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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

How long to put up with 'meh'?

24 replies

TheNamesTheThing · 26/04/2023 04:45

Apologies in advance, this is going to be a long one. I also want to note before getting started that the way I describe things here is not how I would talk to DH, but I don't see the point in beating around the bush here. I am autistic and can come across blunt, but IRL I try to mask this.

Some background: DH and I have been together for 6 years, married for 3. We have an 18 month old. We met when we were mid to late 20s (he is a few years younger than I am) and are now early to mid 30s. We come from very different backgrounds: I grew up thoroughly middle class and am highly (some might say over-) educated. My DM was the breadwinner, but parents split up when I was young. He grew up in a different country, in quite a conservative and traditional community where people get married and start a family straight out of high school, women do all the childcare and housework, etc. He followed this path for a few years, but got divorced quite young and distanced himself from his community before I met him. He was pretty LC with his family when I met him.

The crux of the issue is this: I am not sure I am really in love with him, and don't know how long I can or should put up with what I can best describe as a mediocre relationship.

Before the birth of our child, we bumped along ok. There were obviously conflicts, as there are in any relationship, but they didn't seem insurmountable. The differences in our backgrounds sometimes came up, but again it just felt like part of getting to know each other. I will say that I wasn't head over heels in love with him then. However, he was quite different from my usual 'type' and I found him to be much more caring, responsible and, for want of a better word, mature than my previous boyfriends, which were all qualities that I valued in a life partner.

I had a pretty difficult birth, which left me physically affected for a good year afterwards, and I am still dealing with PTSD. Immediately after the birth, DH was supportive, but I would say it was around this time that things started to deteriorate.

In short, it feels like parenthood has made me grow up and made him regress. I now feel like I'm living with a stroppy teenager. He whines whenever he has to do anything around the house, does things half-arsedly, and spends 90% of his time with his headphones in watching a screen. Whenever I ask him to do anything (and why do I have to ask him to do everything??), there's a big argument about whether the thing even needs to be done in the first place. He's lazy about all kinds of small things (putting clothes in the laundry basket, bringing something up or downstairs, taking wet or dirty shoes off at the door), which often leads to more work for me. His personal hygiene has slipped, and he will maybe brush his teeth once a day but often not at all. (I find this particularly disgusting and off-putting.) Whenever he spends time with our child, he's actually just watching a screen and letting the child do his thing - he rarely actually engages with him.

He is convinced that he does at least half if not more of the household tasks and childcare. I estimate that I do 70-80% (plus 95% of the mental load, which he entirely dismisses). Both of us feel resentful that we are doing so much more than the other. We argue a lot about this - most days for sure.

Adding to all of this is that our baby is the world's worst sleeper. We are currently waiting on a medical referral because at 18 months he still wakes hourly. Until 15 months he would only breastsleep (with my nipple in his mouth), so that was me 14-16 hours a day. We worked very hard to get to a point where my husband could cuddle him to sleep, but he still wakes all the time and my husband won't put up with it for a whole night. To date I have had one unbroken night of sleep in his entire 18 months of life. It is undeniably me bearing the brunt of this situation, but it obviously affects my husband too. It also affects us as a couple - we have literally zero adult time, as one of us has to be with him when he's asleep or he wakes up. And thank you, but I don't need sleep tips as I have tried literally everything.

In my previous relationships, I've always felt like my partner was out of my league, which prompted me to try to do better - eat healthier, be more active, take in more culture, read more, whatever. In general, I guess I'm oriented towards self-improvement - I think it's important to do my best at the things I do, and spend a lot of time thinking about how to make my life better and perform better in my life. In this relationship, however, I now feel like my DH is holding me back, and that any improvements in our situation happen despite him not because of him. I would never say this out loud, but he does feel like a dead weight. He has very high self confidence and generally thinks he is very good at things without having had any training or done any research, and is very resistant to advice or tips (from me or from anyone else, but especially from me). He is objectively not as good at these things as he thinks he is.

I am not perfect and he does have his good spots. I have quite high standards and can be a rigid thinker (autism) so can be a bit of a nag. When he's in the right mood, he can work very hard and is actually a much better housekeeper than I am when he does it.

