A different perspective needed please

[throwaway1987]

Hi all,

Throw away account but I need a difference perspective and external views on a relationship issue I’m having. More than happy to be told I’m in the wrong if that is the case.

DP (M40) and I (F34) have been together for almost 1 year and generally we have a great relationship. We have fun, are loving and seem to be very well suited. For context, we live separately and some distance away from each other but see each other most weekends.

I have some abandonment issues (that he’s aware of) and find changes to plans difficult to cope with but have learnt through therapy a way of coping with these situations which is to pause, take a deep breath and think about what you actually want to say in response rather than an immediate gut reaction of pain and hurt etc. (i.e. control the flight or fight response).

Today he called me to talk about a plan change for a forthcoming weekend as he wanted to stay at his to work on a project. I was immediately sad given I’d looked forward to the weekend (which had we had arranged to spend together) but did what I have learnt to do, pause, breath, react. I acknowledged that I was sad about the change of plans (and accept that my tone was probably flat) but that I understood and was ok with the plan.

I’m honestly not really sure what happened next but essentially he flew off the handle said that my pause was ‘crippling’, that I was trying to manipulate him into feeling guilty about it and that he’s anxious about raising these things with me. He told me that he ‘can’t deal with this’ and that ‘you can’t react that way’, essentially making me think he was saying change or I’m off. He also seems to not listen to what I’m saying when this sort of thing happens, he said I’d accused him of being unreasonable and unfair on the call but I genuinely didn’t say anything negative about him apart from I was sad but understood etc. He actually suggested that he should of recorded our conversation so that he could play it back and prove ‘what I said and the way I said it’ – honestly I’m taking that as a red flag.

I should say, it’s not the first time he’s suggested I’ve tried to manipulate him by saying I’m sad about something to ‘guilt trip him’. He seems unable to accept that my emotions are real when he can’t imagine feeling that way himself. I also totally understand that not everyone would be sad about this sort of thing but I always try to validate other peoples’ emotions even when I can’t necessarily understand them myself.

Anyway, I explained why I have that reaction (therapists advice) and that if that didn’t work for him maybe we could have an unemotional (I was balling my eyes out at this point) conversation about how I could react in a way that would work better for both of us. That suggestion didn't go down well and honestly have no idea why anymore

So right now I’m in a headspin. He said we should just talk later but I honestly don’t know what to say. I want to be with someone that validates my emotions and generally doesn’t think I’m trying to manipulate them every time I’m sad about something they don’t understand. But could I have come across as manipulative when I wasn't by my actions or words? Could the pause, deep breath and react be working against me rather than helping me stay calm and grounded when my flight or fight response is triggered? I know my issues aren’t his issues so I try my best not to put those on him but I also know that I need to be with someone who understands me and supports me.

Anyway, thoughts, opinions all welcome

He doesn't care about your feelings OP, at all! Only his wants/needs matter. Red flag 🚩

He seems unable to accept that my emotions are real when he can’t imagine feeling that way himself

v

I want to be with someone that validates my emotions and generally doesn’t think I’m trying to manipulate them every time I’m sad about something they don’t understand

He's not your guy. He's not even nice to you. Run very very far away from anyone who accuses you of being manipulative. Unless you were? Were you being manipulative?

Thanks @Watchkeys for what it's worth there was no manipulation on my part, I wasn't trying to make him feel guilty or convince him to go back to the original plan. I was controlling my emotions the best I could and wanted to explain that it was ok but that I was sad

for what it's worth

What is it worth? To you? The fact that he says you're manipulative, and you know you're not? How much value do you assign to that, emotionally? How bad does that make you feel, on a 1 - 10 scale?

It's everything and I feel like a zero right now. Hearing a partner who I love and see a future with tell me I am being manipulative when I just wanted to express how I feel honestly makes me feel sick

Oh right, so you have to tailor your reactions to his liking to avoid hurting his feelings, cos he’s the only one in the relationship who has feelings, right?

A how many sided relationship is that then?

And how is it you’re supposed to grow as a person and learn to trust yourself when he’s constantly telling you your feelings and reactions are wrong?

It doesn’t really sound like he’s that bothered about how you feel, as long as his feelings are nice and protected.

How long was the pause for OP? I wonder if he feels like he is treading on eggshells around you and dreads the call ?

I get that you have issues but he is in this equation now and is maybe getting the 'ick.' Just another perspective.

@Aggypanthus can’t have been more than 3 seconds. It didn’t feel long but I guess that could seem a while on the phone

Well, this sounds horrible for you. If he is believing things about you that are not true, to the extent that it's making you feel sick, then he's a bit nuts, isn't he?

I mean, if he said to you that you had 6 legs and that your hair was made out of yoghurt, that wouldn't make you feel sick, because you'd know it wasn't true, and just a sign that he can clearly believe in things that are nonsense.

Why is it different if he says you're manipulative? Why can't he just be wrong, and a bit barmy, and clearly someone who doesn't see you for what you really are?

It's not a helpful perspective. Working out why he's treating her badly or seeing her in an unpleasant an inaccurate way isn't the key to this. If he feels like that, he needs to talk to her about it; his emotions are his to manage. It's not for OP to be trying to guess what he's feeling. If she can't ask him, or can't trust his answer, then the relationship is gone anyway, because they're not relating to each other.

