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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

What's the best option?

24 replies

Marriedandmiserable · 26/01/2024 08:50

Long story short I need to leave my home with my 2 kids (boy 2) & (girl 12). I know my husband wont leave he's done it before and realised how expensive it is. Plus he can't get another property now he's messed his credit up that badly. Tenancy on house is in my name but it's got to the point where I'm that unhappy I will just go and live in a bedroom at my mums. He's attempted suicide before (even though he knew it wasn't enough to kill him) threats, saying he'll send kids "goodbye" videos constantly making my life miserable. That's why I took him back only for the kids sake. I wish I hadn't bothered but his mum was sick & died 8 weeks later also so I just felt so guilty. There's no chance of Me getting another private rent it's just extortionate. I am quite lucky where I am now it's very reasonable for a 3 bed. My issue is will I be able to apply for a council house? Or is it classed as making myself homeless?? I can't stay here any longer. And I don't want them to say the kids can stay at home with him. I fear he will use them against me and take them as a punishment for leaving him. Why isn't it ever simple?

OP posts:
Rocknrollstar · 26/01/2024 08:59

You need to speak to a solicitor. Go to Citizen’s Advice. If the tenancy is in your name he has to go. There won’t necessarily be a council house available. There is a long waiting list wherever you live. Be firm and do what is best for yourself and the children.

XmaswasbadNYisworse · 26/01/2024 10:42

What @Rocknrollstar said.

It's your tenancy - if you left, he might well not pay the rent and you'd be left with the bill, plus any damages he did. Don't do that.

Talk to a solicitor. Get him out of the property. Change the locks if needed.

Lock down your kids phone if the older one has a phone, so he can't send that kind of video.
Have just one email channel he can contact you on re contact for the kids, block him on everything else.

If he threatens suicide, call the police on him to do a welfare check every time. It's a classic from the abusive man's playbook, don't let him suck you in, especially as you seem to already know it's a play and he has no intention of actually doing it.

He's worn you down, but it can get better, and it'll start getting better once he's out of your house.

CoffeeatIKEA · 26/01/2024 10:51

Go and visit your mum with the kids this weekend. Don’t invite your husband. Frame it as a little break for you or him or both of you or whatever he’ll believe. Don’t make it the breaking up conversation yet.
While you’re at your mum’s try to give Women Aid a call. This situation is coercive control. Threatening suicide to control your partner’s behavior is abusive. They can help advise you about how to get out of this marriage safely. You need a plan that isn’t going to leave you sleeping on the streets and having no where to take your kids so they end up with their emotionally abusive father all the time.

CoffeeatIKEA · 26/01/2024 10:58

You need to leave him, but you can absolutely get advice about how to do that safely before you press that GO button. So start talking to the people who can help. You’re right that it’s not simple. It’s an absolute nightmare.
Are you worried he might hurt you or the kids when you leave/ask him to leave? Are you worried that he might physically stop you from leaving?

CoffeeatIKEA · 26/01/2024 11:01

If you decide you need to stay in the house and he needs to go but you think he will basically just stand there and refuse to move - would the police remove him from the home if necessary? Or only if he becomes violent? This is a question you could call the non-emergency number and ask.

Marriedandmiserable · 26/01/2024 12:24

@CoffeeatIKEA he will 100% refuse to move physically. Because he has nowhere to go at all. That's why it's probably easier for me to go then he has no excuse that's how desperate I am. He'll have it cushy with a 3 bed house to himself & I will be sharing 1 bedroom with 2 kids. But If that's what I have to do that's what I have to do. Social services were involved when he tried to "kill himself" police automatically send them they signed us off as they were happy they were healthy safe with me. Do you think I could ask them for help?

OP posts:
Hbosh · 26/01/2024 12:30

I think you need to be asking these questions to professionals.
You need to be speaking to a sollicitor, to the police and to whatever organisations you have in your area to help.
Asking for help is never a bad thing, whether you receive it or not.
A forum full of mothers isn't going to able to offer the kind of advice you're looking for. All we can do is encourage you to stand up for yourself and to be strong.

OutOfOrder67 · 26/01/2024 12:34

The tenancy is in your name, and he has to go. Why uproot everyone when it’s easier for him to go?
I agree you need to ask professionals, and him refusing to leave could result in the police.
but I would say that’s a far better plan than intentionally making yourself homeless

spartanrunnergirl · 26/01/2024 12:34

Can you move out then terminate the tenancy? Otherwise you risk him not paying rent etc and you getting a bad credit rating plus being landed with the bills. Move, terminate tenancy, inform him of the notice period.

