Narcissistic traits and emorional abuse

[Gingercherry]

I have realised that DH has over the years been emotionally abusive to me. It is a cycle - he can be nice for a while, then something triggers his anxiety and stress and he will take it out on me (passive aggressiveness, moody, cold, shouting etc).

For the last few months I have kept my distance from him. I am pleasant to him, but do not ask him for any support in any way, nor do I try to get close emotionally or physically. I keep the conversations superficial. We have dc so I'm trying to maintain a pleasant atmosphere at home. The irony is that when I am like this, I notice its almost like he seems to respect me and is nice to me. When I have in the past tried to get close to him, being kind, caring, physically and emotionally close, it's almost like he sees that as a green light to then use me as his emotional punch bag.

I used to get hooked in when he was nice to me, then would be devastated when he started to take out his stress on me. I'm not going to get hooked in again.

I've only just realised this pattern - does anyone recognise it, is it narcissism? I am actually planning to separate from DH mainly because of this behaviour, but just trying to understand - I am still processing everything about our relationship.

I've
only just realised this pattern - does anyone recognise it, is it
narcissism? I am actually planning to separate from DH mainly because of
this behaviour, but just trying to understand - I am still processing
everything about our relationship.

He may pip you to the post, men like this tend to shit on you whilst you're in the process of understanding their abuse.

Yes, it is & it is emotional abuse as well. If I were you, I would carry on playing the game, but in the background, I would start making plans to leave in the near future. Start building up a stash of money in your own bank account, look at rental prices & work out what you can afford, do some digging & get copies of payslips, bank statements, pension statements etc. Gather any documents like birth certificates, driving licence, passports etc & put them somewhere only you know. Ring a solicitor & ask for an appointment with a family law specialist, you may get a free 30 minute appointment, if you take all the financial stuff they may be able to tell you where you stand.

@Nat6999 Thank you for the helpful advice.

I am just shocked at how obvious his behaviour is now. Why would he be nice to me when I am detached from him, but horrible to me when I am close to him? It's so strange.

Last night I was in my room trying to get a big spider out. DH came in and helped me (I hadn't asked him to) and then wanted to give me a hug. It's so confusing as the odd time he is kind and helpful it seems genuine. But then he can so easily turn and be angry or passive aggressive over nothing.

..agree...or they hoover you in with love bombing, discard, love bomb, discard, rinse and repeat

It sounds like he is struggling with something but instead of tackling it he takes it out on you. I think you need to have a conversation about this, and make it very clear that this cannot continue. It could be something as “simple” as depression (you are mentioning anxiety in your op), but that does not mean that you have to bear the brunt of it.

If it is that, be wary of them finding out that you have figured it out as they can turn worse or discard.

I know in my case between the better side of the cycle, everything was wrong and it was my fault. Never took criticism, fault or responsibility for own actions, were right and justified in everything they did but were nasty and critical of everything I did.

@N3philim we have had marriage counselling twice, and both had individual counselling. Nothing helps this cycle. I've been with him for 20 years and he has struggled with his mental health for the whole time. That in a way is part of what kept me in the relationship - I kept thinking that his behaviour was due to his mental health issues so he couldn't help it. I have felt sorry for him for the entirety of our relationship, as he always seemed like he was struggling somehow.

That's why I'm trying to get my head around what his behaviour actually is - are the cycles of gaslighting/anger etc followed by being nice due to his mental health or narcissism? Is he aware of how he is or are these behaviours unconscious? I have pointed it out to him so many times, but it still doesn't seem to sink in.

I don't know really why I'm trying to understand all this, I think sometimes mental clarity helps with moving on, and I have felt so confused for so many years. I know I am definitely leaving anyway.

@Catsafterme yes that behaviour sounds very familiar. DH never takes responsibility for his actions or apologises.

Gingercherry

re your comments in quote marks

"That's why I'm trying to get my head around what his behaviour actually is - are the cycles of gaslighting/anger etc followed by being nice due to his mental health or narcissism? Is he aware of how he is or are these behaviours unconscious? I have pointed it out to him so many times, but it still doesn't seem to sink in".

What you're describing here is the nice and nasty cycle of abuse which is a continuous one. What did you learn about relationships when you were growing up?. Abuse is not a relationship issue (abuse is about power and control) and its something that he learnt in childhood. What exactly if anything do you know about his family background; chances are one or even both of his parents behave similarly. Your H feels entitled to act as he does towards you and feels he has done nothing wrong.

