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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Would this be a dealbreaker for you?

59 replies

chocopopsatbedtime · 01/07/2024 23:43

Divorced with teen DC, so is my Partner of 2.5 years. He has a good relationship with his ExW, I have met her and his kids as well as his wider family as his new partner.

DP and I have tried to approach this relationship differently and transparently. We both made communication mistakes in our marriages before and have talked through how we will be honest and open with each other. We've practiced this well so far and been close as a result but there are a few scenarios where I feel he is secretive just for the hell of being secretive.

DP is currently in the US having attended one of his DC graduation with his ExW and her new partner. I could not go because of work but was invited. He has been in contact with me regularly, sending pics, and I've been aware of his plans, as he has had to take several flights - one to new york for a work meeting before flying to oregon to meet DC, ExW and her partner for the graduation and then on to California for another work related meeting. When DP and I fly which we do a lot for work, we always notify each other of take off and landing. It's not a rule but we both do it a lot as a way of checking in. I have not been paying a huge amount of attention to his trip, as been busy with my own stuff (DP has actually been asking me to be in touch more and calling me during breaks,) however today we've had an exchange which has really bothered me.

Today DP left Oregon for California. I assumed he was taking a flight as I had asked him several times a few days ago, when was he "flying" and he had responded that he was "getting down there" on Monday. I asked specifically when his flight was twice, but I realised when I looked back on the whatsapps he had not replied specifically about it. I had asked because he was trying to plan something for the weekend for both of us and the day he returned would have a direct effect on when I could leave work and when I would make a booking for us.

He was checking in as usual today but there were some long gaps between correspondence. I responded to one message asking him what time his flight was again. He read it and there was a gap of about 3 hours and then he responded "I'm driving there now. Bad signal. Just stopped for a hike," and sent a picture of a remote location.

I said, I'm finding it a bit weird you didn't tell me this! I looked up the distance from where he was in Oregon to where he's going in California, and it's an 11 hour drive - he is essentially on a road trip with a rented car. He also would not have done an 11 hour trip alone, so I assumed then and there that he is with his exW and her partner. I said I was surprised he didn't tell me, but that it was none of my business what he did, and wished him well and to have fun. He then got quite defensive and said "why do you have a problem with me going on a hike? Can't I just go for a hike in peace?"

I said I have no problem with the hike! I just find it strange I knew every detail of your trip apart from this bit, and you are taking an 11-hour road trip, obviously with ExW, instead of a 2 hour plane ride. He responded "Honestly, I'm just making it up as I go," (which is really NOT true as he is a planner and he has been scheduled back-to-back with work and is also trying to schedule me in to go away this weekend and sort his flights back from california to do his meetings and return on time.) He then sent a pic of his DC, his ex wife and her partner under a cactus by the car.

I said listen if you just told me what you were doing, I wouldn't have cared, I just find it weird you didn't tell me you were on a road trip about it and now you're gaslighting me! And he wrote back "Will you stop! It's just a hike. Jeez."

AIBU to be upset about this and to feel gaslighted? He's not cheating on me, I know that. It's all quite innocuous. But for a relationship that is built on having no secrets, honest communication etc (a rule implemented by HIM) that's a pretty shady way to respond?

Sometimes I feel like secrecy is just ingrained in is being. Like he keeps some things under wraps for the sake of it. Like he would not reveal what he had for breakfast if he felt I was too interested in it.

OP posts:
Olivia2495 · 02/07/2024 09:24

But for a relationship that is built on having no secrets, honest communication etc (a rule implemented by HIM)

The rules were for you. Not him.

Secrets are about control and being in a one up position. I wouldn’t want to be with someone like this.

ColinMyWifeBridgerton · 02/07/2024 09:48

I don't this that this is what gaslighting means.

But if it bothers you, you'll have to address when he's home.

Greydays10 · 02/07/2024 10:07

Olivia2495 · 02/07/2024 09:24

But for a relationship that is built on having no secrets, honest communication etc (a rule implemented by HIM)

The rules were for you. Not him.

Secrets are about control and being in a one up position. I wouldn’t want to be with someone like this.

This.
He is not honest when it suits him not to be.
That makes him a liar.
It is not about the reason for lying, the content of the lie, but the deliberate intention to lie.

He deliberately misleads and uses DARVO when challenged.

