Trial separation/affair/thoughts welcome

[hashtaglifeistricky]

Hiya. Just posting to help offload some of the enormous stress I'm under but will have to alter/omit some details or I'll be identifiable.

Husband has had a year long affair with a work colleague. Mid 40s. A lot of life trauma including bereavement, relocation, cancer the past few years...all the ingredients basically.

He ended the physical affair 6 months ago but continued the emotional one until I found them out (checked phone). At that point he said he was committed to trying to save us, started therapy etc. But they still work together. I never felt I was getting quite the remorse and commitment I needed from him and felt I was doing all the "work" my end....he would say that his work was to separate from her and try and fall back in love with me...not easy to hear. Basically we'd have periodic flare ups where I'd do something I shouldn't like check phone....but then would find flirty messages, just the odd one but too much for me in current fragile state. This happened last week after a few weeks of what had felt like progress.... we talked (shouldn't have), he said he's still ambivalent and unsure of a future with me....I asked him to leave to sort his head out.

The past few days with him gone I've felt calmer and more in control than since it began. I still want him back but have finally seen that I can't cling on, he needs to go away and make the decision himself.

Anyone else been in a similar position ever?

It's so hard.

All the emotional fallout from the kids is coming my way and it's breaking my heart.

Thanks for listening think it's just helpful to be heard sometimes.
Couples therapy tonight... we'll see where that leads.

Oh God, put yourself out of your misery and end the marriage. He's told you frankly he's trying to see if he can tolerate staying with you for the kids sake.

he said he's still ambivalent and unsure of a future with me...

What he means is that he no longer wants to be with you, but he wants you to be the bad guy and end it so he doesn't have to.

Toodle-fucking-loo to him.

He can’t decide if he wants to be with you.
He has said he has to try to fall back in love with you.
Although very hard to hear, these two things are not impossible to overcome. Many people are more pragmatic than sentimental when it comes to relationships.
He’s not making the effort. He’s not owning his behaviour. He’s being passive. I’m sorry op, but it sounds like he can’t really be arsed and is just waiting for either you or the OW to force his hand one way or the other. This is hard to overcome.
Finally, he’s still flirting with the OW. This is indefensible.

hmm ok....pretty definitive thanks! I just can't believe he's willing to give up everything we've had over 20 years for the possibility of something with her (she is married with 3 young kids, not told her oh, also feeling ambivalent and undergoing couples therapy...)

midlifecrisis is real isn't it. all our friends thinks he's lost the plot

MN is always very black and white when it comes to affairs - LTB is usually pretty universal. But I think you’ve done exactly the right thing. Kicking him out firstly saves you having to watching him mooning over the other woman, which must be truly painful for you. It’s all bollocks anyway, this “star crossed lovers” shite. It’s not love, it’s a cheap thrill, devoid of reality, played out by selfish, insecure people.
But he is clearly still deep in the affair fog (this could also be described as being thick as fucking mince) if he honestly thinks you will hang around indefinitely whilst he “decides what he wants” after finding out he’s spent the last year or so shagging someone else? The man is deluded.
Slinging him out may well help him to realise what a colossal bell end he is being. And, more importantly, it gives you time to experience life without him. And I suspect you will find you prefer it…… Good luck x

Oh, she’s not told her oh? Well, I’d be doing that straight off. The man deserves to know the type of person he is living with and she needs to realise that shitting on other people has consequences. But I’m harsh like that!

Make the decision for him. It isn't up to him it's up to you if you want to take him back. He's shown you exactly how commoited he is, he feels ambivalent towards you and is still messaging her!

It will be easier to do while he's already away. Pack his shit up and when you have finished calmly explain to him (via message is fine, you don't owe anybody some dramatic face to face break up, the idea that you do only serves the partner who either enjoys comflict or wants to talk you down) that you can't go on with the relationship and the betrayal is too much. Tell him that it will be better for you both, it will, it sounds like neither of you are happy. Lots of people on here say things like find your anger, I don't think you need to be angry, be calm and collected, you have given it your best effort and he hasn't. It's his loss.

I believe reconciliation or divorce are both valid choices. However your husband is still in an active affair and therefore he isn’t reconciliation material.

I am in a bit of a rush so I have rehashed a previous post of mine.

Couples counselling - I advise you sack the counsellor on the spot at any mention of Unmet Needs. You didn’t cheat, the marriage didn’t cheat - Mr cheaty has the issue. He thought having an affair, in secret, was a valid choice. He needs to work out why he thought that was okay.

