Verbally aggressive DS (16)

[Moopster]

DS (16) becomes extremely verbally aggressive when he doesn't get his own way to the point where he scares me and although he has never indicated any sign of violence, my worry is that it is the next step on escalation. I grew up in a physical abusive household so some of his actions are triggering (not his fault - he doesn't know).

I am also concerned that he gas lights me and does it so confidently that he makes me question my own sanity.

I divorced his Dad last year who was financially and emotionally abusive. I spent years wanting a divorce but not going through with it for the sake of the kids and not wanting to upset their lives. I never wanted my children to come from a broken home. I now worry that I stayed too long as DS mirrors some of the behaviours that I had from his Dad.

I stayed strong this morning and when he threatened to go to his Dad's I said it was fine but that he didn't come back - I won't have him using that as a threat. As soon as he left to go to school I turned into a broken sobbing mess. I am filled with anxiety at the thought of him coming home.

This morning I tried walking away, ignoring, trying to reason and then ended up snapping and arguing. I don't know what punishments I can put in place - he needs his computer for revising, he has previously laughed at me when I said I would take his phone away and said I would have to fight him for it. If he wants to leave the house, I can't physically stop him. I know this sounds like excuses but I am at a loss as to how I can actually carry through on anything.

How do I deal with this? This is supposed to be my safe place. I love DS to pieces and he is an amazing boy most of the time but I feel broke after this morning and like a failure. I can't stop bursting into tears and I am usual a strong person.

It sounds like his behaviour is becoming increasingly disrespectful towards you - like his brain is 'forgetting' you are his mother almost? Triggered by the marital break-up?
His attitude is definitely not on and someone needs to point this out to him. Nobody is asking him to be perfect or worship you - all that should be rightfully happening is for your son to show you the same level of respect, love and care you have shown him for the past 16 years. Can you think of any male role models who could have a quiet reminder with him?
As for how you cope with it - do not engage in any arguments with him. Calmly say your piece, then remain silent. Listen to him between the lines as he may be having issues which you don't know about but which he is projecting onto you?

While this behaviour is clearly unacceptable and you need to try to bring him round somehow, it's actually really not that uncommon in kids that age. They are reaching towards independence and think they know it all. Punishments are very difficult but I think you need to have a heart to heart when things are calmer about the fact that behaviour has consequences, at home, school and work. I'm sure he relies on you for all sorts. Point it out. It's a two way relationship.
I know it's difficult, especially when you are alone and 'blaming' yourself but don't get this out of proportion. Virtually all parents of teenagers have had to deal with similar.

We had a conversation not so long ago about how my role as a parent has changed and that my job now was to guide and advise him but I couldn't control him (he'd been caught vaping - I disapprove but struggle to control what he chooses to do outside the house). I thought we were moving forward in a mature way .

I then caught him vaping in my house and told him that I didn't want him vaping in my house. DS said that he understood my view and accepted it. Progress I thought - all done calmly. I then caught him vaping again and just said that I was disappointed and felt disrespected. DS then followed me round the house being verbally abusive.

It seems to flair every time he doesn't get his own way but every time feels more intense and threatening than the last. I think this is my perception possibly rather than the reality. This house was supposed to be my safe haven - a place for me to live without fear or emotional abuse and I feel trapped as I can't leave.

I know that this can be general teenage behaviour & I am his safe place but I feel more broken every time. I know he will come home from school today as if nothing happened which worries me as he should feel something about what happened. I don't want him growing up thinking that this is acceptable. If I raise it I will get accused of 'banging on about it again' and it will lead to another argument so I tend to avoid raising it for a quiet life. He learned this from his Dad.

Teenagers can be hard work at times.
you are very wise to avoid a scuffle trying to get his phone off him! That would end in tears.

Some of my tactics which worked ( but of course may not for your ds):

assuming you pay for his phone contract, how about saying ( and meaning) that you will suspend his phone contract for a week or month unless he hands over his phone?
deal is if he hands over his phone you only keep it for 1 hour/day etc depending on the issue.
also, where does he get his money from? Having lunch money should not be taken as a right - if he persistently disrespects you then he has to have a packed lunch ( for example ).
similarly for any other spending money, clothes etc.
WRT the vape, your house your rules but if he’s just doing it in his bedroom then you maybe just wouldn’t notice. You’ve got other battles.
good luck! It will pass!

It's really difficult when you have abuse in both your childhood and your relationship background. It screws with your ability to process conflict and it gives you an ultra-sensitive fight or flight trigger that really doesn't help when dealing with a volatile teenager. I would suggest, if you can afford it, some counselling to help bolster you personally while DS is at this difficult age. I have similar issues (CPTSD) and found some of DS1's teenage years incredibly triggering and upsetting.

