Highest percentage of women unmarried and childless by 2030

[Nelly10]

I read recently the way society is going by 2030 they’ll nearly half unmarried and childless women between 25-44.

Apparently this is already a thing in china a lot of women are going it alone solo parenting.

I have my opinions on why, just wondered what anyone else’s thoughts were ?

Maybe time to get off your computer and get out into the real world.....??

I think it’s fine if women chose to be single and child free, why shouldn’t we?

But, I disagree that solo parenting is a better option for the child(ren). Ideally, children need more than one involved adult in their lives, as every adult has different strengths and weakness. Of course, if a parent makes zero effort, that’s a moot point.

@HamBone other involved adults can be aunts, uncles, grandparents, and family friends. Some separated parents can co parent amicably.

I’m ummarried and childless so shrug

Reality check

1- A lot if younger people do not want children - Men and women. Climate change and economic instability are both part of the ‘bit worries’. That’s a really big shift vs previous generations.

2- unmarried doesn’t mean single. But it does mean women do not want to be untangled financially with men/their partner. Not the way you are when married. And Wo children, the safety that marriage gives women doesn’t have the same meaning (aka atm I wouldn’t advise fir a woman to have dcs if they are not married - bit married fir the same of it? Nope)

3- the whole society has been telling women they needed to be financially independent, that they are a burden if they aren’t etc… it has also very much devalued the work done (traditionally) by women around the house. Is there really a surprise when women then act as if looking after dc/home isn’t worthy and they want to preserve their independence at all cost?

Sorry I didn’t realise it wasn’t aimed at me 🙈.

My mum had my brother at 18 been with my dad ever since so that’s only a generation up from me.

A have a few friends single no kids I don’t blame them one bit!

@Hubblebubble Yes, I did mean other involved adults, not just the parents.

What I was trying to say is that as parents we need to recognize that we can’t be “everything” to our child and they will need support from other adults-because none of us are perfect!

@HamBone thé issue is that, even when men are ‘good involved fathers’, they rarely actually take 50% of the mental load + organisation/work/parenting involved in raising a kid.
I can see why a woman would rather do it all on her own, because that’s what would have happened anyway (or close to), and not have to deal with the disagreements in parenting, pulling their weight etc… that you get with having a father around.

As you've pointed out the change in marriage (at all), age at first marriage, and age at first child has changed for both men and women over decades now; that's why it's ridiculous for a 2023 author to get citing women not being married or having kids at 25 as something noteworthy.

Even the most early settling, committed, traditional ppl of my acquaintances hadn't had their kids at 25.
They were in relationships, occasionally married, but not had kids.

So why even include 25 as the lower end of the range, welcome to the 20th century, let alone the 21st.

Still better than being tied to a useless knuckle dragger, with the expectation you marry into his family, you get lumbered with a whole heap of caring roles, kids, parents, for no money. Who would choose that over their own job, experiences, choices, travel, friends? Perhaps the decent men want ambitious, interesting mums for their kids? It could create a better society.

Either way as a female in this modern age you don't have to get married, you don't have to have children, you don't have to live with someone and be a domestic slave. Which is better than previous times. Much much better

Plus you can as a female use sperm donor so can have a child without a man. Yes men don't like it. But oh boo hoo, there have been centuries of men effectively owning women. They just need a bit more time to adjust to a more balanced society.

In the meantime women can get on planes to pools and cocktails whilst the men can wash their own dirty pants and eat shit microwave meals. I don't really care what they do do you?

Children are perfectly fine raised by one good parent. The home environment is usually calmer, than with two adults. I raised two sons on my own as my husband died young, l didn't want to involve another man in their lives. Women are completely competent at raising healthy, well adjusted children on their own, in my own case having a man around was surplus to requirements.
My sons are really decent, kind, young adults now and say they are glad l never involved anyone else.
I have zero regrets and when they leave home l have no desire to find someone.

Hit the nail on the head here!

it has also very much devalued the work done (traditionally) by women around the house.

yep, housework and childcare are seen as worth nothing, if done by the Mum/woman of the house; they are not valued, their economic value is seen as nothing, they are taken for granted.

I've heard intelligent, highly educated, sahm say that they mow the lawn - and their partner lets them - because they feel they have to do outside work too, because (in spite of doing all the housework, cooking, childcare outside school and life admin for two kids and the parents) they don't bring in any money

It is literally seen as worth nothing, because it does not put a £££ balance in the household bank account.

The minus balance all the work would put in if it had to be paid for is never considered.

@LifeInTheUK I take your point, but my question is whether that’s best for the child?

I know that I’m a great parent in certain areas, for example, giving emotional support, organization, help with language and essays, etc., but DH is much better in other areas.

Neither of us are perfect, but together, we’re a fairly good parenting team. We divide and conquer according to our strengths. We don’t really argue about pulling our weight, tbh.

And when the woman looks to returning to work, their male partners - as standard - say to them "but if it doesn't cover the childcare cost, what's the point/you shouldn't take that job".