He allowed himself to open his door to this woman. When he first overstepped the line he knew he was doing wrong. He isn’t taking responsibility for his choices. He had an affair because he wanted to. He cheated because he felt it was a good choice for him.

He needs to figure out his whys. He will have poor personality traits that enabled him to do this: low self esteem, requiring ego kibbles (smoke up his arse), external validation, addiction issues, risk taking behaviours, people pleasing, inability to self soothe, instant gratification, poor coping mechanisms, poor communication skills, low integrity, dishonesty, ability to compartmentalise etc. Knight in shining armour complex (KISA). He needs to figure out his reasons and do the work. Unless he fixes the issues he will remain capable of cheating. Sadly the traits that allow someone to cheat are the traits that mean someone finds it very hard to do The Work involved in creating a new successful marriage. They want to minimise, omit the full truth, rug sweep and push you to get over it. They play the victim and blame the relationship (or you) for their crappy choices. They experience regret but not remorse.

Cheating is easy, it’s not because a person is sexy or desirable, anyone can cheat. Just download tinder or pop to a sex club. I choose to remain faithful. It’s a choice that I make. My vows mean something to me. I don’t cheat for me. My husband is really annoying at times, I don’t remain faithful for him. That would put him in control of my behaviour - which is daft. I could even twist that logic and say if he does A I am faithful but if he does C I flirt with my administrator or the man at the bar. So I am not faithful for him, I remain faithful for me. I want my word, my self respect and my integrity to mean something to ME. Because I matter to ME. What am I if my words are meaningless?

Try reading Not Just Friends by Shirley Glass and how to help my spouse heal from affair. The website surviving infidelity will help too.

What I will say is you need to be prepared to lose this marriage. You need to push Romeo off the fence. You seem relatively calm so seek legal advice - do not tell him. Use his dopamine fuelled state to get your affairs in order.

But do not accept any unmet needs nonsense with the counsellor. Your need for honesty, integrity and reliability aren’t been met - how will shagging the postman (mine is always on time and never steals my birthday money - so honest and reliable) fix your marriage? It won’t.

Google the 180.
Get onto surviving infidelity website.

I wish you well but you need to prioritise you (not your marriage). The time to fix the hole in the roof (your marriage issue) was before the affair. He popped a grenade in and blew up the house. Until the basement is swept out you can’t work on your marriage. Trickle truth and holding onto his low integrity Juliet means he hasn’t swept out his basement. There is no marriage to fix.

Sorry I’ve rehashed this but I’m struggling for time and wanted to reply.

You could say:

Dear husband, I love you and I want to fix our marriage. However there is one thing worse than losing you and that is living a life in infidelity. I am not prepared to do that. The longer this continues the less likely I will want to work on this marriage and the more likely I will want a divorce. Getting out of infidelity is now my priority’. Then leave the room and do not engage. Leave the house if possible. Do not discuss at all. ‘I have said my piece there is nothing to discuss’.

Awesome words of wisdom, as always @FairyMaclary

It is real, sadly. And one of the biggest issues that kicks in is the ego. “My wife/husband doesn’t appreciate me. Fine, I’ll find someone who does.”
The irony being, if they’d married the affair initially, they’d be doing exactly the same to them. Life, marriage and kids come with stress, insecurity, lack of time and appreciation, but not all spouses throw their hands up and look for validation and ego stroking elsewhere.
The only ones who are worth trying to work it through with are the ones who own their actions, realise that the grass really isn’t greener (it’s just a different shade) and then do everything they can to make amends and rebuild trust and love. Even then, it doesn’t always work.

Why leave the decision up to him?

He's left the marriage already. I'm sorry. Tell him to leave.

And I'd tell the husband too. He should have the choice too because his wife has left their marriage too,

He cheated on you - and you still know you want to be with him.
But he's telling you - the mother of his children who is sticking with him despite his affair....he is not to sure if he wants to be with you?
I'm sorry he is just waiting to see if this woman will agree to leave her husband for him. In the meantime he is keeping his cake and eating too like he has been doing since the affair started.
Stay strong you deserve better than this.

