Is this gaslighting? Think it is, but only 99% sure.

[Turtletunes]

I've done a lot of research on gaslighting and narcissism over recent months in relation to my OH and I'm busy getting my ducks in a row. But even though I know now a lot about gaslighting, negging etc it's still difficult for me to identify it at the time it happens, until I've had a think about things sometimes for hours. Something happened last night that made me think at the time "Here we go again, I'm on the defence for something I haven't done" but now I think he's twisting reality to try and make me believe that I'm the one who's lying, conniving and manipulative when I haven't done anything. Gaslighting.
So, last night, I make dinner for the two of us as I normally do, and he says "There's something different about this to usual, the sauce is different" and I say "I usually get the sauce from a jar, but I made it from scratch myself this time". He snorts and says "Well you've said that before and it's turned out you haven't made it". I'm confused and ask "when have I done that?" and he says "That time we had those meatballs". I remember the occasion he's referring to. We had meatballs once and he asked how I'd made them, and I said I hadn't, Sainsbury's had made them.
I reply to the meatball comment "You thought I had made them, but I never said that I had" and he sniggers and says "but you didn't correct me and you let me continue thinking you had for a while". Totally untrue, I said straightaway that Sainsbury's had made them. Why would I pretend to have made something that I hadn't?
Anyhoo, I'm 99% sure that this is gaslighting, but having lived with it on a daily basis for 30 years it still gives me spaghetti brain and makes me doubt myself, despite all my research about it.
This is what day to day life is like with someone with narcissistic personality disorder. The only crime I had committed last night is making us a nice meal from scratch, but a narcissist will turn it into something else to screw with reality to make their partner feel shitty about themselves for doing a nice thing.
That's my perception anyway.

God that sounds awful and yes, he’s being a cunt!
Hope you get those ducks in a row and can make an exit so you have a peaceful life x

I don't know tbh. This sounds like a lot of boring conversations that couples/coworkers/friends have when there's not much to say. I wouldn't hang a relationship decision on it, but it sounds like there are other reasons you're preparing to leave so I think it's important to trust your instincts

You’re indeed being gaslighted and you should not live another 30 minutes, let alone 30 years (shudder) like you have

How can you be helped into leaving your abuser?. Can you contact Women’s Aid when he is out?.

Why are you using energy trying to specifically trying to identify his behaviours? You need to be working on getting away from him, don't you?

There’s a trick your missing- you engaged with him. Don’t bother. Nothing he says is what you need to hear, tune him out. You don’t need to care.

There’s no need to be aggressive or rude. Just incredibly vague. It’s called ‘grey rock’ but I think grey fluff is a better description- don’t give him anything to get a grip on.

‘this sauce tastes different’
‘Oh, Does it?’

You lied about the meatballs
oh did I?

You said you made them!
Did I?

Oh I don’t remember
Oh, do you think?
oh, ok.

Just vague and woolly. Give him nothing. Talk about the weather, ask him about himself, just deflect vaguely at all times.

It gets really easy to do and saves a lot of aggravation

This.

Don't bother tying yourself in knots trying to identify and understand the behaviour - just disengage and ficus your energy on getting out.

Ugh he sounds really horrible. Do you have children together? What's your home situation like in terms of rent, mortgage etc?

Forget about diagnosing him or putting a label on his behaviour. Get back to basics and realise that he is essentially calling you a liar. You've told him something - a fact - and he then responds as if to suggest that he thinks you might be lying.
Would you say that he tells lies often? Is he projecting onto you?

Or...just leave. That sounds exhausting. Saying 'oh ok' will surely confirm to him that he's right about it?

For a start stop doing any cooking for him. Or doing anything for him in fact. Meanwhile plan your exit, or preferably his, if you are in a position to get rid.

It's not about confirming he's right. The point with this technique is that there's no point in arguing with types like this as your counterarguments and explanations of what actually happened are unheard/not believed/deflected. So you can never "win". Basically there's no point in wasting any energy trying to defend yourself or clarify what happened as that leads nowhere anyways except to a shitty atmosphere and frustration and feeling unheard. Might as well just say "OK" and move on rather than getting frustrated that he doesn't believe you or get it etc. You know the truth yourself anyways and that won't change. Who cares at this point what he actually thinks is right or not anymore, either way he'll never admit he is in the wrong.

Not to say that you should live your life just accepting it and having all convos like this, definitely not, this is just a technique to get by with a type like this whilst you figure out to get out and never deal with them again.

@Turtletunes As a matter of interest, who else in your life gives you (or has, in the past given you) spaghetti brains?

@TinkerTiger it’s not confirming he’s right, it’s acknowledging he’s spoken which is the minimum polite response that deflects attention from you. People don’t get to leave immediately, they need to plan. In the meantime they need to survive with enough wits to actually make the plan.

The point of his behaviour is to suck all the oxygen out of the room, to make sure she doesn’t have time or opportunity to put on her own mask first, and generally exhaust her leaving her vulnerable to more manipulation.

Deflecting the way I described avoids attracting anger, helps you fly below the radar while you recover and gather your wits, and keeps you relatively safe. He may well not even notice which is by far the safest place for OP.

Thank you for all your replies and sorry for the delay in me replying sooner, I had to go to work. Yay! First job in years, first pay packet due at the end of this month! 💪

It helps me put a label on things and say "This is gaslighting" because it means I'm not imagining it and even though I know what I know now, about emotional abuse and narcissists, I still have a wobble when I think to myself "Is this really happening in my relationship? Or is it just a difference of opinion and I'm over reacting?". Giving the behaviour a label helps me stay strong in my decision.

turtletunes thank you for posting this thread. I’ve been wondering the same, and am finding websites where they seem to focus on the obvious things, I need to learn about the subtle things, like tpyour conversation.
like tonight, DH came with son and I to mooch about the Xmas lights as Ds a bit down. Instead he drags us to the tv shop to look at tvs after I’ve said, I don’t want to, and I don’t want one. Ds doesn’t want a new Telly either. 800!
on the way home he was saying,’well somebody wanted to go home‘’I feel that you weren’t very kind in the shop, I wanted to look at the tvs, you could have waited’ is this the same ?
sorry to interfere op.

Or is it just a difference of opinion and I'm over reacting

What is 'over-reacting'? Where are the rules/guidelines about how much or how little you should react to something? You are looking for external validation. You need to learn to validate yourself, internally. You need a mindset that says 'You may well think I'm over-reacting, but I disagree. My feelings represent my personality, they represent who I am. If you don't like the way I express them, that's about your preferences, and nothing to do with me, or what I'm doing right or wrong. Who are you to tell me that you know better about how I should react?'

Feeling that you might be over-reacting is a sign that you have a tendency to minimise your own emotional experience. Why do you do that? Where/when did it start? For whom did you have to minimise your emotional experience when you were a child? That's where you've learned this habit. What was always more important than how you felt, growing up?

Labelling his words and actions is about him, and that's what you do: you make everything not about you. But what if you were front and centre? What if you were the most important person in the TurtleTunes Show? What if what you felt actually mattered?

I see what you mean with the label, but equally all you need to think is 'do I feel respected and supported and are my needs being met' if you don't feel that way then you need to leave. If you did feel happy and respected and fulfilled in the relationship than the meatball comment would have been a silly quirk or something you agree to disagree on.