Because if a woman is foolish enough to stop work and be a full-time sahm, she then be ones default sole child care provider..... And is not "allowed" to return to work if the money doesn't cover the childcare m.

I've seen men who consider themselves "new," men say this without the slightest second thought.

@PaintYourPrettyPicture Yes, my Mum was raised by a widow and was a wonderful person. But she always missed having her father, that feeling never went away.

I disagree that the home environment is usually calmer with just one adult- that’s not my nor my DH’s experience growing up. We’ve had one big argument 10 years ago that our children heard and it was so unusual that they still mention it occasionally!

I also think that every involved adult brings something to the children. Simply because we all have strengths and weaknesses.🤷

@HamBone what’s best for the child is hard to judge tbh.
Of course, two parents that co parent well is great. No disputing that.

But 50% of marriages end up in divorce.
Of the 50% not divorced, many are unhappy mariages.
So the fact is that many children will end up being raised by one parent (and a Disney parent on the side or a lip service parent etc….).
Fir example, I’m not sure that having to deal with an unreliable father, turning when he feels like it or one that is using the child to have a go at their ex …. is better than being raised by one parent from the word go.

I'm in my 40's and my friendship group is made up of 9 women and we have more than 50% who don't have children (and won't be having children).

4 are married with children

1 living with partner with a child (not his)

1 (me) married with no children

2 living with partner no children

2 single no children

The reasons are:

• Mental health issues caused by childhood trauma which impacted on ability to form stable relationships and/or feel mentally stable enough to have a child and everything that involves

• Not meeting a suitable partner until early 40s and then several failed IVF rounds due to (very) low fertility

• Not meeting a suitable partner at all (so still single in mid-40s...she's a very private person but I suspect this is related to an avoidant attachment style due to a childhood bereavement although saying that her siblings all have partners)

• The ones who are living with partners but aren't married are all financially independent (and actually the higher earners in most cases who outright own the house they live in) aren't married because it doesn't make any financial sense, their partners didn't bring as much to the table financially and they don't have a child with them so better to stay unmarried

I take your point @GilbertMarkham

But female fertility being time limited surely it must be noted as a significant factor that so many women are no longer having children during what used to be the prime child bearing years of their 20s.

Women are adult and fertile for perhaps 20 years. It is a huge factor that a decade and a half of that fertility passes by before most women try for a baby, if at all.

What we do here and now shouldn't dictate the terms of the study.

I do believe that most women want a partner however I believe that we have higher expectations of men now - in a completely reasonable way and men are frankly, often unattractive.

When I was dating in my 30's I knew lots of women who were single and a 'good catch' but a significant proportion of the single men I met had

• Glaring personality issues and red flags for controlling and abusive behaviour

• Were sex pests

• Were completely self-absorbed and/or entitled and/or just wanted a woman who looked good and would trail around after them putting the man first above themselves and anything else in their lives

Frankly, with feminism women do much more - we've grown to take on work and the financial sphere and DIY as well as all the shit we were already expected to do

Many men (not all) haven't equally risen to the occasion, but neither have they realised this and so still act like entitled idiots that think a woman should be waiting at the door with a G&T when they get home and a medal for them doing the dishes once a week.

Sorry, not good enough to secure a woman with a good level of self-esteem and standards.

@LifeInTheUK I think what I find annoying is when ppl assume that one parent (typically the Dad) is somehow dispensable. Doesn’t that set really low standards for men? I don’t want my DS to assume that being an unreliable Dad is the norm, for example.

Just because a relationship fails didn’t mean that the Dad is hopeless. I know many RL examples of great coparenting after a relationship ends. Also some examples of terrible coparenting, of course.

Sorry I missed out a reason for no children

In my case I'm the breadwinner by a significant amount (I earn 3-4 times what DH earns).

I love DH but he's pretty crap around the house, knows less than zero about children and doesn't show any willingness to learn anything about them. By his own admission he doesn't have much common sense and wouldn't enjoy being a SAHP.

That being the case it just added more to the 'cons' list with the insane price of childcare, me doing a 'big job' and so actually seeing very little of any child Mon-Friday, etc.

On top of my precarious mental health / ADHD just too many things stacked up in the 'probably not the best idea for us' column.

I'm childless and unmarried in my 30s. I've been with my partner for years and we'll get around to marrying at some point but children are off the table. It's too expensive and (because the internet is anonymous) I'll admit that I worry that we'd end up with an asshole of a child. We have a niece on each side and they're both lovely and have been easy going from day 1. What are the chances of that happening for a third time??

@HamBone , I personally don’t feel fathers are disposable. I think there are essential to children.
However too many of them think they’re not essential and refuse to take on that responsibility 🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️ Id love them to do so tbh.

I agrée @wheresmymojo .
I suspect women are more difficult. I’m not sure it’s a bad thing either.

You can’t at the same time ask women to be as independent (financially etc…) as men AND expect them to carry on shouldering all the burden of home and kids. Women have stepped up to those changes. (A lot if) Men haven’t and still expect to be waited on.