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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Twin Troubles

41 replies

VM22911 · 16/04/2023 23:52

Hoping someone will be able to help.
I have been with my partner for 4 years. I love him deeply and he is 100% the man I want to marry one day.
Just over a year ago we decided that we wanted to live together. The only way to do this was to move into his house as he is tied into a mortgage with his twin brother. They bought a 4 bed house just outside the city 6 months before we met. I never wanted to live there as it's the suburbs, far from all my friends and I didn't drive at the time. The nearest shops are a 15 minute drive away and I felt like I would be losing my independence by moving there. He drives and he and his twin share a car. I also had never lived with a partner before and did not want the first time I did to also be with his twin, in their house. It just wouldn't feel like a space for the two of us. But it became clear if I wanted to take that next step, I would have to move in with them.
For context, my partner, lets call him A, and his twin B. A has done everything with B, for their whole lives. They shared a bedroom until they were 23. They did the same degree at the same university and went into the same jobs. They have all the same friends that they go off on holiday with multiple times a year. They share a car have matching motorcycles and constantly reinforce each other's opinions about everything. I often say they are the twiniest twins to ever twin. This became clear early on and we had to really work on our communication because if ever we argued, he would often compare me to his twin and wonder why we couldn't solve things the way he and his twin would. I am A's first partner and B has never had a girlfriend. They are 29 and I am 26. They come from a very close family where they are 2 of 7 kids.
We moved in and ultimately it was disappointing as everything I feared would happen, happened.
The walls are very thin, we have very little privacy... for anything and I hear everything his brother does. We didn't even assemble our new bed alone. Often we can be cuddled up watching television and his twin will come down to talk to him about something that derails our plans. Even if the twin goes out, my partner goes with him. Regardless of what we're doing. B also used to clean. Until I moved in and now my partner and I are left to do everything. I watch them go out together 3 times a week to play sports with their friends while I sit at home. Which is fine, but then they come home and play video games, often late into the night and I have to go to bed alone. I felt trapped and isolated. I learnt to drive and started trying to save money for my own car. They don't charge me rent so at least it helps me save money. Although, when it comes to decisions about buying things for the house, we discuss it and they always agree and go for the more expensive options, completely disregarding that I don't make as much money as them.
I was absolutely losing my mind when I applied to my dream postgrad course in another city. A is a remote worker and agreed to move with me for a year for the course. I didn't think we would survive if I went alone and it would be too expensive otherwise. Many people on the course who were doing long distance have broken up, because the course is intense.
Just before we leave, I find out from B that they are all going away on holiday a few weeks after we move. I find this out at a family dinner and A says he didn't tell me because he didn't know how serious the plans were, so didn't want to tell me until things were booked.
I was very hurt
I had no idea how I would feel in this new city and he was going to leave me alone. But he told me how sad he would be if everyone but him went and how this was the last holiday he'd have with a friend who was having a baby soon so I let it go and he went.
He came back and even though we both miss our old city and he misses his friends, I am very happy on my course and he has been so supportive. Our communication is better than ever and I don't think our relationship has ever been this strong. It is so nice to have our own space and even he has admitted he prefers it this way. Although he has felt very isolated and bored in the new city.
Then unfortunately, I was attacked outside our apartment. I am okay but the police are involved and now he meets me at the bus stop. I am leaning on him more now and am very scared by myself
He has to go on a stag do next month, and on top of that his twin is planning on going on 2 more holidays and he wants to go too. I feel so unsafe and left behind. We have only been on one holiday together in the time we have been dating whereas him and his twin and their friends have been on multiple. He said if I wasn't studying then I would be invited but I never get asked to be involved in the plans so that feels hard to believe.
I have been struggling with all this while we have come back to visit for Easter break. The house is a mess, his brother keeps interupting our time together and I am just sick of the sight of him all over again. It feels like we have lost all that progress and I feel like I might spend this whole relationship getting left behind.
I dread coming back here when this course is over because it just feels like we're going to go back to how we were and that will make me feel trapped and miserable all over again.
Living here was supposed to be temporary to save money but it feels like there is no end in sight and I have no idea what to do.
I love him so much and want to make this work but have no idea how to tell him how I feel. He is very defensive of his twin and I can't speak to him about these things without him getting defensive and often angry. He shuts down and stonewalls me.
I am so lost and just need some help... some advice... anything

OP posts:
Aquamarine1029 · 18/04/2023 01:33

You just aren't facing reality, op. You're still in denial, thinking this will magically change. It will not. Your boyfriend has a life partner, and it isn't you. His brother will always and forever be in first place.

I have witnessed this exact dynamic with a set of twins who are the children of very close family friends. Your post could be about them, and guess what? They have never changed and they are now in their late 40's, never married, no kids.

Stop wasting your youth on this pointless battle that you will never win.

OnaBegonia · 18/04/2023 01:55

The Disney Adult is the final nope for me.