But. There have been two occasions recently when I feel he has betrayed me. One involves taking up smoking (which he knows was a dealbreaker for me, having lost loved ones to lung cancer) and keeping it from me, and at the same time adding to my already heavy load because of his sudden mysterious need for multiple hour-long walks a day. The other involves him spending a very large amount of money (several thousand pounds) without telling me on essentially collectibles when money is already very tight and I am denying myself essential things like mental healthcare for my PTSD.

Right now, I feel very 'meh' about our whole situation. I don't hate him and don't think he's a terrible husband or father. At the same time, I don't feel that he's adding a lot to my life beyond the practicalities (paying bills, childcare, some company). I do feel that he's holding me back in some ways. However, I recognize that having a young child is a stress on any relationship, and that our situation is perhaps more difficult than average because of my PTSD and our child's sleep. We are both open to couple's counselling but so far it hasn't worked out.

I want another child, but am not sure I want one with him. However, time is not on my side on this one. I also know I'm not the easiest person to live with. I think I probably did settle when I married him, but I also feel like that's kind of realistic? Like not every marriage is a fairy tale?

So I guess my main questions are: did anyone else feel like this about their partner and have things turn around? Is sticking with someone I feel quite ambivalent about settling or being realistic, especially at my age and stage of life? Would it really be easier to go it alone, or should I try and see the value in what I do get from the relationship?

OP posts:
TheNamesTheThing · 26/04/2023 04:46

Sorry this is so long - didn't want to drip feed. It's also not particularly well organized. I am happy to answer any questions or clarify where needed. Thank you if you managed to get through all of it!

OP posts:
Zippedydoo123 · 26/04/2023 04:57

I think it all depends on whether you can afford to live as a single parent. It will cost a lot more to live then. Do your sums carefully and weigh it all up. In addition many fathers bec ome totally absent fathers plus refuse to pay any maintenance. The CMS are rubbish so weigh up also if you could emotionally cope with this.n

Things may improve again once the baby is older and sleeps through. Fathers can become more hands on sl owly.

Humanswarm · 26/04/2023 07:33

There's a lot of stress on your relationship right now. With a lo of 18 months who doesn't sleep..that would add immense strain on even the most fantastic relationship. I'd hazard a guess that you're both exhausted, physically and mentally. Intimacy is affected when children are little, and it would seem more so on your case, due to Co sleeping up until a few months ago.
You say there are lots you value about your dh. And I think, we lose sight of those things when the going gets tough.
It won't always be like this, and when your lo's sleep is sorted, you may well see a shift in your relationship.
No one knows if you'd be happier single. But that brings a whole host of new issues and things to navigate.
Possibly a trial separation may help to see things more clearly..but my advice right now, would be to persevere a little longer...

AdamRyan · 26/04/2023 07:43

It sounds like both of you are pretty unhappy. Your bluntness may be wearing him down, his slovenly ways are certainly wearing you down
Maybe some counselling could help you? Or ask him - say "you seem unhappy, I'm not feeling happy either, what do you think we can do?"

Heroicallyfound · 26/04/2023 07:49

I would prioritise the therapy for you (I always say that! It’s so life changing) - because I think you’ve labelled and made sense of a lot of your problems in a way that I don’t think is catalysing any movement in a good direction for you.

I think when you have a little one, especially with sleep problems, it’s not a great time to make any big relationship decisions. Unless you’re really really unhappy. I would park the thoughts about another baby for 6 months - are you going to want to get pregnant again right now anyway with the sleep issues? It’s just heaping pressure on yourself to worry too much about that right now I think.

In short, it feels like parenthood has made me grow up and made him regress.

This seems to be a common pattern in dysfunctional relationships… my H was the same and ended up making an extreme exit from our relationship when our child was 2. It seems to me that when a baby is born, the woman’s focus naturally shifts from the man to the baby, and if a man has been codependent on the woman this can be internally scary for him - he’s lost his ‘mum’. Do you think that’s true if your relationship and you maybe were too entwined with each other?

Reality25 · 26/04/2023 08:27

Being blunt:

Why get married if it means nothing to you?

Life is never a bed of roses. You should work on improving your marriage and relationship if you are unhappy, not just looking for an exit.

Malarandras · 26/04/2023 08:34

Do you love him? If you do work on it. If you don’t, leave. I was in a very similar situation and I realised I didn’t love him anymore, so I decided to leave. Didn’t actually get the chance to - he died before I could - but that’s another story.

helpmyskinplease · 26/04/2023 09:02

Malarandras · 26/04/2023 08:34

Do you love him? If you do work on it. If you don’t, leave. I was in a very similar situation and I realised I didn’t love him anymore, so I decided to leave. Didn’t actually get the chance to - he died before I could - but that’s another story.