I couldn't be arsed with a relationship which involves this.

Total deal breaker OP.

Beth216 · 02/07/2024 10:38

You know he's been lying because when you asked him about the flight he said 'getting down there' rather than anything about taking off/landing times. He's done that purposely because he knew he wasn't flying and was lying by omission. The outright lying came later when he said 'Honestly, I'm just making it up as i go' when he clearly knew days ago (at the very least) when he was answering you in an evasive fashion. The most depressing thing IMO is that he begins a lie with 'honestly'.

Whatever he was like in his past relationship OP, he hasn't changed.

Bestyearever2024 · 02/07/2024 10:47

The relationship is built on good communication

Well......not this time it isn't. I wonder what else he doesn't tell you?

Is this a one off?

Bookworm20 · 02/07/2024 11:19

OP, I'd feel the same as you. Its not about him taking the road trip and having a hike its the fact that you'd asked him multipole times about when his flight was scheduled for and he ignored it each and every time. Thats very strange.

I mean taking an 11 hour road trip across the states is something most partners would mention, surely! Even a simple, we've decided to make a day of it and drive there, stop for a hike and enjoy the scenery.
Ignoring it completely is just plain weird, especially as you'd actually asked about his travel plans.

No idea why he would do that. It makes no sense.

blackpooolrock · 02/07/2024 11:52

Why are you both checking in with each other so much? surely you both have better things to do with your time?

If someone text me to tell em what they had for breakfast, then a bit later txt again to say what they were doing, where they were going and carried on like that all day I would need to tell them to stop it. I don't care within reason what you had for breakfast, where you are going, who you are with etc etc.

thats way too much info i dont need to know or care about.

Get a life.

Desertislandparadise · 02/07/2024 11:57

blackpooolrock · 02/07/2024 11:52

Why are you both checking in with each other so much? surely you both have better things to do with your time?

If someone text me to tell em what they had for breakfast, then a bit later txt again to say what they were doing, where they were going and carried on like that all day I would need to tell them to stop it. I don't care within reason what you had for breakfast, where you are going, who you are with etc etc.

thats way too much info i dont need to know or care about.

Get a life.

You're missing the point. It's about being lied to for no apparent reason. Each couple has their own level of communication. If the DP wanted to go a bit lower contact he could have been honest about that. Purposefully hiding things only to blow up when asked a simple question is definitely a red flag.

Bookworm20 · 02/07/2024 12:41

blackpooolrock · 02/07/2024 11:52

Why are you both checking in with each other so much? surely you both have better things to do with your time?

If someone text me to tell em what they had for breakfast, then a bit later txt again to say what they were doing, where they were going and carried on like that all day I would need to tell them to stop it. I don't care within reason what you had for breakfast, where you are going, who you are with etc etc.

thats way too much info i dont need to know or care about.

Get a life.

You've totally missed the point 🙄
OP had to schedule something her DH had asked her to and so she asked about when his flight got in so she could coincide the plans with that.

Are you really saying that you'd not mention a fairly epic 11 hour roadtrip across america to your partner who had innocently asked when your flight arrived so they could sort out the plans you'd asked them to?

I cannot think of a single situation where my partner wouldn't respond to 'what time does your flight arrive?' with 'oh we're not flying, we're going to drive'.

Nomad14 · 02/07/2024 13:00

Just say "it's not about the hike FFS! It's about not being open and honest and then gaslighting me"

Blondiebeachbabe · 02/07/2024 13:22

Why are his child, ExW and her partner travelling to California, when he is going there for work? Surely they would have just flown home from Oregon?

alwaysmovingforwards · 02/07/2024 13:37

Hungrycaterpillarsmummy · 02/07/2024 06:51

You missed the point. It's the fact he alters what information he gives based on OPs interest. The breakfast thing was just an example but it could happen on the most important issues too.
It's a power play

Nope I’ve not missed the point at all, but maybe you have..
The OP drilling for meaningless information like what he had for breakfast and then being cross for not getting a chapter and verse response… questioning things that don’t matter to test a partner’s level of response?!
Sorry but that is the very definition of a power play. It’s controlling behaviour.

I’d just ignore the question.
If pressed I’d be vague to make clear I’m choosing not to engage.
If pressed again about not answering the question, I’d call it out as controlling behaviour. And probably be having severe doubts if this relationship will last much longer.