Marriedandmiserable · 26/01/2024 12:53

@OutOfOrder67 he has nowhere to go at all.. council won't even entertain a single man. And he has fu**ed his credit up already so he can't private rent. Only way he got a house previously was because I guarantee it. But I knew he was struggling to pay so I didn't wanna be responsible so that's why I let him leave it. Before he got that house he was threatened to kill himself because he has nowhere to go.
@spartanrunnergirl yeah it's not an issue all the bills are in his name anyway from when we first moved in 10 year ago. All I'd have to do is tell landlord I'm no longer living here. And obviously the council tax. It's all on him then.

OP posts:
Hbosh · 26/01/2024 12:57

I think you're missing the point.

Whether he has a place to go is not your problem.
You are still allowed to kick him out of the house while the lease is on your name.
Those are two very unrelated things. The fact that he is a grown man with no money, no savings and no support network is a direct result of his terrible life choices. Again, not your problem and not a factor you need to consider.
Involve the police if you must. It's your home, it's your childrens home. Why on Earth would he be allowed to stay?

Marriedandmiserable · 26/01/2024 13:09

@Hbosh I know I have the right to stay my concern is this is what happened last time before I managed to secure him a house. He was threatening to kill himsef send videos to my kids etc. Messaging me threatening me. I don't want to put my kids through any of this especial if he did kill himself. How do I tell my daughter he did it because he had nowhere to go and i could have stopped it by just moving out and living with my mum

OP posts:
Hbosh · 26/01/2024 13:21

Marriedandmiserable · 26/01/2024 13:09

@Hbosh I know I have the right to stay my concern is this is what happened last time before I managed to secure him a house. He was threatening to kill himsef send videos to my kids etc. Messaging me threatening me. I don't want to put my kids through any of this especial if he did kill himself. How do I tell my daughter he did it because he had nowhere to go and i could have stopped it by just moving out and living with my mum

I can see how worried you are for your children.
However, if you plan on giving in to him now, because he makes these threats, be prepared to give in to him for the rest of your life.
What makes you think he'll stop using these manipulative arguments after you've moved out?

Sending threatening messages to children about killing yourself is a crime. Tell him you'll have him arrested if he ever sends a message like that, and notify the police of the things he's saying to manipulate you.
If he's sending you messages like that, block him.
Notify the police that you fear he may be suicidal. They could have him committed and under supervision of a psychiatrist.

Keeping him alive isn't your responsibility. You can not carry that weight on your shoulders. Mostly because (although you never know for sure) he's probably just emotionally blackmailing you and not intending to commit suicide. No reasonable person would hold you responsible for causing his death if he kills himself after you've kicked him out.

Purpleraiin · 26/01/2024 13:24

My best friend has just gone through a very similar situation. She called social services eventually and asked for help. I'm not sure of the exact titles of the workers but I know she was assigned a social worker or maybe a key worker, someone along those line......this person then helped her out with getting onto the council lists etc....they helped get her sorted into temporary accommodation whilst she waited on the housing list. She was not refused or told she had intentionally made herself homeless. She was in temp accommodation for around 6 months then offered a housing association property this month.

If I were you I think I'd call social and ask for the help. They will be able to help you navigate alot of the housing situation and form filing, and likely help you find out if your local council would class you as intentionally homeless. The info they already have from the previous issues with your partner could also come in useful with housing.

Definetly speak to your estate agents as well about getting your name off the tenancy. If its in your name then you are liable for the rent and the upkeep of the property. If he doesn't pay then that's you who's in the shit and will be you who's chased for the money. Any missed payments on rent, alot of councils will not accept housing applicants from people who have rent arrears so you've got to get yourself into a position where you are not on the tenancy or liable for it in any way.

Windymcwindyson · 26/01/2024 13:32

You are nuts if you leave him your home.

GreatGateauxsby · 26/01/2024 13:35

Purpleraiin · 26/01/2024 13:24

My best friend has just gone through a very similar situation. She called social services eventually and asked for help. I'm not sure of the exact titles of the workers but I know she was assigned a social worker or maybe a key worker, someone along those line......this person then helped her out with getting onto the council lists etc....they helped get her sorted into temporary accommodation whilst she waited on the housing list. She was not refused or told she had intentionally made herself homeless. She was in temp accommodation for around 6 months then offered a housing association property this month.

If I were you I think I'd call social and ask for the help. They will be able to help you navigate alot of the housing situation and form filing, and likely help you find out if your local council would class you as intentionally homeless. The info they already have from the previous issues with your partner could also come in useful with housing.

