Advising People To Leave Relationships

[TheShellBeach]

It isn't that easy just to bin someone and move on with your life.

The advice to LTB is honestly meant, but quite difficult to take.
You would have to find somewhere else to live (or they would) and if there are children, they would have to be handled sensitively.

Well yes but it doesn't mean it isn't the right advice.

I do think it's overused here tho

I agree that it generally is the right advice.
I think what I meant was that a lot of posters get annoyed with people when they don't leave abusive relationships immediately. It isn't usually that simple to do.

Or or or....and stick with me for a moment

The problem isn't that people say LTB too much, it's more that there's far too many instances of entirely leave-worthy behaviour.

ᵒʳ ᶦᵗ'ˢ ᵃ ᵇᶦᵗ ᵒᶠ ᵇᵒᵗʰ

I'm with Dolor. LTB is a bit of a joke on MN, but a deliberate one - it's about encouraging people to realise that they don't have to accept ill-treatment forever.

Which is part of installing healthy boundaries and relationships in the first place. LTB FTW!

I believe it takes a lot of courage to post about your relationship even anonymously in the first place.

Usually by the time someone is posting, their situation is serious. Many times they are in an abusive controlling relationship or marriage for years.

I suppose they held on trying different things and hoping that things would get better.

By the time someone posts here, a LTB is the correct advice.

That doesn't mean it is easy at all. It never is.
Children, property, still have hope and feeling for the B.
Many things to where they just can't up and leave.

The good thing about this place is that there are so many knowledgeable people on here who are able to point to resources on how to be able to leave.
Other message boards may say to stay with him and keep trying to work things out. Not this one. I appreciate the bluntness here. It's often what is needed.

If there weren't so many horrid, lazy, selfish, abusive partners out there, LTB wouldn't be said as much.

Thankfully in this country as well as other western countries, LTB is an option.

Now that I've written a novel and my tuppence worth...

Having worked with many women in abusive relationships over the years one of the things that has always struck me is how many don't actually realise that the relationship IS abusive. I think it is very powerful for many women here to have it validated that the behaviour of their partners is not acceptable, that they are worth more and that they have choices. It certainly is not easy to leave an abusive relationship but not telling people that they should is not the answer.

I have never seen anyone be told to leave immediately unless the person they are with is violent and at risk of hurting the Op or their children. the vast majority of people saying ‘LTB’ do not mean ‘pack your stuff this second and leave’

LTB, is common in here but so is ‘get your ducks in a row’ which is about getting yourself into the best position possible to leave .

I don’t get annoyed when people don’t ltb immediately - abusive relationships are so hard to get out of. There’s another post on here where the op is being sexually assaulted/raped by her husband and I just feel so sad for her.

I’ve seen posters get quite annoyed when someone doesn’t leave/kick him out immediately, and I’ve seen posters give people a very hard time when their relationship is on the rocks. There’s a thread about someone who’s husband is drinking heavily and while I think LTB is absolutely the right advice the tone of some of the posts is very harsh.

in saying that, I value folk who will directly say “time to leave”, not for someone to go immediately but acknowledging that for whatever reason the relationship has run it’s course. Even once you’ve made that decision it takes time - 10 months in my case - for the leaving to happen, most people aren’t in a position to break up their home and find somewhere else to live immediately. So a bit of caution and patience and planning is needed but most of the time I think LTB is good advice.

Exactly what @JennyForeigner says.

@HowVeryBizarre absolutely nails it. Women in abusive relationships are boiling frogs and the abuse becomes normalised over the years.

and I say this as someone who’s lived that and so yeh, I’m quick to say LTB because I see how it plays out.

So some people say it as a bit of a joke?

The old "didnt mean it literally"?

I think people on here say it with no understanding of what it actually entails.
LTB?
Ok so I'll leave the house that I jointly own with my two children, two cats, hamsters etc and go where? Into temporary accommodation which is so easy to come by. How will I work if my work is miles from the nearest bnb where they've put us up and I now longer have access to a car? What about school? How will my children do homework in a noisy bnb with everyone else waiting for housing? What about my child with additional needs? What about my child who misses her dad, what do I tell her about us now being in a skanky one room hostel waiting months for somewhere to live?
What if I don't qualify for social housing and now have to privately rent costing me nearly 2K a month when half of my mortgage payment used to be £250? What if the landlord sells up?
The family house then doesn't sell and so I am left for months paying rent and half the mortgage on a house I can't use. We have a recession and suddenly we are going to have to sell for less than we paid. Now neither of us can afford little more than studio flats. Our children are unhappy and don't understand. I've had to get a second job and now don't see them much. Plus every other birthday, Christmas and half of the summer holiday I don't see them.