Is he just stringing you along until OW makes a decision though? If she were already separated, which way would he go do you think? I suspect he's stringing you along whilst you do the pick me dance.

dunno. just had therapy. she's not leaving her oh any time soon. he's just sticking to his line of I didn't meet his needs he was deeply unhappy therefore he had an affair and now not sure he wants to stick about. I just need to accept it, sad as it is and plan for independence. v hard that I'm the one who has to manage the kids anguish, they give none of that to him whilst I have a weeping 11 year old in my bed every night. This is on top of my own cancer and losing my mum and moving to a city where I have no mates. Too much but hey ho onwards and upwards. I'm starting to dislike him quite a lot which may help. Just so weird to end up like this with someone you think you knew and loved for many years, can't get my head around it.

Oh OP, you are worth 10 of him. Your 11 year old too. Men - weak, spineless, selfish and rotten. Yes I am going through my own shit at the minute and can really relate to the ‘who is this man, after 20 years I never knew him at all’.

What made me well up and feel murderous for you was you losing your mum and battling cancer. How fucking dare he! Spineless excuse of a human being.

I am so mad for you. So so so mad

Harsh. It says they have 3 young kids. This could have massive repercussions for them.

Understand the upset and hatred towards the OW but I wouldn't be running to tell.

So sorry for you OP. IMVHO you can't save your marriage, at best he will come crawling back once/if he decides there is no greener grass to be had. He won't love you though because he wouldn't have shat on you from such a great height if he did. You can't save the marriage but you can save what's left of your dignity and self-respect. Don't let him take that from you as well. Fuck him and his being "unsure" if he wants a future with you. Make the decision for him and take back control. If he had any desire for a future with you he would know it and he would be bending over backwards to try and make it happen. If he decides he wants you at all it will only be as a last resort. You deserve better.

Sorry to hear he isn't investing the effort to fix.

Agree with previous post. Focus on what you can control- that's what you need. He can't expect you to hang around just incase he decides it's worth it.

Be kind to yourself. Eat, drink, exercise, sleep... small things, but they help.

@hashtaglifeistricky - you know what, OP, you sound awesome.

Glad you’re starting to find your anger. This way you can move on knowing you tried to put things right but as PP have said: you can’t fix the relationship unless he’s 100% committed to the process and he isn’t. Try not to get hung up on his excuses for his poor behaviour. They’re about him and if it was the OW he’d been married to instead of you, he’d probably now be doing the same to her.

As regards telling her partner - he should probably know but you don’t have to be the one to tell him. It will drag you into a load of drama and you’ve got enough to deal with at the moment. Concentrate on yourself and your DCs.

I’m sorry it didn’t go as you had hoped. What did the counsellor say? Are you having a new session. Look up Gottman counsellors and Gottmans work - I personally think they are the best relationship books out there. I reread the seven principles of making a marriage work annually.

Unmet needs - how does steak every Saturday, watching his face team together and oral sex every Tuesday increase someone’s integrity, honesty, reliability and self respect? It can’t.
Did he communicate these ‘unmet needs’ to you?

Did he say Op it makes me really sad that we don’t go for a walk/play a game/visit the theatre at the weekends what can we do to make our life better? Or Op I am concerned about our marriage I have booked with a counsellor on Weds I will be there, I hope you will be too’.

I hope the counsellor killed the unmet needs rambling. It’s ridiculous - you didn’t give me enough sex or attention so I decided to throw away my core values of honesty and integrity. You caused me to become a liar because you were too tired to have sex. If you don’t wash up straight after dinner that makes me chase women.

A person with self respect, honesty etc would say wife how can we improve our marriage? If the answer isn’t what they want they would a) divorce you b) shut up and put up c) book a counsellor. Three very valid choices - all would keep their self respect intact.

All would mean he could leave the marriage and go onto a new relationship saying ‘No I never once cheated on my wife, it’s outside of my values. It is not something I would allow myself to do’. Instead he is now faced with dating and being a liar from day 1 or saying I cheated due to unmet needs. Yuk - many women would run immediately - I certainly would. We are in control of our actions and choices. My husbands actions cannot make me lose my core values.

I do think you can begin the process to save a marriage on your own (initially) but you really need to push him off the fence. You need to be prepared to lose the marriage to save it (sounds odd). However as you increasingly see his poor traits you may well find you no longer respect or like him. The pick me dance never works.

The 180 is a process to help you recover. Again google it. Also make sure you do everything you can to keep your self esteem high. You were loyal, faithful, committed and your word mattered - start there as they are good traits.