Is this gaslighting?

[BananaOrangePear]

For a long time now, DH drinking has been getting out of hand imo. He's pretty much daily drinking, sometimes one day off a week but anything from 4-6 cans a day and maybe extra pub pints/wine thrown in too.

we had a conversation, well more of an argument yesterday. I said about his daily drinking and he was adamant he didnt drink all of last week. I know thats a lie. He knows thats a lie. He is very good at hiding what hes bought home and stealthily drinking. Except i know his hiding places. He will have a few beers on show but a secret bag of drinks elsewhere so it doesnt look like hes drank much

my recycle bin is over flowing every month with cans. Pretty embarrassing.

when hes drinking he gets the glazed look. Will be touchy at any conversation, trying to turn it into an argument. Slam a door be grumpy, swear

apparently hes not got an issue with drinking and everyone he knows drinks daily. Its me, hi, im the problem its me….apparently 🙄

I do not think it is gaslighting.
He is lying primarily to himself.

It's not "gaslighting" in the sense that he's deliberately trying to make you think you're going insane, which is commonly an abuser's tactic.

It's your common or garden lying from a drunk who's in denial even to himself that he has a problem.

You will never manage to persuade him that he has a problem. He's the only one who's going to be able to do that, and if he's currently not getting any serious consequences for drinking (lost driving license, lost job, lost marriage, lost kids) then he could have many years yet before he gets miserable enough to embrace reality.

All YOU can do is say where your red lines are, and maintain them. "If you continue to drink the way I know you are, I am leaving" is a perfectly acceptable line to draw.

Do you have children at home?

Yeah kind of. He's doing something and denying it even though you know it's true

I don't think it's gaslighting. I think he's simply not facing up to the fact he's an alcoholic. Addicts often lie to themselves and others.

Judging by what you're written, he's probably very alcohol-dependent and it might be time for you to consider your options for the future. He won't stop drinking until he wants to, and will continue to lie about his alcohol consumption for as long as he drinks.

He is lying to himself. He seems happy with what hes drinking even though its causing issues in our marriage. Ive said i want to leave and split up/get divorced. Its been a long time coming. Ive been so unhappy for too long. Yes we have children. Im both parents to them because hes so selfish, he plans days out drinking/going to events/weekends away with his mates and never anything with the kids. Im already living like a single parent.

yesterday’s argument was over him taking our teen over to their friends house in the car vs cycling. We live remote and it was freezing and dull yesterday. Would have been 40 mins full pelt cycling for them, some of which on a busy country roads of 40mph as no path. He didnt offer but stayed home watching sport and drinking. I was angry he didnt offer but instead made excuses how they needed the exercise etc. which led into the daily drinking argument. Its very sad he just continues to drink and no changes.

when i said about us splitting up, it was like i had just told him for the first time. He then started asking me for my reasons because he doesn’t understand- he was laughing at me when i said about his drinking was a massive part here, which is when he said everyone drinks like that ill find, i dont think so. He got all angry and ran off upstairs. I couldn’t have a grown up conversation with him. Frustrating

I would leave, he is not much of a dad, think of the money he must waste on booze every month. Hoping you have enough money to move out

He's a lying drunk in denial but don't think he's necessarily gaslighting you, although I wouldn't say he never will. Unless he admits it will only get worse.

He really is in denial isnt he. He makes me feel like i am making a mountain out of a molehill. He leaves me doubting myself. I just want him to go

He is self gaslighting.
He may genuinely believe he has days of not drinking or have done some mental gymnastics that he only has "1 or 2 cans" which doesn't count.

Why does it matter to you whether this is gaslighting?

Surely the issue is that your partner drinks excessively and lies about it? What use is giving the lying a name?

@Watchkeys i know its a shit situation. But after an argument like yesterday, it makes me wonder if it is me after all. Especially when his parents also minimise his drinking/behaviour too

It is you.

You have an opinion. You have a feeling. You have a problem with what he's doing.

Do you think that because it's 'you', it should be ignored or dismissed? What makes you de-prioritise your own views like this?

It doesn't even matter if it is you. You think he drinks too much and you are not happy with his behaviour. It doesn't matter if he only drinks a small glass of sherry at Christmas - you're entitled to your view. Whether he, his parents, or his mate down the pub thinks otherwise is irrelevant.

It's a bit like 'I don't like strawberries, but everybody says I'm weird and keeps trying to get me to eat them', or 'I don't like going to the cinema but everyone else does... is it just me?? Should I go??'

It's you, it's what you want, it's who you are, it's your preferences. We don't question this stuff anywhere except in relationships. Be who you are, and spend time with people who respect you for it.

Is it too much though?? Does everyone drink like that and im splitting us up for a small reason? Sorry i just dont know anymore 😩

genuinely confused. Do i put up/shut up

Is it 'too much' according to what, @BananaOrangePear ? What are we meant to be referring to for our answers? Our opinion? (Why would that be more important than your own?) The law? (Is that how you usually live your personal life? 'Everything is ok by me as long as it's legal'?) The health guidelines? ('He does everything else perfectly according to the NHS guidance, and I can't handle this anomaly'?)

It's not about some 'external' set of rules. It's not about 'what MN thinks'. It's not about what he 'should' do (because, aside from laws, there are no shoulds, and we can all do what we please, when we please). It's not about what everyone else is doing, because you don't live with them.

This is about you, and the quicker you get your head round it, the sooner you'll be happy. Your life is about doing things and being around people that you feel happy with. Not people who do things 'right'. Not people who do 'what everybody else does'. Not people who follow 'rules'.

He does something. You don't like it. When you talk to him, ultimately, you feel worse. So, you need to distance yourself from him, or you will be choosing to spend your time with someone who spends their time knowingly doing something you don't like.

Daily drinking isn't normal in my family. We tend to drink twice a month, once a week at most. And not to a drunk level, that's pretty rare.

Having a drink each day might happen on some holidaiez but then it's more likely only 1-2 beers in the sunshine in an evening

He's using the 'everyone does it' defence. What this really means is that 'everyone HE KNOWS does it'. He's surrounding himself with very heavy drinkers so that he can reassure himself that he's not that bad, and he doesn't drink nearly as much as Dave down the pub.

But he knows it's a problem. That's why he lies about how much he drinks.

It sounds like he's already an alcoholic.

Alcoholics ruin the lives of the people around them. Best advice is to get out as soon as you can.

Good luck x

Why do you live so remotely? It sounds like you don't drive, given that only he could give the lift. I am wondering if it was your H's idea to live there. Could he have isolated you on purpose?
Probably best if you put the house on the market, get half the equity, and find somewhere nearer to local facilities and public transport, for you an DC's. I'm sure your life would be easier then and they'd be happier too.

Also, yes he is gaslighting when he says everyone does it and tries to make you out to be unreasonable. It's not the norm at all. When it does happen though, the usual outcome is separation.He doesn't want you to realise that though, so is trying to convince you otherwise. Don't believe him, if you don't trust your own judgement because of his lies, trust what people on here are telling you.

Your relationship, your choice; only you can decide whether to put up or shut up.

We're just a bunch of strangers on the 'net, only responding to your description of what's going on in your life.