I'm wondering if he took your deep breath as a heavy sigh and found that 'manipulative' in any way. Not that it excuses his behaviour in any way. I don't think he sounds right for you OP an I'd seriously reconsider this relationship.

Of course it is a helpful perspective, trying to understand the relationship is part of helping to make the best decision ?

OP Perhaps he is not the right person for you given that you have been together for a year and he fully understands your problems. If he affects you like this now then maybe its time to consider your options.
Of course there could be another reason for his outburst and he may apologise?

So there was a sigh/deep breath. He may have gotten wound up over that, but that is an overreaction anyway as you qualified it.

But then he put words in your mouth that you didn't say and used them as a reason to have a go at you. He is manipulative and unpleasant.

So, yes, do take it as a red flag and move on from him. It doesn't sound like a one off and no way to spend your life.

Your response to hearing something you didn't want to hear reminds me very much of my mother. The exaggerated pause, the sigh, the flat verbal response. My mother definitely does this to try and manipulate, and she loves to guilt people. She refuses to deal with disappointment in a mature manner and has to make things miserable. I'm not saying you're right or he's right, but there are two sides to this.

Trying to understand why he's making her feel like shit is useful for after she's left him. It's not useful in sorting out the relationship. That's true.

But he has form for calling her manipulative. He has form for putting her feelings at 0 out of 10. It's not helpful to suggest she stay in the hope he might apologise. The damage is done. A person might apologise for anything, but it doesn't mean they didn't do it, and it doesn't make it hurt less.

The fact that he said he feels anxious ringing you and is threading on eggshells makes it sound like you have over reacted to situations before??

I'm sorry but I would find being in a relationship with you draining and you definitely wouldn't be for me, it sounds like you're not for him either.

I know that may sound harsh but I honestly couldn't be dealing with an adult with abandonment issues who I have to treat like a child and watch my words around.

The fact that he said he feels anxious ringing you and is threading on eggshells makes it sound like you have over reacted to situations before

There's no such thing as over-reacting, except in the way that we each view ourselves. If OP feels she's behaved ok, then it doesn't matter whether you'd find her draining. It's not up to you - or him - to decide how she should behave.

@throwaway1987 were you ok with how you behaved? You're the judge of whether you over-reacted or not, not some stranger, guessing and judging you.

It’s not necessarily helpful to OP to attribute all the fault to her or to her partner. It sounds like overall the relationship has been going well.

It may be that this guy is an arse and/or otherwise just completely wrong for you, OP, or it may be that he’s struggling with having to deal with how you react to changes of plan. Pausing and taking a deep breath can sound like a martyred sigh which in itself can be really annoying but of course shouting wouldn’t have been better.

If you were otherwise secure in the relationship (perhaps you weren’t), couldn’t you take that as your base from which to deal with changes of plans? You just wanted to express how you feel but perhaps he also just wanted to express how he felt?

I think MN is fab and posters very wise but I think there is a tendency to say a breakdown in communication is entirely one or other party’s fault when there’s often a bit of fault on both sides.

It may be this guy just is a total arsehole and now showing his true colours or it may be that some give is needed on both sides.

She literally posted on here looking for others perspectives??

Yes. For validation from others. Because she doesn't validate herself. She knows he's making her feel terrible. She knows she can't talk to him about it. She knows she wasn't unreasonable. She knows he's treating her as if she was.

Sometimes when someone says 'He makes me feel like shit, is he abusive?' the best thing to do isn't to give your opinion, it's to encourage the person to form and trust their own opinion. We don't have OP's feelings, history, natuaral responses. We don't have the nuances of the situations or the relationship. We don't hear the tones of voice, we don't see the body language. Your opinion counts for nothing, as does mine. OP's opinion is everything, and she needs to validate it for herself.

Sorry for talking about you in the 3rd person, @throwaway1987 One MN poster's opinion on whether they would like to be in a relationship with you is just that: one person's opinion. About their own feelings. Those feelings are not relevant to you, your relationship, or the issue you've posted about. You're the one with all the info here. You're the one who knows how it feels to you. Listen to your feelings. They will signpost you, if you respect them.

@Watchkeys
Other people's opinions are equally as valid as yours. Railroading other people's posts is a way of killing a subject. We are entitled to that opinion just as you are.

You know best.

I agree with you @Aggypanthus OP, sometimes how we think we come across can not be how it's has beem received, as you know. My sister is a sigher, usually followed by an 'ok' that really isn't an 'ok', so I'd probably have been on the defensive too at the other end of that reaction. I understand where you're coming from though, and your explanation would change my view of your reaction, however, maybe it's happening more than you realise?

I'm not making out you're in the wrong, just helping you to see that it may not be as black and white as he's wrong and you're right

sometimes how we think we come across can not be how it's has beem received

Which is why it's important to spend your time with people who understand you, and see you as you are.

Agree with everything @Watchkeys has said.

It sounds like he has his own abandonment issues - has he had any therapy? He felt abandoned in those few seconds of silence but as @Watchkeys said, those are his feelings to manage, not to throw out in anger at you, @throwaway1987