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Original poster

Wanting a friendship with boundaries - Wording an email / text

3 replies

Hopeandlove · 27/08/2022 18:23

There is much back history - 30 year friendship. Two children each. I’m god children to hers and she is to mine. Both of us went through awful marriages and divorces.

She always has been flaky - eg meet up and then no show. But then when ex emptied the bank account she drove 100 miles to lend me £500 cash - so I don’t want to put all her negatives there. But there are a lot over the years - and I mean a lot.

we have a DD the same age - my eldest and her youngest. But her eldest eldest is a proper adult and my youngest is primary. Both the girls who are the same age - are chalk and cheese and do not get on. Never have.

the last 8 years have been hard. No doubt about it. She hasn’t invited me to her house once in that time but sometimes came and stayed but she would mark exam papers (summer holidays leaving me with the girls etc) so I stopped. Phone calls - mine would go unanswered for weeks and yet when she phoned and if I didn’t pick up she would ring and ring and ring etc
there is much history. I been in ptsd counselling for over a year and I’m in a much better place - I’m a different person. Last Christmas after a period of reflection about How she treated me -she arranged to visit and pleaded with me to come and I cancelled a holiday and then she didn’t show- in September I told her how I felt. In November I phoned her and finished the friendship and told her how I felt - she didn’t answer so left a voice Mail. She rang back straight away and apologised. I said I was sick of have a race to who has the worst ex husband in the world, that I was sick of moaning conversations that I didn’t want to be a victim any more etc she pleaded with me. Told me her daughter was under a psychiatric ward and attempting suicide and told me she found phoning me hard as my DD moved up a year in school and straight level 9 whilst hers in under mental health team and found talking to me hard.
I said that last fine I get that but I just don’t want you to keep overloading to me and the last 5 years I have found draining - I get off the phone and just feel miserable. this is 5 years of negativity.
We never meet up and do anything fun. We never visit anywhere. Together or have a laugh. We talked about it and she promised to change. I’m not negative about mental health and having gone through ptsd myself and a serious trauma - I do know I needed to do work.

to Be fair she admitted she hadn’t invited me to stay for 7 years and invited me stay - she has a beautiful house in London but the house is run down as she never does diy and she constantly buys second hand stuff so it is full. She offered us to visit whilst we went to something we want to see in London. We wanted to see this as a family me, youngest and eldest. She then suggested the eldest DD go out together in London (both 15) for the day and I took youngest to visit exhibit. Both of my children said no, we want to do it together. So I declined. She has pushed for her daughter and mine to meet up - mine is academic and autistic, hers is not going to school and self harming etc and mine feels anxious about meeting her. They were very different even as children - hers drinks and smokes and mine just likes a game of chess. - by the way I’m making no judgement about mental health etc - just they are chalk and cheese.

I declined the summer invite.

she has reached out repeatedly by phone email letter and flowers etc over the last two weeks and I haven’t responded. Despite no reply she keeps ringing - all nice messages left congratulating DD on her results and commenting nicely about some of the days out I have had on social media that she has seen. Eg loved the new dress from your shopping trip really suits you etc

I don’t want to ignore it. I’ve discussed with the counsellor my options eg finish it totally etc

I have had other friendships where we have both been through absolute hell in our personal lives but we still meet up and go to a national trust property and have a lovely catch up. This Is what normal friendship feels like.
coming from a difficult family I am working long term on myself and not being a people pleaser.
we looked at the trauma triangle etc and me being a rescuer and her being in the victim role.

I can not solve her daughters problems or hers - I can’t. She’s lurched from one drama to another for years. She moans about her lack of money but she lives in a house worth over a million in London and could easily move out and buy a house anywhere else and be debt free. She has more money than me(!).

before you accuse me of being non supportive over mental health etc I have been on the phone listened to either everything he ex has done or work (she can’t hold a job down - she thinks she is wonderful and yet places always let her go after 6 months or a year etc as she is too ‘good’ for them). She trains for different jobs constantly spending thousands and then decides it is not for her. She lurches from one disaster relationship to the next etc - although thank god that has stopped right now as the daughter wasn’t coping.

I want to offer a friendship only. I’m happy to support her but she needs to get counselling herself and sort herself out.

basically I want a role where my own boundaries are strong. I feel and my counsellor feels that this is now a place I am in.
The counsellor is not pushing me either way.

