Domestic cleaner demanding money owed

[Thefirstime]

Recently finished with our cleaner and they are demanding payment for a day when they cleaned and are saying they wasn’t paid.. don’t know why they didn’t mention it before…

i am stumped - my DW took care of paying and they are saying due to a cancellation back 2 months ago and then they were paid every month - there was a payment missed..

this is all cash in hand btw..

I don’t believe it for one second.. what to do?? Hardball?

they stole stuff (have no proof of course) and most of cleaning products were taken

This isn’t necessarily true. It is more difficult to prove a negative, whereas it should be in theory easy to prove a positive for example by evidencing a cash withdrawal on X date, the cleaner could take them to small claims if they could be bothered and it would be on OP to prove they DID pay. Considering they have already admitted they aren’t absolutely certain they did pay, it would be an easy win in small claims for the cleaner.

Well if you have no proof they stole and they have no proof you didn’t pay I’d chance it that if you block them they’ll disappear. I had a cleaner steal once it’s awful

If a payment had been missed she'd have told you long before this. Why now when she's got the sack for theiving? Sounds like a right chancer.

She stole from you?! I’d just block and be done.

Yes, or you could ask to see her receipts from her VAT return when replying to that small claims writ. What? She doesn’t declare cash - oh wait….

A domestic cleaner is unlikely to be VAT registered. More likely to be registered for Self Assessment, which is very different.

Or not declaring at all.
honestly OP if you suspect she stole from you, I’d say something along the lines of “as far as I’m aware, we’ve paid for every visit. In cash. As I’ve noticed xxxxx is missing and unaccounted for, let’s leave the matter there.” And then block.

’We have checked and all payments are up to date, as we pay two weeks in advance. Please return all items that belong to our house - cleaning materials etc and we can discuss the situation in a meeting whilst you are here.
Please bring details of dates worked and when you think you were not paid. We will double check with our bank. Thank you’

I cleaned houses for years and most people pay by direct transfer after you've finished work. Do that in future. You shouldn't pay cash ever as it enables tax and benefit fraud.

A sole trader cleaner who is paid in cash would not be vat registered.
You don't have to register for vat until your turnover reaches 85k

Do they message you before a clean or after? Maybe check texts. I'd pay them and let them go, especially if you suspect things are missing.

Serves you both right for trying to avoid tax

What did she steal?

Why facilitate cash in hand payments?

When was this payment from? Surely they wouldn't have kept coming if they hadn't been paid.

Well exactly... It's a bit like going to a shop and weeks later and saying they didn't give you change and you don't even have the receipt.

She should have a receipt book, and be able to demonstrate a missing week.

If you don't have proof, neither do they or if they do, they need to show you it. I would call their bluff. If you think they have stolen from you, threaten them with the police.

No one should be paid in advance of doing their work - you should never have agreed to that.

If you employ someone again, keep careful notes and only pay in arrears. But I guess you've worked that out!

Next cleaner you need to insist on a receipt for every payment as standard.

If there was a chance you didn't pay then I would pay them and ask for a written receipt. Sounds like they could be a tax dodger or perhaps illegally claiming benefits.

Are you paying cash-in-hand to avoid dealing with all the admin that comes with legally employing someone? If so, neither you nor the cleaner have a leg to stand on.
Alternatively, if this is above board, you are in a Mexican stand-off; she says you owe money, you say she stole from you. Neither have proof. Suggest both sides walk away

What are you on about? No one employs a cleaner for their home a few hours a week. The cleaners are always self employed

VAT is only payable on business income above £80k-ish per year. 😂

Omg some nonsense on here about vat and employing cleaners.

@Thefirstime 💯moving forward get a receipt book. Or only transfer via bank payments. And be clear if you or they are supplying the cleaning products. And if your cleaner has/had keys I’d be changing the locks if you don’t intend to pay what they say you owe them. Personally, I’d avoid the hassle over £50 or whatever. Pay it and move on. You do need to check your household insurance before engaging a new person/firm about what you need to see from them by way of insurance etc to comply with their terms. This time the cleaner ran off with your Toilet Duck, next time it could be jewellery or something more sentimental…

It isn’t illegal to pay someone cash for their time/service if they are not VAT registered. It isn’t illegal to pay them in cash if they are either - providing you know they have charged any VAT due and given you an invoice which says so. What is illegal is paying cash knowingly to defraud HMRC of VAT revenue or asking a trader to do so.
How a sole trader/ person/company whose revenue is under £85k pays tax is not the OP’s concern, but these days getting a receipt is pretty standard to protect all parties.

Of course they employ (i.e. use to do a job) cleaners for a few hours

Not all those who employ cleaners go through agencies. FB is full of local cleaners offering services. Quite a few people here have suggested that cash-in-hand payments for tax avoidance is a thing
Yes, they may be self-employed, but you still have responsibilities
Whilst you can still pay 'cash' to employees both parties are required to complete PAYE / HMRC obligations. For the person who accepts cash, if they are self-employed, they are required to declare their income from cash-in-hand settlements or paid cash on their annual tax return.