Definetly speak to your estate agents as well about getting your name off the tenancy. If its in your name then you are liable for the rent and the upkeep of the property. If he doesn't pay then that's you who's in the shit and will be you who's chased for the money. Any missed payments on rent, alot of councils will not accept housing applicants from people who have rent arrears so you've got to get yourself into a position where you are not on the tenancy or liable for it in any way.

This is good advice I think.
find someone in the system who can help you navigate this.

In the meantime…. for the love of all things holy do not just move out.
It’s your tenancy, you are responsible and financially could be in real trouble if he trashes the place or similar.

Question: how long is left on your tenancy?

Mitherations · 26/01/2024 13:37

He doesn't get to put make his children and their mother homeless by threatning to kill himself. If nothing else you can see that's entirely unreasonable? He is manipulating you and controlling you.

You need to keep your home for your childrens' sake, and you need professional support in order to get him out. It doesn't sound like you can see the wood for the trees at the moment, see Citizens Advice, speak to Womens' Aid, and see a solicitor if you can afford to.

Marriedandmiserable · 26/01/2024 13:41

@Purpleraiin I know I can just phone the landlord directly to say I'm no longer living there. That's only thing in my name currently the bills go out of my bank but they're in his name I am just named on the account so I can discuss. Its just so hard because either way my kids suffer. I'd I move out which would give him no reason to moan about anything he's got a fully furnished (by us) house with cheap-ish rent. But my kids don't have their bedrooms etc. Or I stay and they risk losing their dad if he kills himself over having nowhere to go. I just feel hopeless. And they love him. They're both daddy mad. I don't want them to resent me.

OP posts:
Summerhillsquare · 26/01/2024 13:41

I'd explain your situation to women's aid and social services op. Coercive control is now an offence, sounds like you have evidence from previous incidents so don't hesitate to report to police if needed. Keep asking for help, basically, until you and kids are safe and well.

Marriedandmiserable · 26/01/2024 13:42

@GreatGateauxsby there's no end date I've been here 10 years. The landlord relies on this as his income. And he isn't near retirement age yet so I would guess possibly another 10 years.

OP posts:
GreatGateauxsby · 26/01/2024 13:56

Marriedandmiserable · 26/01/2024 13:42

@GreatGateauxsby there's no end date I've been here 10 years. The landlord relies on this as his income. And he isn't near retirement age yet so I would guess possibly another 10 years.

Right….

that most likely means you are on a rolling tenancy. Ie you can end it with a couple of months notice
contact shelter - they can help advise you if you have your contract. If not ask landlord for a copy.

i am putting this in CAPS kindly

THE LANDLORD CAN FIND ANOTHER TENANT.

there’s a housing crisis it’s shouldn’t be hard.
even if it is it is not your problem.

step 0: please prioritise yourself and your children. Not your awful husband and your landlord… 🧐
step 1: work out notice via shelter and give notice
step 2:contact council as per @Purpleraiin s advice

CoffeeatIKEA · 26/01/2024 14:31

Marriedandmiserable · 26/01/2024 12:24

@CoffeeatIKEA he will 100% refuse to move physically. Because he has nowhere to go at all. That's why it's probably easier for me to go then he has no excuse that's how desperate I am. He'll have it cushy with a 3 bed house to himself & I will be sharing 1 bedroom with 2 kids. But If that's what I have to do that's what I have to do. Social services were involved when he tried to "kill himself" police automatically send them they signed us off as they were happy they were healthy safe with me. Do you think I could ask them for help?

I don’t know if social services would be able to help. Hopefully someone With more experience will be able to answer that one. Definitely social services are the people to talk to if you’re worried that their dad won’t cope with contact with the kids for a while after you leave.

Anotherparkingthread · 26/01/2024 15:31

This is madness, what does it matter if he has nowhere to go? You are really going to make your kids and yourself homeless so this idiot that you decided to indulge can not have to worry about finding a room to rent?!

Stop being a mug. He will find somewhere, there are lots of places for single men. He won't likely get a council flat but that is on him, he will have to find something like a house share or a spare room. Even a hostel.

You want to take your kids security and bedrooms away, potentially for years because you won't get a council house while you have a roof over your head at your mum's, so he can't send some nasty videos? Block him from their phones before you turf him out. Get new SIM cards and change all your phone numbers the day you get him out.

It is your tenancy. It's your house. You won't get given one by the council. You won't find another rental this cheaply you even said so. You will be liable for any debt he incurs at the house and damage done. Not to mention your landlord who sounds quite reasonable not adjusting the rent won't be prepared after 10 years for you to do a moonlight flit and bigger off leaving a broke man child in their house who can't afford to pay for it. What do you think happens in 4 months time anyway? The landlord serves him eviction papers and 'D'H ends up without anywhere to stay anyway!

