No dad better than coercively controlling one?

[LauderSyme]

Long story which I won't bore you with but now this;

We live 100 miles away from ds's dad. I no longer want to communicate with him. But he is appropriate and supportive with ds (14) when they talk frequently on the phone so I would not prevent ds from having that relationship, which he values.

Ds's dad is saying that if I won't speak to him anymore then he won't speak to ds either, and will have nothing more to do with him. In case it's relevant, ds is autistic.

So I need to refuse to be coerced and then try to help ds deal with feeling rejected. This is far from the first ultimatum but I have always backed down before. Any advice appreciated, thank you.

Get rid of him. Neither you nor your son need a manipulative person like that in your life. I’d work through some healthy grieving and boundary setting exercises/thoughts with your son and explain to him why this is happening. You both deserve so much better. 💐

Is there some kind of mediation service you could use - something like this?
He shouldn’t be using your DS like this, but equally it would help if you could find a way to resolve problems.

Let's be honest, if he loved your son he wouldn't do that - so NC is better with this nasty man!

I would pour my time and energy into helping DS learn how to see himself as worthy even when being rejected by a cruel and manipulative person (and how to maintain healthy boundaries that minimize these kinds of people in his life), rather than into placating and managing a cruel and manipulative person who won’t respect healthy boundaries.

Does DS still need you to organise things, how much does he know about your past relationship? at 14 I would have thought other than lifts to places DS would be contacting his dad when he wanted to and no longer needed you. Would ex seriously not answer when DS calls?

Ds has a fairly clear but hopefully age appropriate understanding of our relationship I think, I have tried not to share anything beyond his years but he knows there is conflict.

His dad said he will block us both. I think I must believe he will or I wouldn't have backed down before.

Ds is quite a young 14 in some ways and though very bright is vulnerable, so for instance I have only let him do local 10 minute bus journeys by himself within the last six months.

It's his choice whether he sees his son or not.

My ex is playing similar at the moment. Either I agree to his long list of rules as well as meeting to 'discuss things' or he will have to walk away from the kids. He 'cannot take my coercive control anymore'.

He's blocked now (except for when he has the kids).

What a pig - tell him it’s his choice to abandon his son - these buggers never take responsibility. I understand your dilemma. It’s tough. Do he pay maintenance at all? Is it through CMS? If not I’d start the process. 🌺

I'd call his bluff. Your child doesn't need that sort of man in his life. Who needs a bully as a role model?

We had a private arrangement that he used to stick to but now says he can't afford. He keeps promising he'll pay when his circumstances change. If I go to CMS he'll perceive it as an attack but I may have to decide to do that.

My DD14 has had no contact with her narc dad for 12 years. Yes no contact is better than an emotional abuser.

Thank you, I can't talk about this IRL so these replies are helpful.

I think yes, no dad is better than a dad who doesn't care about his son and use him to manipulate his mother.

This!! No dad is better than one who models very poor behaviour for an impressionable teen lad, especially one who is on the more vulnerable side. And since he says he will block you both you’d be perfectly justified in saying you have to go through proper channels for CM now since he has taken the decision to remove contact for you both making managing a private financial arrangement impossible. He will still likely kick off as you say but it would be as a result of his actions.

This is so tricky for you, I would be inclined to bite the bullet, go through cms and go nc yourself. The ball is then in his court and you need to prepare to explain and comfort ds if ex does go nuclear, but kindly explain to him that it is ex’s way of punishing you and that ds does not deserve this but it’s something you need to do to be able to pay for things etc.

@LauderSyme What sort of conversation etc does your ex want with you? What is the bare minimum you think you can get away with without him blocking you and DS? I would do that. It's only for a few years.

Of course if he's phoning you all the time, that's different. There's only so much you can put up with.

He wants to talk to me every day to ensure I am enforcing his rules for ds, which are mainly good rules like nutritious diet, limited screen time, good sleep hygiene, exercise regime to support ds's performance in his sport.

Also less good rules like insisting on a certain haircut ds doesn't want.

His dad often gets frustrated with me (as he puts it) for basically not parenting the way he would.

It is very common for coercive / controlling behaviour to continue after separation. Your ex has no interest in parenting. His only priority is to retain control over you and to continue to interfere in your life.

I have also experienced this. It's awful. At the point I refused any further direct communication (I insisted it went through a third party), he cut all contact and (of course) blamed me for his decision. He never paid a penny in child support either.

So I would say to you - go ahead and refuse any further direct contact. Your DS is old enough to handle his own phone and arrangements. If your Ex uses this as an excuse to no longer be involved in DS's life, then you will know for sure it was always about controlling you and having access to you.

Go through CMS for child support payments as that will also prevent him contacting you directly.

Sending strength and solidarity.

@LauderSyme based on your last post, yes he’s definitely trying to control you still. I’d cut ties.

He is bluffing most likely he won't follow through because where is the fun in that chances are he will continue to use ds as a conduit to get to you until ds pushes back or he gets someone closer he can control basically when the fun is gone

Just reply 👍 block him (on your phone so he can still email) and go through child maintenance tell child maintenance he is financially abusive and you won't be doing a family based arrangement nor will you be communicating with him about anything

Also get a ring camera and lock down security at your home because this response will suprise him not in a good way

He doesn’t get to enforce the rules on your time,it makes no difference whether they’re good rules or not.

maybe start small, take ds for a haircut. Let him choose.

He's still controlling you, you have to block him.

Either he's bluffing and he'll keep in touch with your son. Or he won't, in which case your son is better off without him anyway.

I highly suspect he's bluffing anyway. If he blocks your son, then he's completely lost the ability to involve himself in your life, which I bet he'll be completely unwilling to do.

@LauderSyme How often does he see DS to be able to see the haircut? I'd just let DS do what he wants with it and then your ex can do something about it if he sees him and wants to pay for it.

Answers =
'Yep
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=Conversation over. x

Yes, no dad is better than a dad in his life who doesn't care about him. It's important that we model healthy boundaries for our children. It's not to do with my dc's dad (dh is lovely), but another family member. They said they only wanted to be involved in my dc's lives if it could be on their own terms (which were not safe from a safeguarding perspective as involved exposing dc to risk of harm). They weren't willing to change or get any help for themselves, so we ended the relationship. If they truly valued my children, they'd sort themselves out so they could be an active caring part of their lives. I can't expect my dc to grow up to make good choices about the behaviour they tolerate in their own lives if I'm too afraid to do the same on their behalf as children.