I think this is the crux of it. You haven't mentioned love. Do you love him?

Isheabastard · 26/04/2023 09:02

When you say you are both open to couples counselling but it hasn’t worked out, do you mean you saw a counsellor but it didn’t help, or that you haven’t found one yet?

If you did see one, what was it that went wrong?

TheNamesTheThing · 27/04/2023 01:15

@Zippedydoo123 Yes, this was my first thought. Realistically I don't think I could swing it. Not sure this is a great reason to stay though :/

OP posts:
TheNamesTheThing · 27/04/2023 01:18

@Humanswarm We haven't tried a trial separation, but he has gone on a few long (several weeks) trips without us over the last year or so. In some ways it has been very very hard being with baby 24/7 (especially given the sleep situation). We don't have a lot of support nearby and it was very isolated and relentless. However, it was glorious not having to pick up anyone else's balled up dirty socks, come down to a clean kitchen in the morning, no constant bickering, etc.

I appreciate your comments though, and this is more or less where I am at the moment. Would be interested to hear from people who did find their relationship improved after the early years of parenthood! I'm worried I'm building up so much resentment I won't be able to let it go, or to forget how he's treated me/us during this time.

OP posts:
TheNamesTheThing · 27/04/2023 01:23

@Heroicallyfound Yes, I think right now is not the right time, but I worry if we don't start trying in the next year it will be too late.

I don't know about codependency, but he has made comments about having to 'share' me now. Is this something you think can be overcome?

OP posts:
TheNamesTheThing · 27/04/2023 01:32

@Reality25 I wouldn't say he meant nothing to me. I didn't feel a burning passion for him, but when we got married he seemed like a man I could comfortably and happily spend the rest of my life with. I guess that seemed satisfactory? I don't think I could comfortably or happily spend the rest of my life living as we are now though.

As for improving things, that is very much what I am trying to do. I am finding it difficult though.

One, because I generally find it very difficult to put aside what I perceive as being 'right' for the sake of peace (I am a black-and-white thinker; this is a 'me' problem).

And two, because he is very hung up on blame and thinks anything less than the ideal scenario is not worthwhile. For example, I will think 'This is the (bad) situation we are in. What can we do now to improve things, even a little bit?' while he will think 'We are only in this bad situation because of something that TheNamesTheThing/DM/DFriend/whoever did. It is now their job to fix the bad situation so that things are perfect. It is not my fault so I shouldn't have to put myself out to contribute to a solution.'

Obviously, I can do my best to improve the way I think about things, but the way he thinks about things is beyond my control. I don't see how things can improve without his buy-in, and I don't feel like I'm getting that. So I guess to the extent that I am looking for an exit, it's because I don't see the point in staying in a situation I don't like with a slim chance of change. But part of what I'm asking is how slim is the chance of change here, iyswim.

OP posts:
TheNamesTheThing · 27/04/2023 01:38

@Malarandras and @helpmyskinplease To be frank, I'm not sure. I am very, very frustrated with him in the last 1.5 years. I have trouble thinking charitably towards him. But I do feel that if he started pulling his weight there would be what to love about him. But I agree that this is the crux.

This is a very, very difficult thing to admit, but I'm not sure I know what it feels like to really love someone. A lot of descriptions of love I have encountered don't really resonate with me about any of the relationships in my life. I think I just feel love on a more muted wavelength than a lot of other people?

OP posts:
TheNamesTheThing · 27/04/2023 01:43

@Isheabastard We saw one for a few sessions, and really didn't hit it off with her. We spent a lot of money (although a fraction of the money I have since learned he has spaffed on collectibles!) and felt like she wasn't really listening to either of us and was spending a lot of time (=money) focusing on issues/events that were really quite peripheral.

It was me that found her originally. I spent a fair amount of time looking through profiles etc, only for DH to reject her based on her picture alone. We did go to the sessions with her, but now I'm just too tired of it all to go through all the research again just to have my suggestion rejected out of hand. We are on several waiting lists for counselling through community organizations though, so we may see another one in the next 6-ish months.

I think I would be naive to expect him to find one on his own.

OP posts:
OhcantthInkofaname · 27/04/2023 01:46

If you are essentially doing it all as a couple doing it alone might be better. He does sound like a teenager.

