relate session was absolutely horrendous

[TLV]

think i'm in a state of shock by it all, stbx dh was so angry to the point counsellor had to ask him to calm down and that he was in effect abusing me in the way he was talking to me, she did dig deep and said that she felt that he really wasn't sure it was over because she when she said are you sure its all over he mumbled I suppose so, she brought up and probed why we were sleeping together he didn't like it and after 10 mins he stormed out of the session.

She asked if I wanted to go after him which I did and I had verbal abuse thrown at me in publc (people around) he eventually came back in, she said that all lines of communication were broken down between us and all he did was critize me when all i've ever done was try to make things work, lots more said but my mind is in a mess at the moment. its breaking my heart because we were never like this with each other, I called him later to make sure he was ok told him i couldn't bear the arguments anymore, I got shouted at again when i apologised as it was making him feel worse he said.

my life feels a complete mess at the moment and i'm trying so hard to hold it all together for dd's sake

It sounds like if was horrendous but perhaps there needs to be some big storms so that the calm can come and hopefully you can work through it together if that is what you both want?

Sorry not much help but didn't want to read and run.

don't know your story at all but didn't want you to go unanswered. Somtimes things have to get a lot worse through therapy before they get beter, although you probably don't ned to hear that now. Is there any chance he'll go away and mull over what she said and maybe some of it may sink in? My DH can be v. similar - everything causes an argument, everything's always my fault, but often I can tell that something I've said has gone in at some level as he often shows it when he's calmed down. Bug hugs and keep talking on here x

well the divorce is going through now although I asked and she even said about putting it on hold which he doesn't seem keen on the idea, the more I push it seems the more he backs away so i think i have to learn to let go which is really hard because of dd, so want her to have both parents together and happy.

It seems weird to me that a counsellor would take one person's side so completely. Are you sure she didn't address your communication and behaviour in any way?

yes she did address communication and behaviour like I said lots said but can't remember it all as there was a lot of anger in the session she was trying to see things from both sides in that I need to give him some space and he needs to address the way he speaks to me and that the most important thing is dd

his eyes were bulging because he was so angry and he was shouting and she was trying to take control

You seem to have come out of it thinking that it was his behaviour which was mostly discussed though.

From what you have said he doesn't want to get back together. Did he go there under duress?

firstly he said he didn't know why he was there then he said he went to earn some brownie points with me?? confused by that remark.

well his anger contributed alot to the session, other things probably would have been talked about if he was calmer

Maybe he is just not ready yet to deal with it all. I know if my h gets angry and he has in some conselling sessions it is usually becuase he is feeling 'trapped' and lashes out in anger. I am sure that he knows he is in the wrong and is feeling guilty about it but also feels that being told it by a 3rd party is not what he wants to hear.

Does he really want to go or is he just going along to keep the peace? Solicitors will sometimes reccomend so it looks as if you have done what you can to save the marriage. If he really does not want to (for whatever reason) he may be resenting it.

Carry on for yourself - and try not to appologise to him. Again though it sounds as if he may have some guilt and does not want you to make it up to him - he can then be the victim iyswim.

If he doesnt want to get back together then go your own to deal with your own issues and upset at it. Let him walk away and let him say you have forced him to going.

His next move will be to say you are witholding access and so he is going to 'prove' to you he can do what you want.

No if he didn't want to go he wouldn't, solicitors suggested mediation how the cost of it was too much and neither of us could afford it. He has never dealt with any problems very well, runs away from them me i'm totally different and prefer to sort things out, when I told him earlier that I wanted to mend bridges between us he again got angry coz it made him feel bad, I've got to think and concentrate on dd and to deal with this means not being at loggerheads with him as it all has a negative effect on her

Try not to worry if it makes him feel bad - it sounds as if he is not as strong as you.

Also do remember that we all tackle problems differently - just because you want to face up to them and deal with them does not mean it is the right way. Marriage is about finding the common ground and understanding what each other needs.

I like to discuss things at night but my h just refuses - i find it hard if i have a problem going around in my head but he just wont talk late at night. So we now try and have lunch together once a week to talk.

It sounds as if you need some rules first to stick to.

You cant make him change and really this is not going to get you anywhere.

How about accepting that he really does want the divorce and not trying to mend those bridges.

I need to make some changes to myself too, maybe you are right HW but brushing problems under the carpet doesn't really get rid of them as they have a tendancy to resurface.

I know that too well - but unfortunately you may have to for a while if he is unwilling to sort them out - only you can decide if you can live with that or not.

