Would you stay in this marriage

[JemimaBakes]

hi,

my head is spinning trying to make sense of the situation I've found myself in and I'm hoping some advice will clarify things for me. I'm in a classic LTB situation but with complications:

the current reasons to LTB is that he does absolutely nothing and is mean. I work part time in a demanding role, I do 100% of all childcare and 100% of all housework (cooking cleaning laundry, bills, cars, events, holidays, repairs everything). Despite me being in therapy for over 4 years and working on communicating my needs to him, he's unwilling to change. I host his family several times a year, for weeks on end. They're not awful people but won't tolerate a word against him. He's hostile to my family and won't let me have any family/ friends in the house without either tantrums or being directly rude to them. He will never watch the kids (ever) and won't have babysitters in the house, we have no family locally so I can never go out without the kids. There's much more but this is the tip of the iceberg. I juggle all of this and maintain a facade of a happy, functional family but im crumbling. I've developed several health issues and been in therapy for years. I barely have the energy to care for my kids, run the home and show up at work. I'm surviving, barely.

initially, I didn't leave because I thought he could change. Despite solo counselling for him, medication (which he took on and off and was my responsibility to sort out) and many open conversations, he hasn't changed. After that, I felt trapped as a SAHM to two very young DC. As soon ad I could, I returned to work and have built a decent career - now where near as stellar as his but sufficient. I was finally ready to consider leaving and saw a divorce lawyer, leading me to my current dilemma.

DH and I immigrated to the UK from our home country. We married in our home country and are both nationals. Our home country applies Sharia law and so DH would get sole custody of DC. I spoke to a lawyer and he said the only way to prevent DH filing in our home country is to apply for a child arrangements order. However, DH is very aggressive when provoked and this would certainly provoke him. Not just that, but the child arrangements order would apply to both parents. All my family, including my elderly parents, are abroad. So I would never be able to return home. I've even considered a refuge/ moving away but my work is quite niche - if I continued in this industry he could easily find me. His family is very influential in our home country and have previously made threats against my parents/ siblings in my home country who I could not protect. Again, DH and his family have form for vindictiveness and I'm scared to provoke him.

if we were to divorce in the UK, he would be very likely to get at least some custody of our children. The lawyer advised that it was a high bar to prove that contact with a parent would be detrimental to children's welfare. This is where it gets really tricky. He has verbally and emotionally battered me for years, but immediately after I had DC1, he also physically and sexually abused me. He has 'reformed' and not done anything of the sort for over 6 years but I have an indelible fear of what he might be capable of in sole charge of the DC. I don't have any evidence for any of this so it would be his word against mine and he's a very very skilled manipulator. I'm not sure if the DC could even give any reliable evidence - he feeds them lines sometimes. For example, if I say no to screen time etc, he say 'Mummy is so mean to you, is she a mean angry person?' My son has taken to innocently repeating these lines. I confide in my therapist and she agreed I was right to be very wary of him getting custody of the DC.

my plan is to eke out a life until my children are old enough to not require child custody arrangements but I'm not sure I can make it that long and I'm also terrified of the impact on my children. If relevant, he comes from a wealthy family who could and might finance a lengthy legal battle.

thanks to anyone who read this far, any advice would be gratefully received.

This is quite a harsh thing to say.
What are you saying the PP should have done in this difficult situation?

You need to blind side him in the U.K. relatives can visit you here and you of course could meet them in a third country such as France.

you need expert help from those that have been in that situation

Hi, posted my original thread in desperation just before Xmas. Unfortunately, things have deteriorated. DH has had a disagreement at work and as a result has worked from home every day since December (he would usually go into the office one or two days post Covid) so I've lost the small respite I had from him and his endless demands for chores/ meals cooked to order/ cleaning. I'm reviving this thread for some support and to see if anyone might have suggestions for this situation.

Sorry to hear things are no better OP😟

can you see any possible escape pathways? Have you been able to make a start on some sort of plan?
Very hard to think I know with his constantly being in your face and on your case😟

i think this is part of the problem. With him around me 24/7 (unless im
out of the house) I feel like I can barely plan ahead, it usually takes most of my energy to get through the day, do housework/ cooking etc, do my job and the childcare. The last time I had some space was during the October half term when I spent a few days with his family without him.

@JemimaBakes I'm so sorry that I don't have any specific advice to offer, but I wanted to send you support. There are a ton of brilliant women on here who I hope can help. And I hope that now, just talking about it helps. We will all support you while you figure this out. And I'm sure you will. There is always a way, even if you can't see it yet. Try and believe that, for now.