Unless there is abuse I see very few people actually choosing the situation above. Being unhappy in a marriage vs being unhappy in the situation above? There's not much in it for me.

Yes, that’s the issue. LTB is fine, and not overused here. The problem is that LTB is UNDERused in RL. In all the years I talked to my friends about the many instances of abnormal and painful behaviour from my H no-one ever said, ‘You do realise that’s not normal? You shouldn’t stay with him’. Instead it was, ‘Men! What are they like?!’ In RL appalling behaviour from men is normalized. Many Mnetters have the experience to recognize awful behaviour from the off.

But yea OP, the problem is that if the OP does not quickly agree she should leave, there are posters who will turn against her, start attacking her as a terrible mother. I despise those posters. A woman, experiencing abuse, is subject to abuse as she tries to talk about it. Those posters drive her from the thread, drive her from support.

Even worse are posters who, if the woman does come back later and start a new thread, say, ‘you’ve posted all this before and had advice’. These posters are bullies.

@Joannagorilla

Yes, the reality of leaving a relationship, especially with young children, is often extraordinarily difficult.... so I can quite understand why people put up with a lot of crap in their relationships as the alternative is often so difficult.

@Tuilpmouse I would argue it's actually impossible for a lot of women. Especially those who have children with disabilities and are unable to work. I would bet it would be near impossible to leave an unhappy relationship.

If people are posting horrific abuse, horrendous maltreatment and they are distressed by it what are they expecting from an online forum? None of us is a fairy aunt who will come and rescue you. You need to be your own hero, there is nobody coming to scoop you up and sort out your life for you, disappointing as it is. If you just want to vent, write in a diary.

I'd never post a relationship dilemma. The lack of any nuance or understanding of how complicated it is to separate would make it pointless.

I don't think the MN demographic helps to be honest.
Mostly (allegedly) well to do women with husbands on a six figure salary. They usually have a nice home and very few money worries. Splitting from their husband would mean a change in lifestyle no doubt but probably wouldn't end in poverty for them or their children.
If I left my husband, we would have to sell the family home. There wouldn't be enough equity for a deposit each. We live in the North, some of the estates around here with social housing available are not fit to house your pets never mind your children so I would be avoiding that at all costs!
My point is, as long as there is no abuse and assuming you are just unhappy sometimes the grass most certainly wouldn't be greener after LTB!

You also get that "could you just get a higher paid job" attitude that is as unhelpful for this issue as it is everywhere else it rears its ugly head. No really we aren't all able to get higher paid jobs.

Nobody reads "ltb" and heads off with nowhere to go and no money when you get there. But a cacophony of LTB makes you weigh up what you're prepared to endure and for how long and what other options do you reasonably have, what options can you create with planning/saving/waiting.

I think ltb posts are excellent. Nobody should ever be encouraged to restrict themselves to the bad bed they made.

Yes, there are lots of women in these situations. Where leaving means leaving to something even worse.
occasionally these women post on other threads.

I wish they were able to have their own support threads, but they aren’t because the only response is LTB, whereas what they need is support to live the best life they can in the situation of their life.

The assumption is also that there are better partners out there. Perhaps, but likely not in sufficient numbers.
I'm used to being chronically single and have resigned myself to it. But a lot of people aren't like that.

Sometimes it obviously is a joke. 'My DH doesn't like co-sleeping with my pet tarantula!' 'LTB!'

Otherwise, it is a MN trope - the idea is that we jump to LTB when it's marginal. I'm saying I don't think that's right, but rather that posters are encouraging women to consider what they are willing to accept. As other PPs have said, it's validating and necessary to explore the idea of relationship dissolution whether you ultimately leave or try to stay with more power.

I think the problem is that so many women accept totally shitty behaviour from men; it has become normalised. Yes, it's hard to LTB but it doesn't mean it's not the right thing to do in the long term.