Failing relationships with my children

[Canneversleep]

I don’t know where to post this as my children, both girls, are 13 and 10. I hate being a mum. I love my children but it’s just so hard and they are really horrible. They’ve lost respect for me and I don’t know what to do.

They just don’t do anything I ask, they won’t tidy away, empty the dishwasher, tidy their rooms or anything. My 10 year old won’t even get her own drink.
They do a lot of activities in the evenings, these are ones they asked to do so I end up driving around hours 3/4 evenings a week to take them to whatever activity they are doing.

They fight and bicker between themselves all the time.
Their dad and I divorced 7 years ago and he is still very angry with me and lets the children know about how bad I am so I know this doesn’t help.
my 13 year doesn’t care if everyone is late for school and work if she’s not got her hair and makeup right, she just won’t leave in time, my 10 year won’t get dressed and some days refuses to go to school so it becomes a fight to get her dressed and in the car, where the journey consists of arguing who sits in the front and throwing shoes and hairbrushes at each other for the half hour car journey.

We need a reset going back to the start but I don’t know how to do that.

You need to go back to basics, or this is only going to get worse. So toughen up mum - no activities if they don’t help round the house, no more make up or hair products if they don’t sort out the morning routine and be ready on time. Yes it will be hard and no doubt they will push back to begin with but it’s either that or just put up with increasingly being their slave. Do you have any relatives or close friends who can have a word with them?

I agree no more clubs and I would empty the rooms of everything. If they can’t be respectful then they don’t have these extras. If there’s no make up or hair products you might be out on time. You can’t make them like you I suppose but you can make them respect your time and money at the very least.

I don’t know about the advice above to be honest. In a house filled with anger and resentment and conflict (I’m not saying it’s your fault @Canneversleep ) adding to that isn’t necessarily going to solve any of the above, especially not at these ages. I’d be more inclined to use carrot rather than stick

Why are you rewarding your girls for bad behaviour OP.
They are too young to be wearing makeup & hair products - family shampoo etc until they are old enough to buy their own.
Your children are old enough to help - I’m not talking Cinderella. But part of parenting is to show children how to be independent for when they eventually leave home.
Back to basics OP.
Rewarding them for bad behaviour by ferrying them to various activities - no no.
If they don’t behave or help they can’t go. They also have a Father why isn’t he sharing the activity runs I know you are divorced but you can’t do everything.
Pick your battles OP but you need to press reset . It will be hard but stay strong
You are the parent and your word is final

Is there a reason why your 13 year old can’t travel independently to school , walk or bus ?

Why are you taking them to their activities if they won't even get ready for school on the morning? You need to start giving consequences. What happens if your DD refuses to get herself a drink? Do you just go get it for her?

Do they get pocket money? What consequences do you currently give?

How often do you do fun things together? Can you put in place some regular fun activities? Also be mindful of how you speak to them - it's much easier to expect respect if you give it.

That sounds so though, you do need to sit them down and explain you’re at a breaking point and things are changing
they live in the house so they need to contribute- so set some tasks for them to do and privileges (clubs, pocket money) are revoked if they don’t do their bit
then let go where you can
their rooms are not tidy, they get to live with it, just be clear common areas are left tidy, anything they leave in a common area will be binned (if expensive don’t bin just remove and don’t give back until they improve)
10 yo won’t get her own drink, let her go thirsty, I’m assuming no special needs so let her live with the consequences
13yo won’t be ready on time, set a time you need her at the door, if she’s not ready she has to go in public transport, she’s 13, she’s able to do so, I know public transport will take her longer than you driving and will be extra late for school, let her suffer the consequences at school
the fight, siblings fight but throwing things at each other while you drive is even dangerous, stop the car and take the offending item, put it on the boot of car, if possible don’t rerun the item
they will shout and rebel, just keep firm, and praise when deserved

Firstly, to realise that things aren't working well and ask for advice means you are already on the right track.

Obviously this is just an idea, because we don't know enough about your situation but from your post it sounds a little bit like you feel you are doing a lot for them, but their individual behaviour towards the family isn't great.

