Upset parents, stuck in the middle

[Smerpsmorp]

I’ve chosen relationships because it’s about the relationship of my brother and DM.

DM and DB had an argument via text. SIL sent DM a message that was about 6 pages long about how to deal with their child. DM is an expert in childcare having been a childminder, raising three kids, and then working for a long time with SEN children. DM took offense, but said that she would try her best to follow their wishes. DB thought this wasn’t enough, and has now cut her off, and stopped parents from going to help out. Mum is devastated - because she actually agreed to do the thing they’d asked, and also because they never picked up the phone to discuss the thing they’d asked which is all linked to gentle parenting.

i will say that I have two adopted children, who love their grandparents more than anything. They are not a product of their times and are willing to change their ways and their language to suit my children. They will talk about birth family in the way we need them to, and they will defer to us as their parents whenever they need to aswell. Me and my husband both work long hours so we have needed them before, and they’ve been there for us in spite of living so far away. They don’t always get things right, because nobody does, but equally they show my children so much love, and treat them the same (if not with more love) as the biological grand children. And equally whenever I’ve talked about whatever I want them to do, they listen and are respectful of my wishes (but it turns out I very rarely have to do this, because they are so onboard.)

Mine and my two brothers upbringing was whilst not called gentle parenting, it was gentle parenting in most of the sense of the word. We were brought up with love and care. There were times my parents got angry (as I’m sure gentle parents will too????) but it was all with love. I try and emulate gentle parenting as much as I humanly can but it’s very hard to be therapeutic 24/7 as I’m sure any therapeutic parents know.

i am clearly very close with DM, but I’m finding I am having to undo a lot of the damage but also, mum has now sent DB a message which has been read but no reply which basically says you just need to let me know you’re okay, and this level of no contact is affecting her health. I recognise that from anybody who has gone no contact there is a level of guilt tripping, but equally I don’t see how they can go no contact over what has been said (mum has shown me the messages). There’s been no phone call between the two of them but they’ve essentially decided no contact because of the tone of a text message. And also all my mum is asking to know is that they are okay.

my other brother has invited us to Christmas dinner in between Christmas and new years, I fear that a) they either won’t come and it’ll just further upset my parents because they will think they are the reason that as brothers we are falling out (which isn’t true, they just never message or reply to messages or ever want to meet up or do anything) but also b) they do come and it’s going to be so awkward because my parents will be there.

i want to message my brother but I don’t know what I can say… or do to make this right. I don’t think I can do anything but I also need my mum to be happy and okay! But I just don’t think it’s anything I can fix…!

if you got to the end of that thanks!!! Even if nobody replies I think it’s helped me to write it down!!!

Yup. She sounds toxic, and so does your brother. Going NC with a parent, in my opinion, is only justified when there has been serious abuse or long term toxicity in a relationship. This sounds like a complete over-reaction by your brother.

Your brother and his wife need to give themselves a slap by the sounds of it. A gentle one, of course.
Your poor mum.

I suspect there’s more to your family dynamic, especially the relationship between your brother and your mum than you may be aware of. On the surface it all sounds petty but there may be a backstory that has contributed to this current state of affairs. Your mother has reached out, that’s all she can do, though the ‘it’s effecting her health’ comments was nothing but manipulative and makes me question your ‘gentle’ narrative.

Stop trying to ‘fix’ things, you can’t and it’s not your problem to fix. Let things settle and don’t be too quick to take sides.

So called “gentle parenting” doesn’t include isolating children from their grandparents without really good reason.
Your SIL and DB sound like control freaks!

This dynamic all sounds very OTT. Your brothers wife sounds OTT, your brother’s reaction sounds OTT. Your reaction is OTT. Your mothers reaction is OTT. How did your family handle conflict and confrontation when you were growing up? Healthy conflict is how issues get resolved.

Just let other people have their own relationships and stay out of it.

I wouldn't get involved op as anything you do or say will be construed by one party as taking sides.

I'd continue to have a relationship with both parties and if one side brings it up, simply say you're not taking sides and don't want to be involved. I understand you're being sympathetic towards your dp, and it already seems you've taken 'their side', but for your sake don't get involved otherwise you'll find yourself being cut off by your db as well.