I have decided not to finish the friendship right now.

This is the text I am planning to send
‘thank you for the card, texts and calls. We have been busy having a relaxing summer and enjoying family time. Hope you are well and if you want to zoom for half an hour Sunday morning we can catch up then’

if it then goes into a pity party - after 5-10 minutes I can end the talk. The other alternative is to offer to meet her on a weekend in October ?

I just don’t want up get sucked back in.

long post I know

i can’t change her as person. She is not ND as far as she knows. She will say crass stuff eg I am estranged from my abusive parents and she frequently has told me how lucky I am as her much loved father who adored her equally died two years ago. So I can’t mention my parents as she gets upset as ‘I’m so lucky’ my father beat me repeatedly. I get her grief I do. My ex and hers are both fuckwits. However I deal with it now by boxing it - discuss once if he has been a twat and then move on and try not to dwell.

has anyone had a friend like this and managed to keep boundaries etc
if we have a call and she spirals what do I say - I have encouraged counselling etc I have tried saying ‘what can you do’ ‘what can’t you change’ etc

has anyone else successfully managed to redefine a relationship ? And get a friendship on a more even level!?

I want to redefine our roles - I don’t want to be rescuer etc

OP posts:
DPotter · 27/08/2022 18:39

Sometimes friendships just run their course - there's no cause or blame, just people moving in different directions. Especially with children - life is sooo busy that it's difficult to keep up, even if both parties are organised and in a good place.

I think your note is fine. However it's not up to you to counsel or try to be a therapist. If she starts to 'spiral' - say 'look I can't get into that at the moment, it's too much for me' and change the subject. Remember she's told you she doesn't want to talk about your childhood and parents, so it's only fair you draw a boundary too. I don't think you should suggest a met up - she doesn't sound reliable enough and you'll be disappointed once again.

I'll be honest, I think after 30 years of this dynamic, you're on to a loser if your are the only one who wants to re-frame. Try this one zoom and take it from there, but be prepared to see the friendship drift away.

Caroffee · 27/08/2022 19:24

Hopeandlove · 27/08/2022 18:23

There is much back history - 30 year friendship. Two children each. I’m god children to hers and she is to mine. Both of us went through awful marriages and divorces.

She always has been flaky - eg meet up and then no show. But then when ex emptied the bank account she drove 100 miles to lend me £500 cash - so I don’t want to put all her negatives there. But there are a lot over the years - and I mean a lot.

we have a DD the same age - my eldest and her youngest. But her eldest eldest is a proper adult and my youngest is primary. Both the girls who are the same age - are chalk and cheese and do not get on. Never have.

the last 8 years have been hard. No doubt about it. She hasn’t invited me to her house once in that time but sometimes came and stayed but she would mark exam papers (summer holidays leaving me with the girls etc) so I stopped. Phone calls - mine would go unanswered for weeks and yet when she phoned and if I didn’t pick up she would ring and ring and ring etc
there is much history. I been in ptsd counselling for over a year and I’m in a much better place - I’m a different person. Last Christmas after a period of reflection about How she treated me -she arranged to visit and pleaded with me to come and I cancelled a holiday and then she didn’t show- in September I told her how I felt. In November I phoned her and finished the friendship and told her how I felt - she didn’t answer so left a voice Mail. She rang back straight away and apologised. I said I was sick of have a race to who has the worst ex husband in the world, that I was sick of moaning conversations that I didn’t want to be a victim any more etc she pleaded with me. Told me her daughter was under a psychiatric ward and attempting suicide and told me she found phoning me hard as my DD moved up a year in school and straight level 9 whilst hers in under mental health team and found talking to me hard.
I said that last fine I get that but I just don’t want you to keep overloading to me and the last 5 years I have found draining - I get off the phone and just feel miserable. this is 5 years of negativity.
We never meet up and do anything fun. We never visit anywhere. Together or have a laugh. We talked about it and she promised to change. I’m not negative about mental health and having gone through ptsd myself and a serious trauma - I do know I needed to do work.

to Be fair she admitted she hadn’t invited me to stay for 7 years and invited me stay - she has a beautiful house in London but the house is run down as she never does diy and she constantly buys second hand stuff so it is full. She offered us to visit whilst we went to something we want to see in London. We wanted to see this as a family me, youngest and eldest. She then suggested the eldest DD go out together in London (both 15) for the day and I took youngest to visit exhibit. Both of my children said no, we want to do it together. So I declined. She has pushed for her daughter and mine to meet up - mine is academic and autistic, hers is not going to school and self harming etc and mine feels anxious about meeting her. They were very different even as children - hers drinks and smokes and mine just likes a game of chess. - by the way I’m making no judgement about mental health etc - just they are chalk and cheese.