StankyMeg · 02/07/2024 13:43

I can't say I'd particularly care about this tbh.

It wouldn't occur to me how he's travelling or if he's going for a hike. He's hardly going to be shagging his ex if her DP is there.

Did he think you'd make a fuss about them all doing a road trip together?

ChristmasFluff · 02/07/2024 17:37

There's no point even discussing this further with him, because he will keep on making out it is about the hike, so he can accuse you of being controllling or whatever. Even if you outright say 'FFS, it's not about the hike' he will insist it is, because this is what these types of people do.

Absolute dealbreaker for me. I've been there once and never, ever again.

caringcarer · 02/07/2024 17:55

Really weird he just wouldn't have flown. 11 hour road trip sounds insane.

supercali77 · 02/07/2024 18:53

@alwaysmovingforwards except she didn't say she asked him about breakfast in great detail, she said if she were to ask him about breakfast (something innocuous) he'd not tell her if she seemed too interested. As an example 🙄

alwaysmovingforwards · 02/07/2024 18:58

supercali77 · 02/07/2024 18:53

@alwaysmovingforwards except she didn't say she asked him about breakfast in great detail, she said if she were to ask him about breakfast (something innocuous) he'd not tell her if she seemed too interested. As an example 🙄

You’re kinda reinforcing my point.
Thank you 👌

supercali77 · 02/07/2024 18:58

Op 2 things. If his account is true (Road trip with exw and her dh) then I'm not sure I'd pack in a 2.5 year otherwise decent relationship over it. It's weird. Actually it's really quite weird. But I'd be more inclined to have a conversation with him when he's back.

Other thing is. Do you know the photo was taken on the same day for certain? Because...it is quite weird behaviour.

supercali77 · 02/07/2024 19:01

@alwaysmovingforwards no, you've just missed the point

alwaysmovingforwards · 02/07/2024 19:04

supercali77 · 02/07/2024 19:01

@alwaysmovingforwards no, you've just missed the point

Nope, I’ve made a point about this sort of behaviour being toxic and controlling.

But interesting how far over your head this point is, you seem oblivious. Oh well.

EvenMoreFuriousVexation · 02/07/2024 19:34

I'm starting to get annoyed by the word "gaslighting" being used for "not telling me everything I think I should have been told" or just "lying".

Gaslighting is a seriously abusive behaviour in which the perpetrator aims to make their victim feel that they are losing their grip on reality. This can then be used by the abuser as "proof" that they are an unfit parent, etc. In some cases victims have even been sectioned or medicated.

What you've got is your man neglecting to tell you he's going on a road trip with his ex wife, their shared child, and his ex's new partner.

What I will say is that people who insist on absolute rigorous honesty sometimes think that that's a one-way street.

DealingWithDickHeadExes · 02/07/2024 19:39

Olivia2495 · 02/07/2024 09:24

But for a relationship that is built on having no secrets, honest communication etc (a rule implemented by HIM)

The rules were for you. Not him.

Secrets are about control and being in a one up position. I wouldn’t want to be with someone like this.

@chocopopsatbedtime this PP has hit the nail on the head I think.

OP, Is the honesty and openness really two way? I have fallen for this before, thought I’d met a really honest, mature man with high values and we were all about circles of trust, etc etc. It was all bollocks and became a very clever way of controlling me.

I would also think twice about someone so “conscious” and eager not to make mistakes, to be (exasperated, contempt?) “jeez can’t you drop it” rather than (loving, compassionate) “ah sorry, I can see that might have triggered you” or “ah sorry, yes I can see how that looked” etc.

Just my 2p but as you can see from my username, I’m biased!

StankyMeg · 02/07/2024 19:48

I'm starting to get annoyed by the word "gaslighting" being used for "not telling me everything I think I should have been told" or just "lying".

Gaslighting, narcissistic and triggered have been repurposed on the internet by people who don't know what they mean.

It's not just on MN, very widespread.

FakeMiddleton · 02/07/2024 20:02

The hike thing in and of itself is fine. As is renting a car blah blah blah... it's the deliberate shiftiness.

This would disturb me too.

FakeMiddleton · 02/07/2024 20:04

Hang on, I've done that road trip: Portland to SF. It was two days driving. It's hard going. Stopping off for a hike too? Nah, something's off here