Guavafish1 · 18/04/2023 07:13

It's not unreasonable but you can't change a person...esp. if he been in a relationship with his twin for 30 years.

You should be able to discuss issues and come up with joint solutions.

Bunce1 · 18/04/2023 07:36

You’re incompatible.

perfectcolourfound · 18/04/2023 07:52

I don't think you have to accept that this is justhow twins are. Most aren't as enmeshed as these two are. It appears to be to an unhealthy degree (for them as well as for you).

However, it is how they are. I would walk away. His brother's opinion matters ore to him. His brother's happiness matters more to him. Socialising with his brother matters more to him. Is there any part of his life where you come first?

Sahlife · 18/04/2023 10:01

Such an unhealthy dynamic. You'll always be in a relationship with both of them and never the priority.

VM22911 · 18/04/2023 10:46

I really do appreciate the advice regardless of how hard it is to hear. These are mostly things I have thought myself and pushed to the back of my mind.
I response to why I love him.
Because he is actually such a patient man and a good listener when he wants to be. He can also be very thoughtful.
He is the kind of guy who will remember some random thing you said you had in your childhood in a late night conversation months ago and then suprise you with it.
He is funny, affectionate and generally has much better morals than those I have dated in the past.
I feel he has done a good job of putting me first while we have been in this new city.
My course is 40 hours a week and I am working 2 jobs part time to help fund it. I am rarely home as a result and always exhausted. He does the dishes, puts the oven on and takes me out to the theatre on the rare nights I have off.
So many people's partners have left them as a result of this course but he has really stuck by my side and I feel our communication has improved so much.
I don't think I can end things now, but I do have a lot to think about when we move back. I may save up some money and get my own place and see what that does to him

OP posts:
TooExtraImmatureCheddar · 18/04/2023 11:07

I’m a twin and daughter of a twin. This situation is weird as fuck. Buying a house together I sort of get, but not the no relationships/no privacy/same course/same employer etc. It is not normal twin behaviour! My twin sister and I are very close and DH and my BIL have struggled with that over the years, because there are multiple daily phone calls and although some things are private, we share a lot too. However, we have separate friend groups in addition to our old school joint one, we did different degrees, we work in different fields etc etc, both married, I have kids etc etc.

I’m really sorry that you were attacked. But your level of dependency isn’t sustainable over time. Your partner can’t always be there - he’s ok to have a life too, and things like going on stag weekends/going away shortly after moving are normal. I don’t think that can be held against him (although his multiple holidays with friends instead of you is odd and needs changing).

I don’t think this is a healthy relationship for either of you, and I think that because he is obviously not putting you first, you are reacting by clinging harder and getting annoyed by minor things. Sack him off! He’s not a prince because he hasn’t dumped you for doing an intensive course, ffs.

Squamata · 18/04/2023 11:09

TBH he sounds like his main passions in life are elsewhere and you're someone he values, but you're not the centre of his world. That could work for some people, but not you I suspect. He's always going to be a bit arm's length.

It's pretty clear what the deal is he's offering, it's for you to decide if you want to take it.

WhereYouLeftIt · 19/04/2023 10:23

VM22911 · 18/04/2023 10:46

I really do appreciate the advice regardless of how hard it is to hear. These are mostly things I have thought myself and pushed to the back of my mind.
I response to why I love him.
Because he is actually such a patient man and a good listener when he wants to be. He can also be very thoughtful.
He is the kind of guy who will remember some random thing you said you had in your childhood in a late night conversation months ago and then suprise you with it.
He is funny, affectionate and generally has much better morals than those I have dated in the past.
I feel he has done a good job of putting me first while we have been in this new city.
My course is 40 hours a week and I am working 2 jobs part time to help fund it. I am rarely home as a result and always exhausted. He does the dishes, puts the oven on and takes me out to the theatre on the rare nights I have off.
So many people's partners have left them as a result of this course but he has really stuck by my side and I feel our communication has improved so much.
I don't think I can end things now, but I do have a lot to think about when we move back. I may save up some money and get my own place and see what that does to him

Thank you for putting into words why you think you love him. Let's take it bit by bit.

"He is funny, affectionate and generally has much better morals than those I have dated in the past."
Interesting that you compare him morally with past boyfriends. Morals, hmm. That's a biggie. But that doesn't make him good, it just make the ex(ex) bad. Decent morals are to be expected as standard, not as a selling point. If you hadn't had a morally deficient boyfriend in the past, would you even notice your current boyfriend's morals? Not really, because as I say, they should be considered as standard. But your past relationships has influenced you to regard this as a plus point, not neutral. Also, I suspect you're defining 'morals' quite narrowly. It's perfectly possible to, say, not be a thief or an adulterer - morally good in those aspects; but to be neglectful and manipulative - morally bad - at the same time.

"Because he is actually such a patient man and a good listener when he wants to be."
'When he wants to be' is the active part of that sentence. And when he doesn't? Is he impatient (which could be manipulative) with you and ignores what you are trying to tell him?