I'm sorry to hear you are in this situation. Please know that many women do care and would wish you to be free of this. Some suggestions which echo what others have said and reflect some of my lived experience:
Save money secretly - is there any way you can give it you your family in an account abroad - somewhere it can't be joined into a divorce which requires accounts to be declared.
How much do your family know - can they provide more emotional support.
Woman's Aid would point you in the right direction for specialist advice. You could also ask them for a therapist who specialises in domestic abuse who will be able to gently support you in your decision-making. This would enable you to get advice under the guise of using a normal therapist. Look for local domestic abuse services as well as they may better know a local therapist who is suitable.
You do need to be devious, accept he is not a good man and keep him sweet while keeping yourself well. It's important to imagine you are quietly backing away from a dangerous wolf. Don't confront him, as this will allow him to work out how to discredit you.
Remember there is nothing wrong with you. The reality is that men like him need therapy. He is inevitably affecting your well-being. Try to make your chores as easy as you can. Prioritise self-care. That is a must. An app like Headspace for just 10 mins per morning will help you deep breathe and calm yourself.
Family courts are awful and women don't get justice or believed so it can be a waste of time getting evidence. Lots of little things can be used to dilute the issue and make you look vindictive, paranoid etc and the man will make lots of things up anyway. But a diary of incidents told in your own terms and how it made you feel, can be very impactful and shows a pattern of behaviour. Most important in my view is to focus on the one big single provable item which will make him look bad to all. This means solicitors/courts have a single major item to deal with which is obviously terrible and they don't get confused by too many smaller things and he says/she says.

Unfortunately, I’m back again and hoping to find a little bit of support on this thread and also posting in case anyone else in a similar situation gets some use out of this thread in future. One of the main problems is I find it so hard to plan with him around all the time. However, my only time away is trips to see family (his and mine) in our home country with unreliable Wi-Fi/ international call charges so I can’t plan effectively whilst away either.
I have kept the email diary and been speaking to friends who have been through the family courts in the UK. They’ve advised that the children’s wishes re contact can be taken into account from age 14 so in the best case scenario I might be able to leave once my youngest is 14 rather than 18.

I find it so hard to live constantly ‘on alert’. I’m always sterling myself for the next tantrum or criticism or demand. Today, he thanked me for completing a small job for him and it took me so off guard I could feel tears prickling.

What an awful post! Kick someone in the teeth why don’t you when they’re probably feeling awful already? It’s very easy on here to judge on a written post but you don’t know what happened behind closed doors. I’m glad you’re not one of my friends with that judgemental attitude.

You have my support and I hope others will be along soon. It’s such a difficult position that you’re in OP and I’m so sorry you’re going through this.

You live in the UK? If so, is your marriage recognised as a legal marriage under UK law? Are your children UK born / British citizens? I’m just thinking if you divorced in Britain, and your children are UK citizens then whatever your husband does under Sharia law wouldn’t count, would it, as it’s not recognised in the UK? It might be a problem if your stbxh takes the children to visit his family though. I think you need specialist legal advice and maybe speak to Women’s Aid as they must have experience of this. I’m sorry you’re in such an awful situation.

What is your legal situation, OP? Do you both have indefinite right to remain in Uk? Do your children have British citizenship? You didn’t answer a previous question about the legal status of your marriage, this might also have some bearing on your rights in this country.

could you apply for British citizenship? It might make your access to legal protection easier, and give you more independence.

Meaning RH didn't value all her children. ?

Yes, we’re all British citizens but we’re also all foreign citizens and we were married abroad.The lawyer I spoke with said that given that we are foreign citizens and were married in our home country, I couldn’t prevent DH from filing for divorce in our home country. Therefore, the next best option would be an order to prevent or ban the children from leaving the UK, so that even if a foreign court decided DH should have full custody, the decision couldn’t be enforced. The problem is that I suspect that if I applied for such an order to keep them in the UK, he would then campaign for 50:50 custody in the UK. I’m concerned that he might be successful and I don’t trust him alone with the kids given his temper.

Sorry, I must have missed the question. It was a ‘nikkah’ held abroad and registered as a marriage in our home country. I showed the lawyer I met our nikkah certificate and asked whether we were legally married in the UK. He said that as the marriage certificate was government issued and in English, we would be recognised as married in the UK

@JemimaBakes you are incredible and amazing, a real superhero. I really hope one day you meet a man who truly deserves you.

Until then for the immediate situation: are you able to get out while he is working from home? Are you working from home too? Do you have an office to go to? Or are those your non working days?

