Transactional friendships

[Rumbletumbly]

I recently started going through a divorce and my mental health is all over the place. I've reached out to friends for support at times (although some have been better than others) but I'm generally quite an independent, self reliant person as I've had to be most of my life.

A couple of my friends don't seem to want to support me without the expectation that I support them back. I seem to have become the "marriage problems expert" to some and they are coming to me with their marriage troubles as if I'm now experienced in handling them because I'm divorcing. One friend will chat to me and listen, but I can guarantee that within a day she's sending me long essays about her husband leaving things lying around, being lazy and not helping with the kids. Sometimes there are several long messages at once and I feel guilty to not support her back when she's supported me but I don't have the energy or mental space for it.

It's as if she sees it as "her turn" for a rant about her husband, but I'm going through a living nightmare right now, missing my kids 50% of the week, struggling to juggle everything and I feel I can't support her back.

Should I be supporting her in return? Should our friendship be transactional like this?

It's like she doesn't quite "get" the severity of my situation somehow in comparison. I do understand how horrendous it is living with a crap, lazy husband as I've been there, but right now, this is worse and I just feel frustrated that she can't see that.

Sorry to hear that you're going through a tough time OP. I do think there's a transactional element to most friendships, and it's quite natural for her to think "you have a moan and I'll comfort you, then I'll have a moan", but I also understand that when things are really hard you don't have much headspace for other people's problems. Are you having counselling? Maybe it would help to talk to a neutral person?

I don’t think it’s ‘transactional’ to understand that the other person still has their own troubles, even if you think yours is objectively greater, and deserves the ‘limelight’.

Yes I'm having counselling, had to have time off work and recently returned, on antidepressants etc.

This isn't about deserving the "limelight" @GlassWall I think that's obvious.

That's how friendships work, it can't be all one sided.
Maybe a therapist would be best for you.

Well, your posts suggest you think the support should run one way only at the moment, and that your friend talking about her own issues is ‘transactional’ because it requires you to be sympathetic to her.

I’m merely pointing out that her issues will continue to loom large for her, whatever is going on in your life. Have you actually said to her ‘Look, X, I’m really struggling at the moment. I can’t reply to long messages about Dave being untidy’?

I understand what you mean OP. I think in life, a mutual moan is completely normal but there are certain scenarios where as a friend, you accept that your role is to listen and support...I'm thinking death, divorce, critical illness etc. In those scenarios I would definitely think that my problems can wait, I need to be in friend mode right now.

I think you need to spell it out to her. Fwiw, yanbu to suppose that at this stage, she could have worked it out for herself, with the expectation that in the fullness of time, your friendship would go back to being more equal.

I get what you mean. I don't think there would be anything wrong with not responding to some of the messages if you don't have the capacity.

Whilst it is a pain in the arse having a lazy husband it's also her responsibility to whinge at him, not you. I have had friends like this and it's possible once you get stronger you may not see them for dust anyway. Often the healthier we get (mentally) the more our social structures change which can be upsetting but, eventually, liberating.

Good on you for not putting up with a crap marriage, I'm sorry it's a painful time. It will get better. If you can manage without the antidepressants that would be better, they are nasty little buggers. But totally get it if you can't do without.

Refer her to Mumsnet! She'll find lots off support here.

I think you're being unreasonable. Your friend supported you and she needs support, too. It's not transactional it's friendship.
If you want someone who can support you like a one way street, that's your therapist.
Just because you think your problems are greater it doesn't mean that they aren't suffering or going through a lot. It's not a competition and people have different thresholds to how much they can take, and there might be other things they haven't told you about which might make them actually more vulnerable or suffering than you but you just don't know.
Life is not all neat, support friend A for 6 months and then friend B needs support for the next 6 months. Sometimes they both need support at the same time.
And if you are divorcing while she is still stuck in a marriage, you are in a way more expert than her because you're going through this experience. I think you're directing your frustration at the wrong person.

YABU

Even at the lowest points in my life when I had PTSD I still had time for my friends.

It was good for me, it helped to remind me that I wasn't the centre of the universe. I think therapy can make us feel like we are, sometimes.

I have a friend who divorced in 2015 who still acts like you, by the way. Everyone has to initiate everything with her and she constantly leaves people in read etc because her problems are greater than everyone else's.

Don't be that person.