This has got to be a wind up, you cannot possibly be stupid enough to bow to him just because he is emotionally manipulative.

There is a housing crisis and cost of living crisis throughout the UK and you want to rip away your own and your children's security because you lack the backbone to stand up to this man?

Purpleraiin · 26/01/2024 15:35

Marriedandmiserable · 26/01/2024 13:41

@Purpleraiin I know I can just phone the landlord directly to say I'm no longer living there. That's only thing in my name currently the bills go out of my bank but they're in his name I am just named on the account so I can discuss. Its just so hard because either way my kids suffer. I'd I move out which would give him no reason to moan about anything he's got a fully furnished (by us) house with cheap-ish rent. But my kids don't have their bedrooms etc. Or I stay and they risk losing their dad if he kills himself over having nowhere to go. I just feel hopeless. And they love him. They're both daddy mad. I don't want them to resent me.

Sorry its turned out to be a long one!

I know this sounds really harsh and its easier said than done, but leaving him and not considering what he may do to himself is your best option. As others have said, he is not your responsibility. You've said he's attempted suicide before but also are aware it wasn't enough to actually kill him. Yes there is a chance he genuinly wanted it to work, yes there's a chance any threats of suicide are also genuine. But given the info you have shared, there is also a very high chance he is taking the piss, using mental health/suicide threats as a way to guilt you into staying. If he genuinly feels suicidal he would have likely acted on it by now, conveniently though, he's only coming out with these feelings and threats when you have had enough.
Once you stand your ground and don't react or respond to any threat he makes or any actions he carries out, he will get the message and stop. He's doing it because he knows that ls your weak point.

Call social and tell them what you want to do, tell them about his threats and your worries. They will help you, or at the very least they will put someone in contact with you from an organisation who can help. It's hard leaving someone and evan harder with kids involved and an ex who makes things hard. There will be someone to help you navigate your way out safely and they will be able to help manage some of the admin load when it comes to housing. He is emotionally abusive at the very least and social already have this on record from their previous involvement. Things like that will back up your housing application so it will be good for you to get them involved and have their records for evidence with the council.

Are the kids on contract phone or pay as you go? If contract, contact the providers and get their numbers changed ASAP and do not give them to him. If pay as you go, just get them a new sim card with a new number. That solves the issue of him contacting the kids with his guilt trips. If they are pay as you go, keep hold of the sims and check them occasionally for threatening messages off him, keep them if he does send any. They could come In useful in the future if things get nasty.

Get the number for your local crisis team. Once you've left, if he contacts you claiming to feel suicidal just send him the number for the crisis team and tell him to call them. If he contacts outright threatening suicide, call the police for a welfare check and let him know you've done this. If he contacts sayings he's already done something, (overdose for example) call an ambulance and let him no.
If you keep doing these things rather than engaging with his threats, he will get the message that you no longer see him as your responsibility and he will stop with the threats if he's not genuine.
Should his threats turn out to actually be genuine then you will have contacted the correct service in Any scenario and they will provide him the help and further support, not you.

You are absolutely not hopeless. You are just trying to take on to much responsibility and consider people who are not your problem. He's a grown man who can sort himself out, but it would be easier for him to play victim and be full of self pity so that you then sort his life out for him. Don't fall for it. You've got yourself and your kids to sort out, he isn't thinking of ways to make it easier on you and the kids so stop trying to think of ways to make his life easier. I'm sure there are ways you could get him out the house but I understand you saying you'd rather just go yourself. So think of that as you doing your bit to help him out. You've made sure he's still got a house while you and the kids have fuck all and start from scratch. That alone is more than enough so please stop thinking you owe him more to make his life easier and yours harder in the process. He certainly isn't thinking of you and the kids in the same way.

It's good the bills are in his name. Is it rented direct from the landlord or through an agent?? Before you evan leave the house you need to make sure the tenancy is dealt with.
The last thing you want to be dealing with is rent arrears racked up in your name, for a home you don't Evan live in. That will screw you over massively with several things, it has to be a priority before you leave.

How old are the kids? My message is already long enough so I won't add much more 😅 they won't resent you though. I've been in your shoes, as have many others. I know there's a lot of guilt there for the kids in this situation. Once you're out and settled, you will be kicking yourself for getting so worked up over the guilt and resentment worry, and you will quickly realise that the kids were only ever suffering in the old setup living altogether, not the new set up you will have.

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