Tbh your sil sounds a bit crackers by sending a 6 page text about how to parent their dc, but I don't know if there is any backstory - you hear enough mil threads on here to know it's a difficult relationship at the best of times.

What's OTT about OP and her mum's reaction?

This couple have gone entirely NC. Not just low, full no contact. Anyone would be devastated. Yet neither OP nor her mum have responded in a dramatic way. The mum is lost and worried, the DD wants to help. All very normal.

I do think the "affecting her health" bit is unnecessary drama, and it makes me suspect family drama is the norm.

Ditto. I suspect there are other issues. In my experience children do not cut off parents unless it’s a last resort.

The MIL rather than being a parent and resolving the issue herself, has drawn the other child into the issue which has the potential to impact their sibling relationship.

As @Honeychickpea has pointed out the "affecting her health" is deeply manipulative and makes me think there is definitely more to this than meets the eye. I’d love to hear SIL and brother’s POV.

What's OTT about OP and her mum's reaction?

I do think the "affecting her health" bit is unnecessary drama, and it makes me suspect family drama is the norm.

And the triangulation and the practically perfect in every way spiel about the mother. None of us are close to perfect. We are all flawed in significant ways.

Oh your poor mum. It seems like quite an overreaction from brother and SIL unless your mum majorly overstepped the mark, or there have been other things going on.

Just keep out of it ... all you can do is support your DM but try to refrain from getting involved or commenting. My own DM trues desperately hard to get on with her DIL where really it would be better to just maintain a polite, cordial relationship rather than trying to be 'best friends'. I've actually had to say to her 'I am not prepared to discuss your relationship with SIL anymore'.

If that were the case then grandma shouldn't even have been in the running for childcare

Your poor mum! Support her and stay out of it - however we’ll intentioned your involvement will just make things worse. Hopefully with time they will chill out.

Your mum should have kept her own counsel and agreed to their list of rules. It’s their child and their choices. If someone said to me they’d ‘try’ to follow what I had asked, I would be in no doubt that it wouldn’t be happening.

Your mum also isn’t an expert in their child, parents are the experts. My DM is a teacher but would never proclaim to know better than me what’s best for DD.

Finally, continuing to message them when they’ve gone NC will feel intrusive, and pleas about her health manipulative and controlling. Give them the space they have the right to need. You say your DM has messaged them saying ‘you just need to let me know you’re okay.’ Well actually, they don’t need to let her know anything and harassing them like this is bound to drive them further away.

If you get involved OP, you’ll be a flying monkey. Stay well out of it and keep your own counsel if you’d like an amicable resolve.

Well, I've given my MIL lengthy instructions for looking after my dc when they've been in her care before. Probably in the 4-6 page range - directions to their school, what food I got in for all their meals, what needed to be packed for whatever activity, how we usually do bedtime, where dh and I would be with address and phone numbers, etc. I see it as making these as easy as possible for someone who isn't used to providing childcare on a daily basis. I think if MIL responded with 'I'll try' I'd be pretty annoyed and probably wouldn't be keen to having her look after my dc anymore.

I suspect this is probably about something bigger and comes down to being about not being listened to and not having needs met and boundaries respected. Maybe your DB is fed up with saying he needs his mum in a certain way and her not coming through? Maybe he feels like she doesn't like or respect his partner and is putting her first because it seems like everyone is out to talk shit about her? It could be any number of things, but I can see how this would be really hurtful when it's part of a larger cycle of what's going on in a relationship.

That said, are your DB and SIL going 'no contact' or are they simply not responding to messages? These are completely different things. It's okay to give yourself time to cool off, to not respond right away if you feel you might respond angrily, to have some space in any relationship. That's perfectly healthy. It doesn't mean someone is 'going no contact'. I think you and your mum both need to relax a bit and give things time to settle down and for everyone to come around to talking and sorting this out.

Stay out of it OP you can't fix this.

You've received a lot of good advice - I would add that even though you grew up in the same family different members have there own experiences and relationships with that family. There's a bigger backstory than you are currently seeing. Your mum is already turning on the emotional blackmail instead of giving them space.