"we have had marriage counselling twice, and both had individual counselling. Nothing helps this cycle".

And nothing will change, at least for you, until you get off the merry go around.

Such counselling was never going to have any effect on him because he is at heart abusive. Abusive people never apologise nor accept any responsibility for their actions. Continue with your plans to leave and get legal advice on the quiet, this is also no relationship role model to be showing the kids either.

@Gingercherry Yes same here, not one apology, even for things that were very bad or proven. There was either always an excuse or reason, or just brushed over and never spoke about.

Silent treatment was also a favourite tool of mine.

Mine wouldn't get counselling as nothing was wrong with them. Other third parties that did get involved for other issues, a narrative was spun in order for them to gain sympathy and become a victim, and therefore not change.

I've come to learn you cannot reason with the unreasonable. It is, in my case, bordering insanity and I thought had mental health issues but now with what is going on and the lengths they are going to, I think it's a personality disorder.

@Gingercherry
I am familiar with the hot/ cold game amongst other tactics to control partners, but in this case I am not sure what he would be trying to achieve here by keeping you unhappy for no reason.
The behaviour is unacceptable though. Have you ever told him that you are unable to continue the relationship if he is unwilling to make any changes?

It's a bit like training a dog, we call them and pat our legs when we want them to come over so we can give them a stroke or a love and then say right that's enough on your way I'm busy.

You are trained to always be available when they need love, and are rewarded by being quiet and not demanding love and attention when they don't want to give it to you.

They love you in an ownership way, your feelings do not matter, they only matter if they start affecting you and you cannot function and are no longer useful to them.

With this in mind they are easily capable of discarding someone without remorse or care, they just switch off, no pain, no empathy, all narcs have this in common.

You have to run around after them like a loyal dog, when they want you to stop doing that it often means they have found a new dog to follow them and they need you to back off and remain quiet in your box.

Here have a buiscuit, good dog, thanks for not bothering me.

I've experienced all this behaviour and noticed that you have to modify your behaviour in order to keep things calm and pleasant and it's not how it should be of course. What helped me [and may help you gain some clarity] was reading about 'covert narcissistic males/females' on YouTube by Lise LeBlanc in particular.

All the pieces fell into place. It helps to understand what is going on, so just a suggestion of mine in case it helps. Comments from other 'survivors' are also very interesting. I got out and am still processing and healing, it's going to take some time.

For me, it was useful to recognise that I was never, ever going to understand the abusive/narcissistic mindset. I wrangled with it for ages, and the moment I said 'Sod this, it's just lunacy!' I was able to start moving on.

This isn't about your ability to understand him. It's about you recognising that his behaviour will only make sense to someone like him, and you are not like him. Nor would you want to be, I suspect.

Thanks for all the replies, it all resonates. @Watchkeys yes recognising the behaviour is just lunacy is essential I think!

I just had another crazy interaction with DH - I asked him when dinner was going to be and he looked really angry with me and rolled his eyes behind my back (I guess maybe because in his mind I was daring to question him?). I told him I'd seen him rolling his eyes, then he started to make excuses and say he only did it as he thought I was in a mood with him (I wasn't), then saying he was hurt because he thought I wasn't looking into his eyes when i spoke to him. The whole thing is just insane - I genuinely think he always believes that he is the injured party in all this! Its like whenever he has done something that he should apologise for he always turns it on me.

I used to keep apologising when we had these mad interactions as he seemed so sure that he was the one who was hurt. Now I just stay neutral and I think it's confusing him.

There is no rhyme nor reason to these people and when you notice the patterns it's insanity. There is zero logic, not that of a rational person and it doesn't matter what occurs there's a way out of it, somehow.

It took me until I was away to put the pieces together and notice more. What I found is they don't process conversations the same, even messages. You can say something to them or reply to them, and they hear something else entirely.

I've just had something like this occur from something that happened a while ago used against me. They have focused and cherry picked on part of a conversation and turned it into something it's not and once I pointed that out...it was like, yeah that makes no sense.

They say things and do things rational people wouldn't do. They are so sure of themselves what they say doesn't come across ridiculous or far fetched to them, but any normal person would think...mmm they gonna think I'm nuts.

I'm in a similar relationship. A counsellor recommended the book "The Wizard of Oz & Other Narcissists" which has some insightful points.