With the kids, is there a local library you can go to after school: they can hang out and you can use their WiFi and even desktops (might be more efficient than phone)

And thank you so much for raising kind, considerate sons unlike their father and thus breaking the vicious circle.

This sounds truly and utterly horrific. I cannot imagine living like this. He is a monster and will not change. You have all my best wishes, hugs and virtual support OP. I'm sorry I don't have anything useful to suggest as I have no experience of anything like this. It must be awful feeling trapped. It strikes me that the biggest roadblock you have is ensuring the safety of your children i.e. only being able to leave with 100% custody of the children. Given what you have described about your husband, I personally think you are right to protect them in this way, which realistically might mean sacrificing a great deal of your personal freedom by staying until they are relatively self sufficient or finding a way to leave with them. Use your lawyer, use Women's aid. I agree with people about documenting everything. You could even write a testimonial about the historical abuse you've alluded to and the impact this had. You need to carve out a little time for yourself to think, breathe and plan (though I appreciate your husband has created circumstances to prevent this). Can you order food shopping online? Or if you go to the shops, take a little longer/ go to a coffee shop with wifi first? Definitely cut corners with cleaning etc. Could you hire a cleaner, be a bit devious and tell him the housework is physically affecting your back or something? Keep money in a separate savings account he can't find, possibly in the name of a trusted relative. If you feel it is safe, talk to your family. I'm sure they would hate to know you are suffering this way and your children and they might insist on coming to visit to give you support and room to breathe. Good luck xx

@JemimaBakes I posted before on this thread. Do DM me if you want to talk or need support or advice. I am from overseas too, Muslim, married and came here and then divorced years later after a great deal of family opposition and seemingly insurmountable obstacles. My life has changed so much from my miserable existence while married. It's a lovely feeling on this side – I hope and pray you find this too

For your safety and your children's, it would be best for you to be in contact with a Domestic Abuse service in your area if you can.
Your case would be a honor based violence, which is everything you are experiencing now.
The domestic abuse team will support you moving to refuge with your children and keeping you safe.
The team will support you with Civil orders such as non-molestation order, child orders etc.. you will not have to fo this alone. They will support you in every step, even going to court with you if you have too.
They will also support you with benefits and finding you housing, where you will not be found.
You can download the app called Bright Sky, it looks like a weather app on the front page, if you click and hold it opens up into a journal where you can record all of the abuse you are experiencing.
To stay safe, try to keep your phone on you at all times. If you call 999 if your in danger then let the call connect to the police then dial 55, the police will know someone is on the end of the line but can't talk, they will trace your phone and get to you.
Please google a domestic abuse service in your area, they could save your life, if you can't do this yourself have a family member/friend support you in this.
Stay safe.

Unfortunately, I’m back with another update. I’m sorry to drag out such a doom and gloom thread, but I often come back just to read the comments and they give me such strength. I’m also documenting in case anyone can relate or might find it helpful. It’s not endlessly bad but DH continues to be volatile. The boys and I used to go stay with his family sometimes but he’s now insisting we can only go with him so even less respite for all of us. I’m so ashamed to admit, I saw DS8 flinch when DH walked in behind him the room this weekend, they’re both scared of his volatile moods. Sometimes, to appease him they’ll agree with him, or ask me to apologise for whatever perceived slight is bothering him. Yesterday, we were all chatting and DH mentioned it was the anniversary of a certain event. Without thinking I said ‘wasn’t that yesterday?’ Which triggered an enormous tantrum, yelling at me, yelling at the kids, cancelling our plans for the evening and the next day (we were due to see friends and the kids were excited for it). The kids didn’t see it but he also went up to our room and threw everything out of my cupboard, I put it all back before the kids realised. I’m so worried how I’m going to last until my youngest is 14.

In a previous post I mentioned his historic abuse. Even if he didn’t abuse the boys, I’m scared of leaving them in his custody for 2 reasons. Firstly, when he is angry, he’s livid. Once he made DS1 sit outside for hours in a temper, he said I don’t want to see that boy in my house. I covered it up and had a picnic outside, I don’t think DS1 even realised but I’m worried about his anger if I’m not around. Secondly, he makes really poor parenting decisions. The boys have been to A&E a few times after accidents in his care (just not supervising them at all). He makes bad decisions himself, like driving after being up all night and hitting a curb (could be a lamppost next) so now I do all the driving, taking the 2 boys shopping and then wandering off to find better signal leaving them petrified to find security (so now I join them on all trips out of the house). Even if he wasn’t intentionally abusive, I don’t think I could trust him to look after the boys.