"He can also be very thoughtful. He is the kind of guy who will remember some random thing you said you had in your childhood in a late night conversation months ago and then suprise you with it."
Has he done this often? Or once/twice, and so it sticks in your memory? Does it really overrule all the late night conversations that never happen because he's gaming with his brother into the night and you go to bed alone?

"I feel he has done a good job of putting me first while we have been in this new city."
Has he really had much choice there? The people he normally puts first simply aren't there to compete directly. At best, you can say he puts you first when the people he normally puts first, second and third aren't around.

Here's a thought. He's in a new city without the people who normally surround him. It's quite similar to being on holiday, in a way. You put your normal life on hold and enjoy the sights and experience of this new place. But - normal life is still counted as normal life. The course will finish, and he will see no reason to be in that city any more. He will want to go back 'home'. And pick up where he left off. This is an interlude, a 'holiday' of sorts. What do you feel about going back 'home'?

"So many people's partners have left them as a result of this course but he has really stuck by my side and I feel our communication has improved so much."
This is a bit like the moral comparison with exes. It's sad that other people's relationships end, but it doesn't actually have any bearing on how good or bad YOUR relationship is. Bad relationships can endure if the people in the bad relationship don't remove themselves from it.

"My course is 40 hours a week and I am working 2 jobs part time to help fund it. I am rarely home as a result and always exhausted. He does the dishes, puts the oven on and takes me out to the theatre on the rare nights I have off."
Oh, he does the dishes! Well that's all right the, totally wipes out all the things that are troubling you. Of course you are exhausted. And this can make you grateful for small crumbs. It shifts your perspective. But it's temporary, and 'normal life' will resume.

"I don't think I can end things now, but I do have a lot to think about when we move back. I may save up some money and get my own place and see what that does to him"
Fair enough. You're in the middle of a very intense course, one that I presume would be career-enhancing. It's taking up all your headspace. And with the 'holiday vibe' where he has nobody else, your relationship feels better to you, "stronger". But remember your OP? You'd gone back 'home' for Easter. Prompting you to write "I dread coming back here when this course is over because it just feels like we're going to go back to how we were and that will make me feel trapped and miserable all over again." Did he slip straight back into "how we were"?

So - no "may" about saving up money and getting your own place. Make it happen. Make it your priority. Do not go back to going to the third wheel, the afterthought. You've had a taste of better, don't go back to worse. When your course is over, draw a line. What do you want for the rest of your life? Because if you go back to a 'home' he shares with his brother, that WILL be the rest of your life. 'Dread' is absolutely the right word to use about that, because it would be dreadful. Eternally treading water, going nowhere, living in the same house with someone you are "just sick of the sight of". Absolutely do not do that to yourself. Give him the choice, by all means. A future with you, or an old age with his brother and incel friendship group. Just don't be surprised if he doesn't pick a future. He's enmeshed. You can move on. And I really really think you should.

Skybluepinky · 19/04/2023 11:03

Their bond is too strong, run for the hills.

monsteramunch · 19/04/2023 12:25

Any positive character attribute that needs to be followed by 'when he wants to be' doesn't really count OP. Anyone can be (insert positive thing here) 'when they want to be'.

OhwhyOY · 20/04/2023 08:24

If it's a 4 bed house could they not rent out onw or two of the rooms to fund you guys getting your own place? If it was me I'd give him a chance before giving up and basically say - I can't go back to living how we did before, we need our own space. Why don't we move somewhere near to your brother so you can still see each other easily but in our own place? You could either rent or if it's feasible buy a small second place like a flat together. Like others though I fear you need to ask yourself if you're willing to always put up with him wanting to do stuff with his brother and in essence putting him first, which sadly it sounds like he will. The going on loads of holidays with his brother and friends is not the sign of an adult man ready to consider marriage and children in the future.

VM22911 · 20/04/2023 20:11

Because he now knows what it's like to own a house. He refuses to go back to renting in our old city so we'd have to buy and specifically he wants a house.
Also we can't rent out the rooms before his brother will never be okay with it.

In regards to the earlier question about how often he does those kinds of surprises, it's really very often

OP posts:
Newnamenewname109870 · 20/04/2023 20:18

Oh this is so so hard and I really feel for you. What a nightmare! I echo the others though and this really needs to come to a crux. Ideally the man you love needs to love you the most. He is never going to succeed in any relationship unless he starts putting you on at least equal footing to his twin. He and his brother sound like they still have a lot of growing up to do, jf im honest.
On a more positive note, he is clearly very new to relationships. I say this is positive because he might just need some direction and steering. Talk to him. Honestly, communication is the only way. If he really wants you and really loves you, he will put the effort in to make changes when he knows exactly how you feel. If not, then you do need to move on. You can’t spend the rest of your life like this. You sound like a lovely women.

eatdrinkandbemerry · 20/04/2023 20:55

I'm a twin and couldn't think of anything worse than being with them all the time 🤷‍♀️🤣
I couldn't live like your expected to

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