to buy her a new one to actually train in). She's been practicing at home for a couple of years anyway with me and the boys, she knows 3 katas already. DH says I am brainwashing her into thinking she would like it but I just know she would. He said if I take her he will be very angry and will see it as a betrayal. I have asked him to join too but he says only wimpy blokes join karate

OP posts:
Iklboo · 14/04/2008 13:37

OFGS!!! 'only wimpy men do karate'??? Has he been to a competition? Sounds like he has some weird ideas about what karate is all about. Plus he's contradicting himself - 'don't want to teach girls to fight/it's only for wimpy men'
I'd take her if she wanted to go. He's behaving like a spoiled brat

newgirl · 14/04/2008 13:39

i think your dh is being childish and attention seeking - you all share something that he is not part of and he doesnt like it

i dont like his attitude but in wonder if there is some compromise - do you spend a lot of time each week with karate? eg all day at the weekend going to competitions? perhaps it is not reasonable of you to do it so much? is there something he would like you all to do together as well?

SheWillBeLoved · 14/04/2008 13:39

Well if she wants to go, then take her. It's not fair on DD missing out on something because he is probably feeling threatened and left out.

If it were me though, i'd perhaps leave getting her to join until she's a little older. Children, when that young, are very impressionable and eager to please at times, and if she see's you and her brothers so interested in karate, then she might feel like she has to be too. At least when she's older, she'll be able to really make her own mind up.

yorkshirepudding · 14/04/2008 13:42

Message withdrawn

Original poster
AndreaWest · 14/04/2008 13:42

I agree, he came to a competition with us once and sat there going on about how if any of the blokes ended up in a real fight in a bar they wouldn't know what had hit them and that people who do karate etc end up with a false sense of security that they are "tough". I think he's jealous, he can't be bothered to train so hates the fact that we can and he at least wants DD on his side The latest thing is that he's apparantly planning to send her to drama and dance school and we can't afford to do both

OP posts:
Original poster
AndreaWest · 14/04/2008 13:44

we train four times a week but the competitions are only every few months, say one every 4 months or so, its not like its every week.

OP posts:
Iklboo · 14/04/2008 13:46

Sorry, but in a fight in a pub a quick round-house to the heid would put a dent in most people's day. Plus it's defensive as well as offensive.
Have his arse and his mouth suddenly changed positions?
Dance & drama lessons? Is he seeing £££££ X-Factor winner?
As a family (you and DCs), karate his bottomin and lock him in a cupboard under the stairs till your lessons are over

SheWillBeLoved · 14/04/2008 13:48

Can a compromise not be met? You have 2 sons who are doing what you're interested in them doing - not that they don't like it too, i'm sure they do. But why can't he have a say, just like you have yours, when it comes to what his daughter does?

I will say this, she's 5... personally i'd just let her get on with being a kid rather than fighting over what activites she has to devote herself to at such a young age. She has plenty of time for karate/dance/drama. Just because you're old enough to do something, it doesn't mean you should, as my mother very kindly pointed out on my 16th birthday

ib · 14/04/2008 13:50

Well, as he non-karate half of the relationship I can kind of see why he wouldn't be keen (though the reasons he gave are crap). Karate really is unspeakably boring to the non-participant, and can feel a little like belonging to a sect.

I think you need to have a good long talk, acknowledging that competitions etc. are a royal pita for him and that he's not weird for not wanting to spend his free time prancing around in pyjamas looking constipated. Then try to find a compromise where your dd can do some karate to see if she likes it but without spending more of what should be family time on it.

In the end though I don't really think it's reasonable to forbid her from going if she wants to.

ib · 14/04/2008 13:53

Oh, and dh, (who won a fair no. of competitions in his day) would agree with what he said about doing badly in bar fights and having a false sense of security btw...

themoon66 · 14/04/2008 13:54

He is so wrong about it not being any use in a 'real' fight.

I have a female friend who is a black belt. She is only 4ft 11in and fought off three 6ft blokes who tried to drag her into a car outside a nightclub. She broke the arm of one of them.

I dread to think what would have happened to her if she'd been pushed into that car, unable to defend herself

DD also saved herself from being mugged for her mobile phone when she was 13. Just having the confidence helps girls to not become pushovers.

Twinkie1 · 14/04/2008 13:54

Ha ha - is an important question we ask all of one of my relatives suitors - every martial arts guy she has been out with has become a nutter and started stalking her when they split - so we now never let her see anyone who is into martial arts!