In terms of his behaviour reminding you of his father, I think you're absolutely right NOT to share that comparison with him, as it would be unfair to load him with the identity of an abusive adult male when actually his behaviour is quite typical of a temperamental teenager. It's not acceptable, and you do need to challenge it, but it IS typical. It might be more helpful to frame it in terms of your ex's behaviour resembling that of an angry, immature teenage boy who hasn't learnt to control himself, rather than the other way round.

I had one incident with DS1 when he was a similar age, maybe 15. I can’t even remember what the issue was that caused it but he squared up to me.
I walked away, telling him to calm down and we would talk later.
Mine had not seen that behaviour from his father so I think you’re wiser seeing it as typical teen behaviour and deal with it like that. I went with the money approach, that if he could not show basic respect his phone contract would end- simple as that. There would be no treats like cinema and meals out.
We still had some shouting and kicking off occasionally but no repeat of the squaring up to me.
Hopefully a talk about respect when you’re both calm with help.
Later today I will have to deal with late arrival at school and missing homework with DS2. Not as serious but he is taking the proverbial.

I strongly disagree with this and similar posts and don't think it's common at all for a teenager to be so verbally aggressive that the parent is scared and in fear that the next stage will be physical violence. I have a 16yo DS and it's unthinkable to me that he or his friends would ever behave like this.

I would be making it absolutely clear that it's not acceptable and I'd be looking into adolescent mental health support for him for help with anger management and processing his experience over the last few years (particularly your ex's abusive behaviour). I'd would also be looking for support for yourself.

I find some of the comments on this thread pretty gas-lighty, to be honest. OP has said that she's in physical fear of her son and getting a lot of minimising responses about how "teenagers can be difficult".

I have to agree with @DarlingNik
I have not experienced this type of behavior with my teen and have never heard any of her friends male and female behaving in this way.
There needs to be lots of conversations around respect and how to treat other people. I'm pretty sure he doesn't talk to his teachers or peers in this way so he can control it.
It's possible he is dealing with the break up of his parents and is lashing out, it's fine for him to have these feelings (whatever they are) but it's not ok for him to take it out on you. I think you need to get to the bottom of why he is acting this way.

Only my personal opinion but at 16 these isn't much you can do about the vaping, and in the grand scheme of things it might be better to pick your battles. It wouldn't be a hill I'd die on, but I'm guessing you've just used that as one example and there is a pattern of behavior that isn't great and an underlying reason that needs to be dealt with by communication.

I'd be sitting down with him and talking to him about his behaviour.

That this is your safe space and when he's shouty and aggressive, it's not on. That there is a bare minimum level of respect that you will each show each other, no matter how much the other one has pissed you off, or what the problem is. And lay out what that level looks like. No swearing, respectful language etc. It's ok to disagree with your mum, it's how you do it that counts!

I'd be telling him that at his age, he should be learning to control his temper and whilst you appreciate that he's not quite there yet in terms of adulthood, that this is where the foundations of what kind of friend, partner and father are laid.

I'd also try and find some time together to do something fun. Me and my teenage son put aside on Friday afternoon a month for going out for pretentious coffee. He loves coffee, I like coffee and so we have capitalised on it. We have a list of places to try and both add to them. Then we go, enjoy some coffee,enjoy the drive to to the place (it's a great way to chat to teenagers) and just hang out together.

We both look forward to it.

I agree with @DarlingNik, but would go further.

OP, this is your home and it is 100% your entitlement to feel safe.

I would not for a second accept his behaviour.

He is threatening in his manner.

In your place I would encourage him to pack his bags and go.

I accept that this would be difficult, but he needs to know that his behaviour will not be tolerated, to such an extent, that you will ask him to leave.

I think when he returns from school you need to encourage him to follow through and go to his dad's.

Be calm.
Tell him it is not working out and that you are not prepared to accept his behaviour.

You will miss him, but it is for the best.

See what he says.
If nothing, get him packed.

He doesn't have to like you, but he needs to respect you and believe that you will not be bullied.

I have two sons, one of whom is difficult.

This is a deal breaker.
You do not owe a home to a teenager who makes you feel unsafe.

Let him see you take this very seriously.
If you don't, he is going to end up a thug like his father.

You can't change him, however you can stop him living with you.

Hard and all as this is, he needs to learn that his behaviour has consequences.

I can't remember exact details but a few yrs ago a mnetter posted a similar situation on here. She got a lot of advice and one was to call a community police officer to chat to her ds. She actually did this and it shocked her son into improving his behaviour.

You need to be aware that if he thinks he can get away with it with you then he'll do similar with a girl or boy friend. So he needs to be taught a hard, fast lesson before he spirals out of control. He's testing the boundaries and trying to be the alpha male at home. His dad might have filled his head with shit but either way, you need to act fast.

Just sending loads of sympathy OP. I experienced similar. Sometimes it’s not normal teenage behaviour at all, people always project their slightly difficult teen - when sometimes it’s much worse. They have mental health issues - perhaps some kinds of autism, shizoid, PDs, - anyway nothing to do with their caring upbringing. On the plus side you can get him out of your home soon. Sad but true, and the reality.