Heroicallyfound · 27/04/2023 07:17

I don't know about codependency, but he has made comments about having to 'share' me now. Is this something you think can be overcome?

It’s a challenge I think but not impossible?? I’ve never done it but I’ve seen others try it. Sounds like he’s jealous of your child if he feels he needs to share you? So probably angry underneath that. It’s essentially a grieving process - he’s lost the old you he used to rely on. Motherhood has forced you into a new stage of life, new stage of growing up, which places him at a crossroads - he’s having to face that he has to grow up too. Either he grieves the loss and takes up the challenge and grows, or he resists that change and gets stuck. It sounds like your relationship has to change from you being a mothering figure to him into you being a wife figure.

Sounds like he’s stuck at the moment. I’d be thinking about - how much does he value you? Does he have a growth mindset? Is he willing to travel through grief and see what on the other side? Is he interested in finding a new dynamic with you? Can you hold each other - be patient/compassionate with each other -through the transition? Do you want to? All the things you’re pondering. Have an honest conversation with him about it all.

Esther Perel is good on relationships. There’s a ‘three loves theory’ that we fall in love three times during life and I think it’s her (might be wrong) who says if we’re lucky it’ll be with the same person. But it takes work changing/growing with that person.

https://www.estherperel.com/blog/transitioning-between-stages-of-a-relationship-practice-adaptability

From Esther Perel's Blog - When Transitioning Between Stages of a Relationship, Practice Adaptability

Adaptability in couples is about responding to life’s changing circumstances with good communication and a lot of flexibility. Read more about why adaptability is an important element in helping couples navigate the different stages of a relationship.

https://www.estherperel.com/blog/transitioning-between-stages-of-a-relationship-practice-adaptability

Tiredmummaoftwo · 27/04/2023 11:02

You're in the thick of it right now with the lack of sleep. I wouldn't make any major decisions at the moment as you may feel differently when you're getting some sleep. My advice would be to sort that out first - get some professional sleep advice.

Once that's sorted I would personally suggest having a bloody good go at working on your marriage as the grass really isn't greener sometimes. We all deal with different shit and the boring routine of life gets frustrating for everyone. I don't think being a single mum with a small human to look after won't be easy either.

I think once you've exhausted every option, and you still don't feel happy with him then I'd leave. Definitely don't have another child. Two is NOT going to help right now.

Tiredmummaoftwo · 27/04/2023 11:09

Oh and my experience of staying in an unhappy relationship where we ignored the problems for a long time lead to cheating. Neither of us were being fulfilled so we both (him first, then me) looked for that in someone else.

I certainly would not recommend letting it get to that point. Was a bloody nightmare to deal with and peoples feelings got hurt.

billy1966 · 27/04/2023 12:58

OP,

Forget about another child with him.

Your relationship is unlikely to last.

Protect your finances now that you know he is so selfish.

In your place I would look at leaving long term, so start to organise yourself as best you can.

Someone who would waste thousands of money when you are denying yourself healthcare, is not someone to depend on.

Reach outbto family and friends for support.

I really hope the sleep issue resolve itself.

Lack of sleep is so hard.

Mabelface · 27/04/2023 13:08

Sounds like your life would be easier without him. Working at a relationship takes two, and he's not doing any of it, it's all on your shoulders to "fix". Can you be arsed with this for many more years, or would you be better without him? If he's not willing to put the work in, the only thing you'll end up feeding towards him is resentment. Not a healthy way to live.

Affectiondodger · 29/04/2023 20:43

OP, parts of your post could have been written by me!!! I’m in a similar (ish) situation. I’m really sorry you’re feeling so conflicted at the moment! I haven’t really got any advice, sorry, but if you want to chat please feel free to message me (is that a thing on here? I’ve just joined so don’t really know how to use it

pfftt · 30/04/2023 08:10

Reality25 · 26/04/2023 08:27

Being blunt:

Why get married if it means nothing to you?

Life is never a bed of roses. You should work on improving your marriage and relationship if you are unhappy, not just looking for an exit.

This only works if both parties are committed to improvement. If it's only one person, it's never going to work

Reality25 · 01/05/2023 09:02

pfftt · 30/04/2023 08:10

This only works if both parties are committed to improvement. If it's only one person, it's never going to work

Of course, and if OP's husband came and said he was looking for an exit I'd tell him the same thing.

However it's OP that's doing it.

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