I would try to think if by any chance you feel you overcompensate due to splitting with their dad, and to try and show your girls what a great mum you are, and not how you are depicted by their father.
Are you proving something to them, to others ? I think if you feel too strongly about making sure have everything and every opportunity then sometimes it's difficult to stop giving those things. You feel like it's a punishment on them, rather than just normal life.

I believe that normal family interaction, simple things like respecting others in the family( not making others late for instance), compromising, helping out when needed or a part of weekly chores, is part of the "basic" package, but the one that requires most of parents time and energy because it's created by consistent parenting and being there to encourage such behaviour.

I know that I personally would have struggled to do that in a calm way and also enable multiple extra curricular activities that required ferrying around. I wasn't a single parent but spent lots of time parenting alone and I had to adjust my expectations while my children were small . I didn't have the mental energy to do it all so concentrated on the basics. Obviously there will be many parents who can manage more than me, and others who can organise more help.

I'm not saying you should necessarily stop doing things, and certainly not as a punishment, but I believe that if you are pushing yourself to the limit as a parent it's not easy to have the patience to deal with day to day things in the best way.

For things like who sits in the front, you need to get a rota in place, so 13yo sits in the front on Mondays, 10yo on Tuesdays etc or one on the way one on the way back. If a child is running late when you need to leave they forfeit their right to sit in the front for that journey and the next. If they’re throwing shoes/ hairbrushes in the car these things need to travel in the boot and they can have them when arriving at the journey. You need to start putting firm consequences for behaviour in place or things will be a lot worse in another 2 years time when they’re both teenagers.

I’ve always gone with natural consequences. Don’t get ready, go as your are etc. Still do fun things together but definitely won’t let them control everything otherwise they won’t be able to live in a society. If you don’t respect your boss you get sacked. I wouldnt argue or raise voice, just remain calm but I would absolutely take all the make up etc away as those things aren’t a necessity, they can be earned though.

As a divorced/single parent too, I found this age difficult as they’re too old to be completely biddable, but not quite independent enough to organise themselves. And it leads to you feeling permanently beleaguered where you’re still the only adult in the house, but frustrated too as they should now be doing more. Can you sit down at the weekend for a family meeting? Drop the rope on some stuff. Draw up a roster (Supernanny style), and outline that the car leaves at x time, and no flexibility on that. Activities don’t get renewed next term if they don’t play ball. I’m quite forgiving of my guys because they’re still developing the skills and not every misdemeanour needs to be brought up and argued about.

@Canneversleep Is there a possibility that you're being extra accommodating and lenient with your daughters because you know your ex is badmouthing you to them and you're trying to win their approval?

Kids do well with firm consistent boundaries. They also need to be taught what's reasonable. It isn't reasonable for anyone to be chauffeuring them about four nights per week for hours at a time. They should pick one activity each, and that's their lot - unless your ex is going to step up and do his share of the driving. Personally I'd also refuse to drive them anywhere until they start being safe passengers. Throwing shoes and hair brushes isn't on.

If your daughter wants to do her hair and makeup before she leaves for school, she needs to be getting herself up early enough to do that. If she can't plan her time, she's not old enough to be wearing makeup, and the makeup gets confiscated.

Don't be frightened to put rules in place because of how your ex might behave. Your kids will hate the rules at first, but even the most stroppy obnoxious teens are able to appreciate on some level that they need structure (while simultaneously railing against it).

Part of this is normal hormonal changes that happen at these ages which will make them moody and trigger happy. A healthy well balanced diet will help. Ban processed foods from the home.

I strongly believe in the powers of love and affection, vigorous exercise, and being kept busy!

Enroll them in a physically exhausting sport, that will release happy endorphins and won’t leave much energy for fighting.

Praise them and kiss and cuddle them to high heaven when they do something good, you’ll find they do more of what you praise and reward.

Reduce criticism to zero and instead ask them how you would prefer something to be done, rather than telling them not to something… e.g. “would you please speak quietly” rather than “don’t shout”.

Remember, they will do as you do… speak quietly and gently, genuinely listen to them and try to accommodate their needs, show them they are very important and you love them dearly… they are sponges and will treat you the same way you treat them. Model good behaviour towards them.

They will sense that you hate being a mum and it will frighten them and make them sad… fear sometimes comes out as anger or depression.
Arrange to see a family therapist to help you all.