Sending you genuine sympathy, look after yourself OP.

Talking, community police, etc IME achieves very little when there is a deep-seated mental issue. It’s sad and incredibly difficult for the parents, especially when well-meaning advice is useless or fails to comprehend the issue.

You need to sit him down and be frank with him that you didn't get rid of one abusive man from your house only for him to be replaced by another. That he is 16 now and needs to think very hard about what kind of human being he wants to become.

'I love you son but if you continue to act like a knob then I won't keep you under my roof any longer'.

Can you give us an example of his verbal aggressive behaviour and then maybe we can help?
I have a nearly 16 year old DS, I have not experienced this, most of these issues can be dealt with by good communication and consequences.

Thank you for all of the advice. Sorry I didn't reply last night - it was an up and down kind of evening. DS had one of those sorry, not sorry attitudes that led to him asking again for what I had said no to and so the verbal aggression began. It's not so much what he said but the way he said it, coupled with some gas lighting and laughing at me. I somehow remained calm which wasn't easy.

We did have a good talk in the end last night and I think he understands. He said that he was upset that I felt threatened and that wasn't his intention. I reiterated that this is my safe place and I won't feel scared in it. We also talked about the fact that he has to accept that I have the right to have rules in my house and that the next threat to go to his Dad's will result in me packing his bags and dropping them off there (deliberately avoided saying I would drop him there to avoid opening a discussion along the lines of 'I'd like to see you try').

Better interactions this morning before school which seems positive. Only time will tell. I will re-read this thread a few times to absorb the good advice.

I’m not sure if it’s wise to call it your house. It’s your family home and surely you can frame it that all members of the household deserve to feel safe and be treated with respect? Although I feel for you that you suffered from abuse when younger and then an abusive marriage, your son has also grown up in an abusive household. Threatening to send him to the person who perpetuated the abuse so you can feel safe in your home is sending a clear message his safety is lesser than yours.

Thats not to say you should put up with feeling threatened, but you are the adult here and you made the choice to stay in an abusive relationship and raise your son in that atmosphere. He’s more vulnerable than you are because he’s younger and doesn’t have an adult brain yet. Sorry but you seem to be making him into someone you consider to be an abuser like your early years and your ex, when the reality is more that he is a teen pushing boundaries and acting out.

I don’t understand the people who are emphasising it’s YOUR safe space like it only applies to you. Where is HIS safe space? Where is his ability to feel triggered and angry without the threat of losing his home when he says silly things like he will go to his dads to wind you up?

OP,
Well done.

It is reasonable to say to your son "whilst I love you very much, I love myself more. I will not accept being treated badly in my home. If you can't control your behaviour, you will be leaving this house to go stay with your father. You won't have any choice in this, I will put you out of my home".

OP, his father is a thug.
He grew up around a thug.
Of course it will have affected him.

All you can do is show him that YOU will not accept this behaviour.

I wouldn't be protecting him from the knowledge that his father was violent.

He's 16 and he needs to know that his father's violence caused the end of the family and how wrong it was.

You don't want him growing up thinking squaring up to women is EVER acceptable.

I would illustrate the possible consequences if he continues to square up. Age 17 you can be prosecuted as an adult, which includes jail. That if he wants a fulfilling adult life, to travel, live somewhere decent, have choices basically, you need some humbleness and manners especially in the work place.

And that if he messed up it will be his fault and his fault alone.

@PriestessofPing, I absolutely agree with you in principle, but he is making the OP feel unsafe in the home she pays for, and the reality is that she and her other children have greater entitlement to a safe home than her son does to throw his weight around.

Behaviour has consequences and to explain this calmly to him is not unreasonable.

If he wishes to throw his weight around she is reasonable to want him out of the home.

She can definitely call child services and tell them she is putting him out of the home, she can also tell him this.

She has an obligation to her other children to keep further violence out of this home.

He needs to learn to manage his anger.
If he can't, she is not unreasonable to tell him to leave.

Too many families tolerate male child violence and hide it.
The damage to the other children is often life long.

The OP and her other children have been through enough.

Completely agree.

Completely agree with @billy1966 that was meant to say - posts keep getting cut off in the app.

Thanks for all of the advice. I had a good chat with DS yesterday (took the dog for a walk - neutral territory). I made it clear that I wouldn't tolerate the behaviour from the other night. DS admitted he had an anger issue and didn't really have an outlet. I offered to get him some counselling but he won't engage with that. He thinks it's exam stress and not being over his girlfriend.

We have agreed to join a local gym so that he has a physical outlet and we can talk getting there and back.

I did tell DS that he scared me the other day and he could see why I would feel like that even though it wasn't his attention. We have agreed that when the situation gets heated we both walk away to another room.

Positive steps but I know it won't be a smooth road ahead!

I agree with all this. You are providing him with a home, and if he can't behave in a reasonable manner towards you, he should be thinking about where to go.
It will be hard but he needs to grow up.