Sorry no help just made me think of the Nutter Stalker Martial Arts Disorder that all her previous BFs have had!

newgirl · 14/04/2008 13:58

i think karate is great but i think if my dp and kids were doing it 4 times a week i would be very grumpy about it

he isnt doing himself any favours criticising the sport - he sounds petulant - i guess though he has a good side and you love him so perhaps you need to compromise too

fuzzywuzzy · 14/04/2008 14:02

Would classes for a five year old be four times a week tho?? I would have thoguht they would start gently and not get too serious till the children are older?
I intend to enrol my eldest in karate classes, because it does boost self confidence, and hopefully co-ordination as well, and it's a fun way of getting a good work out.

Lovesdogsandcats · 14/04/2008 14:09

Agree with others about taking her only if she wants. Regardless of what he says.

Shewillbeloved, that made me smile

Baffy · 14/04/2008 14:13

His attitude is unreasonable.

But ultimately, he is lashing out because you and the boys spend a lot of your time doing this hobby and not only does he feel left out, but he doesn't want to lose dd to it too.

To be fair I can see where he is coming from in terms of feeling left out/excluded from something that really doesn't interest him. He can't help that.

Really I think as his wife you should try and understand why he's behaving this way and work through it together.

Yes he's being unreasonable. Yes your dd should be allowed to go if she's keen. And you are all entitled to have that time to yourselves to enjoy your hobby.

Just don't lose sight of the fact that even though he's not dealing with it well, deep down it's not totally unreasonable to understand he may be feeling slightly jealous and left out (even though he could go too, it's obviously not for him is it).

Does he have a hobby of his own? Could he fill his time in other ways? Or do something with dd while you go there with the boys? Surely she won't train 4 times a week at her age...

Find some compromises and hopefully he'll come round. I think he's dealing with it badly but he's obviously struggling and he does need your understanding. (IMHO!)

Good luck. It's obviously very important to you.

cestlavie · 14/04/2008 14:14

Obviously, as you say, he's talking nonsense - actually he sounds rather like a bratty child, "don't want to stupid karate, only stupid people do karate" .

What is equally obvious, as you say, he that he feels very excluded and that's hardly surprising. You get to spend time with the kids doing something you all enjoy and love. You have a shared bond with them and he has absolutely no part in it. Even a lot of the things you talk about will exclude him. In addition, training four times a week is a very big family commitment which takes time and money away from doing other things. And now, he's looking at his own child being pulled into that/ away from him. I actually feel pretty sympathetic for the guy.

It's no good people just saying, he should get on with it. That's just unfair. Let's ignore the fact it's karate for a moment and imagine it was something you hate, for example, golf (which bores me witless). Three times a week, DH and your three children head off down the driving range or to the golf club where they meet up with their mates. At the weekend, they all head off together on a Saturday afternoon, and every few months they go on a golfing weekend together. When they're back home they like to watch it on TV, chat about club types and handicaps and buy golfing magazines. You suggest maybe they'd like to do something different for a change, maybe some karate (stage school in your case) and he says you can't afford to. How thrilled about life would you be?

Yes, he's being petulant and silly but honestly, I think you're being kinda insensitive about him and how he feels. Even though I love football and hope my kids will enjoy it, it would always be on terms that didn't make DW unhappy and made her feel excluded from family life. And I certainly wouldn't expect her to join in with simply to make me happy.

newgirl · 14/04/2008 14:19

exactly cestlavie and baffy - and we know that if someone had posted on here saying 'my dh spends goes out 4 times a week is he unreasonable' - we would all say yes!

perpetualworrier · 14/04/2008 14:52

How would you feel if he found a hobby to share with your DD and they were out doing 4 times a week?

Agree his arguments are feeble, but struggle to find a picture of a functioning family where one half is out doing their own thing so often. Sorry.

DivaSkyChick · 14/04/2008 15:15

I thought they were going to practice whilst her DH was at work?

I don't think you can just take her anyway if he disagrees so strongly, unless you're hoping for a divorce down the line. Sounds like he's really made it into a deal breaker.

Personally, I would insist that HE sit down and explain to her why she can't go with her brothers and mother to learn karate. He can look into her little face and tell her that he thinks what her brothers and mother do is "stupid" and "not for girls." (I'm hoping he'd be too embarassed!)

Also, I guess he'll come home from work and watch her while Mom is at practice with the boys, right? He'll take on all the repercussions that come from splitting up the family three times a week?

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