Heal them with love and positive attention rather than negative attention.

Do you think you might need assertiveness training or are you usually alright on that front?

First and easiest rule, no one sits in the front of the car, they sit in the back from now on. Mine were only allowed to sit in the front if there was only one of them in the car.

You are rewarding bad behaviour, there doesn't seem to be any consequences for their actions. Stop getting the 10 year old a drink. She's 10 not 2. She can either get the drink or go thirsty. My Mother would say you have 2 hands and 2 legs, get it yourself.

I think if you sit down with them and talk to them that clearly this isn't working, everyone is shouting and bickering and this isn't the way to behave or get your feelings across. I agree with ski above, use positive language, name the behaviour you want to see not the stuff they are doing, so I would love it if you could be ready on time rather than you always make me late.

Give them agency, say I can see that getting ready in the morning seems to take too long so what could you do to make this situation better? Don't feed them the answer of get up earlier or organise things better, let them problem solve.

Going forward I would talk to them about their activities. You don't even need to say you won't take them, they both understand how schools deal with bad behaviour so ask them if you spoke to a teacher like you speak to me what would happen? Then why do you think it is okay to speak to me like that and then expect me to take you to your activities? Ask would they do a favour for a friend who spoke to them like shit? Let them come to their own conclusions about it.

We teach people how to treat us, you are allowing them to treat you this way with no consequences so they continue to do so. You sound like you are doing your best as a lone parent with two hormonal girls and you know this isn't working and so are looking for solutions, it makes you a good Mum.

You have been given some great advice by Skiskii and scrumpler. When you have family meetings, remember that there are three of you in the family. They need to feel some investment making things better and not that it's just you imposing rules on them. As they get older they are learning autonomy and who they are. There's always going to be rules you have to put in place for their safety but you want to get them to work with you. This comes through having an honest conversation and learning what is important to them, as well as what you need. Try to make it problem focused rather than person focused. For example, rather than saying "You need to tidy up more", look at as "If the house isn't kept clean then it's going to become an unhealthy environment. How should we share the tasks to stop this?"

Ask them about things that they don't like, that are happening and suggestions for how to fix them. Once you get things that you can all agree to abide by, type them up and post the rules to remind everyone what was agreed. You could also agree on the consequences for breaking them.

Regarding the throwing things in the car, this is beyond dangerous. I solved the arguments in the car with our two kids by saying that I didn't care who started it or was in the wrong, if they argue when the car was moving they were both in trouble. I said that if they started arguing, then I would not continue driving. It only took a couple of times of parking the car, waiting for them to be quiet and then being late for things they wanted to go to, before they got the message. It's a lesson they both remember now as young adults and the oldest who is now driving appreciates why!

Thank you all for replying. It got worse just after I wrote this post, I asked their dad for help and he called ss saying I couldn’t cope and was a danger to them. The girls refused to stay with him as that what ss assumed was best after he called them. They went to my parents whilst it was being investigated (although the worse 5 days of my life I think it did everyone some good).

yes I was doing too much but not to compensate for their dad bad mouthing me, it’s because I believe it good for them. My youngest still does 2 evenings a week, my oldest has stopped all activities now (that’s another worry itself) but it was a competitive sport and was very tiring so was one the reasons she was late in the mornings.it was her choice to stop in the end.

There wasn’t any other forms of transport to school but after appealing and pushing though a number of avenues we now have a bus service and both girls now catch that to school most days.

they now hardly ever see their dad and although I never get any child free time, I do feel it’s better for them.

my now 14 year old is much better but my now 11 year old is up and down. I did stop an activity she was looking forward to last week because of a massive tantrum and she’s been warned she will miss the next one of her behavior continues. We will see what happens this week.

the girls can make food and can tidy up, as were doing so before covid, they used to love making beans on toast and me a cup of tea, surprising me with a clean kitchen. They are both very independent when they want to be and I’m so proud of their achievements. I inherited some money and I think that became part of the issue, I could afford to give up work so went very part time and spoil the children and I became soft with it. Somehow it seemed better when we didn’t have any spare money and all had to pull together with me working everyday

I’m glad things are looking up for you all OP.
Sometimes less really is more x