I am like you in that i think it is best to get these things sorted but i have also learnt to accept that not all of us are the same and my h tends to deal with things in his way and then move on whereas i tend to want to anyalise it to death so it can never come back to bite my bum so to speak.

strangely he agreed to go to the next session when she asked him, when you say withholding access HW do you mean towards dd coz i'm very careful in that he can't accuse me of it and he has had set days

When thinking about problems to be addressed, try not to think about "brushing them under the carpet" but about prioritising.

No-one can sort out all their problems in one go, and if you raise all the issues that aren't working for you with your partner at one time in a Big Talk you risk totally overwhelming him.

Try to work out what's important for you now, what is critical, and deal with that. And once that's sorted, move onto the next problem. You know that all the problems are waiting to be addressed, and can deal with that - he can only deal with a little at time.

well today was better, I'm so sick of feeling angry and so sick of crying, he came to collect dd this morning and came in and I was pleasant with him, he was found a flat to rent for 6mths and I didn't say anything about it (i think he expected me to go mad but I didn't) I asked him if he had though about the counsellor and my suggestion about putting the divorce on hold and he has said he will think about it, he apologised for the way he spoke to me yesterday and even got me a bottle of wine

TVL yes i did mean access to dd but you seem to have alerady got that sorted.

Something i notice is that you seem to be the one bringing up the subject - asking him to consider things - like the session and whether to put the divorce on hold.

He seems to be seeking something from you wrt to the flat.

I wonder if you feel that you are the 'parent' in the relationship and so have to take control? This is something we have discussed in our sessions and it rings true with me.

I think men like to fall into the 'child' roll as it means they dont have to think too much andn we tend to 'parent' them.

It is hard but try not to ask him about how he feels about the divorce - he needs to show you with actions not words you have 'coached' out of him. I hope that dosent sound too harsh. I know you want this to work but unless he does it wont. And if you feel that you have had to 'help' him along the way you will only later feel it was you that did everything to save the marriage and he did not. He may feel pressured into 'agreeing' and you will always feel that.

Also think the previous post about not tackling all the problems at once.

Anyway good luck and i do hope it works out for you.

And you probably feel that if you say nothing then nothing will ever get sorted. He will have got what he wants and you will be left with no answers.

It is a vicious circle and you sound trapped in it. You are pushing him to say one way or the other. Instead try to accept what he is 'doing' and get on with your own life, and show him that you do not need him or his issues in your life to make it complete.

I know only too well how hard that is though.

He might feel like all responsibility for the relationship failing is being put on his shoulders and; "all he did was critize me when all i've ever done was try to make things work", does seem to suggest you feel blameless and are a bit in martyr mode, which is incredibly infuriating.

He can't help his emotions, he can only try to manage them. The anger has a root. His anger isn't wrong, just the way he is expressing it. You need to understadn why he is so angry with you and be prepered to do some work on yourself equally.

There are some Relate guides here; buy two (they are cheap enough) of each and just give on eto him, don't emotionally blackmail him into reading them. But read them yourself.

Stop arguing, start talking

Staying Together: From Crisis to Deeper Commitment

and there is one about self esteem here

and one about moving on

There are plently of others too. Just type 'Relate' into Amazon books.

well just spoke to dh and he has emailed his solicitor today about putting divorce on hold, we had a really nice conversation and chatted for a while about each others day and infact i didn't even need to bring up the subject of the divorce he did first, also its my birthday next week and we are going to go out for tea, i'm trying not to get excited, he is coming over on sat was originally to cut grass but i did say it depended on the weather however he said he would come up anyway, will keeps yous all posted

Please don't get too excited. It's so easy to be disappointed - you will always have other birthdays - ones in more stable times. If he is trying to think about you, then why not do the same for him? It is hard - unhealthy even to put someone before you a lot - but gestures do work, both ways.

But try to accept you are in the middle of somethinmg that needs sorting out and even the odd nice time does not a mended marriage make. That takes hard work - from both of you. And it might take a long time with many awful periods inbetween if what you want is real trust between you

thanks for the advice its much appreciated, the divorce is now on hold, dh told me last night, I didn't want to push him or pressure him but I did ask if we stood a chance and he said he didn't know, I've done a lot of soul searching and actually got a really good book by a relate counsellor which has taught me not only to look deeper into our problems but to see them from his perspective too.

In all I feel in a better position than i did a few weeks ago as he was adamant divorce was going through and it was over, I also need to get my own identity back too as I realised I kinda lost myself since having dd (that doesn't sound daft does it?)