I declined the summer invite.

she has reached out repeatedly by phone email letter and flowers etc over the last two weeks and I haven’t responded. Despite no reply she keeps ringing - all nice messages left congratulating DD on her results and commenting nicely about some of the days out I have had on social media that she has seen. Eg loved the new dress from your shopping trip really suits you etc

I don’t want to ignore it. I’ve discussed with the counsellor my options eg finish it totally etc

I have had other friendships where we have both been through absolute hell in our personal lives but we still meet up and go to a national trust property and have a lovely catch up. This Is what normal friendship feels like.
coming from a difficult family I am working long term on myself and not being a people pleaser.
we looked at the trauma triangle etc and me being a rescuer and her being in the victim role.

I can not solve her daughters problems or hers - I can’t. She’s lurched from one drama to another for years. She moans about her lack of money but she lives in a house worth over a million in London and could easily move out and buy a house anywhere else and be debt free. She has more money than me(!).

before you accuse me of being non supportive over mental health etc I have been on the phone listened to either everything he ex has done or work (she can’t hold a job down - she thinks she is wonderful and yet places always let her go after 6 months or a year etc as she is too ‘good’ for them). She trains for different jobs constantly spending thousands and then decides it is not for her. She lurches from one disaster relationship to the next etc - although thank god that has stopped right now as the daughter wasn’t coping.

I want to offer a friendship only. I’m happy to support her but she needs to get counselling herself and sort herself out.

basically I want a role where my own boundaries are strong. I feel and my counsellor feels that this is now a place I am in.
The counsellor is not pushing me either way.

I have decided not to finish the friendship right now.

This is the text I am planning to send
‘thank you for the card, texts and calls. We have been busy having a relaxing summer and enjoying family time. Hope you are well and if you want to zoom for half an hour Sunday morning we can catch up then’

if it then goes into a pity party - after 5-10 minutes I can end the talk. The other alternative is to offer to meet her on a weekend in October ?

I just don’t want up get sucked back in.

long post I know

i can’t change her as person. She is not ND as far as she knows. She will say crass stuff eg I am estranged from my abusive parents and she frequently has told me how lucky I am as her much loved father who adored her equally died two years ago. So I can’t mention my parents as she gets upset as ‘I’m so lucky’ my father beat me repeatedly. I get her grief I do. My ex and hers are both fuckwits. However I deal with it now by boxing it - discuss once if he has been a twat and then move on and try not to dwell.

has anyone had a friend like this and managed to keep boundaries etc
if we have a call and she spirals what do I say - I have encouraged counselling etc I have tried saying ‘what can you do’ ‘what can’t you change’ etc

has anyone else successfully managed to redefine a relationship ? And get a friendship on a more even level!?

I want to redefine our roles - I don’t want to be rescuer etc

Difficult. She does value your friendship but doesn't respect your boundaries. I have also reached a stage where I don't wish to be the untrained therapist friend/rescuer and one or two friendships have gone to the wayside as a consequence. A third option to ending it or putting up with it is just to reduce contact to a bare minimum i.e. once a year. Friends who dump on you are draining. Friendships should be fun.

Onceuponatimeinalandfaraway · 27/08/2022 23:15

I have a similar friend. I had to get extremely blunt with her. Still say things like “we have discussed this many times over the years, I’ve told you I can’t help and suggested things that may help. You’ve chosen to not try any of those things and I am not prepared to listen to the same complaint anymore.” Or “I’ve already told you I’m not prepared to listen to this again, is there something else you want to talk about” . It’s taken time but she’s learning. Being nice about it wasn’t getting me anywhere. Bluntness and very clear stating of what I will or won’t accept and not letting her continue to moan about years old issues she doesn’t seem to want to change has helped.

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