I think it's reciprocal not transactional. All friendships are. If it too much you need to tell her and step back for a bit. But it can't be all take or she won't be getting anything from the friendship

I’ve been through a crap 9 months culminating in the death of my DF. At the start I realised that I just didn’t have capacity to deal with friends moaning, so I basically stepped right back from them - missing out on their support but also on needing to give support in return. I explained what I was doing. It all seems to have worked out. I’m back in the groups, mutual low level support.
i guess I learnt years ago that when the shit hits the fan, I deal with it best on my own with just my dog for support.

Agree. If OP has a lot on she needs to step back from these friends also to gather herself. I think if you are finding all your friends like this though.. it could be OP.

Whilst friendship is a two-way deal and you should also support your friends, I think this particular friend does sound like she lacks a bit of empathy.

I think the issue isn't about friendship generally, but about this specific person not understanding what you're going through/ how to support you. Some people make better friends than others in these situations. You need a more empathetic friend.

I'll always try to be there for my friends regardless of what I've got going on, and try to remember that even if I am going through something that is, objectively, harder than what they're handling, their problems still feel huge to them (whatever I'm dealing with might seem minor to another person, too - doesn't mean I'm not struggling though!)

Saying that...there are times when people need to think about whether they're being sensitive when asking for support. For example, it'd be insensitive of me to complain at length about my mild IBS to a friend who was just diagnosed with bowel cancer. It's also sometimes worth remembering that just because somebody has gone through a similar difficult experience, it doesn't always mean they're able to cope with supporting someone else through it - sometimes people would prefer to not bring up painful memories if doing so could affect their mental health.

It sounds like you're happy to support your friend most of the time, but on this subject you're not the right person for her to reach out to right now - and that's totally fine. She's being a little tone deaf in choosing to complain to you about her relationship when she knows you're going through something that, while vaguely similar in as far as it's relationship based, is a lot more difficult to deal with.

Hope you're doing okay OP, this sounds like an incredibly stressful time for you

I’m wondering if the friend is thinking that it’s a solidarity thing, to let you to know about the ‘shit’ going in her relationship, too? If she’s talking about laziness, untidiness etc., it could be me, when I get together with groups of friends who start moaning about their husbands’
shortcomings, and I feel almost forced into sharing anecdotes of minor domestic incompetence (which are true, but I’m sure could be replicated for me!) I feel really guilty when I do this, as dh does more than his fair share of domestic stuff willingly and efficiently, but I don’t say that or everyone else would be !

Maybe it's because for the first time you've "let them in"? If you've always been an independent, self reliant person they move never felt able to approach you with their problems, but now that you've opened up about your own problems you've shown you're someone who is willing to talk about personal things. So rather than being transactional it's actually become a deeper friendship. Or they think it has.

Ask yourself why you're friends have never previously talked about their problems with you, clearly they have wanted to talk to someone.

FWIW I have been there for her at numerous points in the past- bereavement, bullying at work etc. I just needed her to be there for me. That's all.

To the poster who is annoyed at her friend for still expecting everyone to be there for her after divorcing in 2015, my situation is hardly comparable seeing as I'm only 3 months in 🤔.

I would always be there for her, but the long essays daily about her husband not pulling his weight is absolutely draining me and I feel that actually, if friendships are reciprocal, she should just be there for me in a supportive way as I've been for her.

"I have a friend who divorced in 2015 who still acts like you, by the way. Everyone has to initiate everything with her and she constantly leaves people in read etc because her problems are greater than everyone else's.

Don't be that person."

@wildworldtumes yep... this is the post. My divorce is 3 months in.
"Don't be that person" not really possible yet. But thanks.

Hmm. There is a bit of a tone from some of "Woman, be kind. Listen to your friend wittering on about husband's messy ways, even though you don't have the bandwidth for it currently".

@Rumbletumbly you will not always feel this way, although it feels unlikely at the time. This too shall pass. At this stage I only had bandwidth for basic interest in friends, and would have found more 'spoons' for an emergency. This is not an emergency, and presumably the balance will shift again in time. Nowt wrong with saying you are struggling and can't cope with extra stuff.

Carry on with that mindset and you're well on the way.

Just reply "sorry to hear it, that sucks" to her long essays. It's not hard.

I agree with those who say that if you want unreserved support and not to be giving support back then you need a counsellor or therapist not a friend.