What to do about this with my mum in these circumstances? Really desperate for help

[Whattpdo1]

Don’t want to drip feed but in essence me and my mum have had a rocky but close relationship over the years. I’ve been told by multiple therapists and friends that I was severely emotionally abused/neglected as a child and I’ve always carried with it an underlying anger towards my parents for this. I won’t go into the detail but suffice to say that most therapists over the years have labelled it at the ‘extreme end’ of emotional neglect. I’ve battled with huge issues growing up and as an adult (now late 30s) and have managed to carve a good job and decent pay and have lots of friends, though romantic relationships have been hard for me.

That said above, whatever anyone says, it’s not as simple as ‘my parents were shit.’ They we’re often shit but there was also lots of times of love and crucially, I know that the majority of the time my parents did want the best for me, they just didn’t have the tools themselves to be great parents on the emotional side.

my relationship with them both (they are still married) was never great but we were a close family. My sister was the one that they were closer to but we were a family. I have, admittedly, a terrible temper with my mum to the point where I would scream and shout and swear at her often. I am not like this with anyone else, just her, and it completely relates to the background of our relationship. In fairness to her, in the last ten years she has been very different and as a person I can she she is good and decent and really did want a relationship with me and valued that. But deep down I don’t forgive some of the things she said that damaged, forever, how I saw myself.

Anyway, a few weeks ago I found out I was pregnant. I wanted to keep it quiet for a while so didn’t say. During that time we had a row, as we often do every few weeks, I told her to fuck off, and this time, she did. Usually we would speak again one way or another but basically this time it’s been silence.

I am NOT excusing what I said to her and in many ways I don’t blame her this time for actually fucking off like I put in the text. I haven’t written the background to this to excuse my behaviour but more because crucially, now, I genuinely believe she doesn’t care if I am dead or alive. And this has been my fear since I was a child, that they just didn’t care. So it’s like this has now come true, she doesn’t.

I want to speak to her mostly because I’m pregnant and need my mum. But I am angry she hasn’t been in touch and part of me wants to know how long she will actually leave this. Being honest, I also don’t know how to engage in any conversation with her that doesn’t make me on the back foot because ultimately I hate the things she did to me and I KNOW the only reason I get angry quickly with her and nobody else is because I have this pent up resentment always under the surface.

My mind is such a mess though because:

1. I’m an adult and shouldn’t tell her to fuck off no matter what
2. nothing that happens now as between me and her will change the past and she has actually apologised and acknowledged the failings to me before and she seemed genuine and was crying and said she could only say sorry over and over and that she knew better now
3. i am feeling increasingly sad that I we are not talking during my pregnancy. This is the longest we have ever not spoken.
4. in not speaking to her, automatically my dad will not communicate with me as they are a team and that’s that, they operate as a unit, so I am missing that relationship too (not that he was perfect either, but that’s another story!)
5. im basically just sad and low and having them in my life is hard but they are not really awful people. In fact a few weeks before this argument happened they had given me a significant amount of money. Not that that cancels out childhood emotional neglect but it shows there is care there and they do mean well these days.
6. if she rang me by mistake I would call back straight away but I feel there’s no way in now and my fear that she doesn’t care has come true. If I contact her how will I ever know if she would have contacted me?

Regardless of how your current situation pans out, you need to prepare yourself for how you might feel about your relationship with your mother once your baby has arrived.

I, finally, went no contact with my mother when DD was 17 months old, nearly 3 years ago. My only regret is not doing it sooner.

I would just lie there looking at my beautiful DD wondering how it was ever possible for my mother to do and say the things she did throughout my childhood and adult life. In the end I couldn't pretend any longer.

I also now understand why some, otherwise kind empathetic, relatives and family friends (and Mumsnetters) can be so nasty and lack understanding of my decision, because the idea of behaving the way my mother did to me as a her child is absurd even to me and I experienced it first hand, so someone who had a loving mother and was a loving mother to there own child surely can't comprehend it.

I am at a loss why so many are encouraging you to continue this relationship. It's toxic, always has been and always will be and you'll never heal and be happy if you keep returning to your abuser for yet more abuse. You can't stop telling her to fuck off as you still have so much (rightful) resentment toward her and her sorry doesn't cut it. So please consider this from another angle and cut her out once and for all. You say you can't, but that's because you've been conditioned to accept whatever scraps are thrown your way, you don't have healthy self esteem due to what she's done to you. You CAN and you'll be better off for it

Op I think that you and your mother have a toxic relationship. She will never be the person you want her to be. And she won't be a good grandmother either.

You can't change what has happened. You are allowed to be angry. But keeping on in this relationship just isn't working for you.

I wouldn't apportion any blame or explain. Perhaps you could call and say you are sorry for losing your temper, which you clearly are, and that you have some good news you thought she'd like to hear. You don't have to apologise for your anger per se, just that you let it overwhelm you in the moment. That's all it is really though that's not to deny everything you went through.

Tbh your relationship with your parents sounds just like mine. I cut off contact completely about 3 years ago and my self esteem has improved so much. I concentrate on spending time with people who love me and bring me up, not tear me down and cause me stress. I realised when I was pregnant with my first that there was absolutely no way I wanted my parents anywhere near my kid in case they treated them like they treated me (shouting/hitting/neglect etc). I don’t miss them.

I also do not understand the apparent clamour for the original poster to reach out to her abusive mother. You are not given any rights in a dysfunctional family system and some posters are very much minimising now.

Op was abused by her mother and in turn her father has and continues to enable his wife.

I would think long and hard before getting back in touch with your toxic mother because it’s a decision you could well come to regret making. If they are too difficult for you to deal with it’s the same deal for your child too. Keeping on in this relationship is not working here for you.

I agree with this and very much relate to it.

Great post by @MigsandTiggs

I'm not going comment on whether you should or shouldn't cut your mum out of your life. It isn't always the right the solution for everyone, but it is always very complicated. I speak as someone who's both gone nc with someone I love very much and also decided, in a relationship with someone of similar volatility, not to.

Your mum may never realise the extent of the damage her emotional neglect had on you, but to continue a relationship with her you need to find a way of separating out the past from the future, if this is what you choose to do. That doesn't mean you let everything go, forget it all happened etc, but it means you find healthier ways of dealing with the emotional turmoil when it surges up and than have blazing rows. And you need to both accept that there are times when it will and agree you will step back. You'll need to find a way of keeping a door open so that you can reach out to each other.

I know that many here will disagree with me, but in my own similar relationship, maintaining my strength and refusal to accept past behaviours does not mean refusing to apologise when I lash out.

Healing a relationship means you both take responsibility for your actions, it doesn't give one person a licence to treat the other how they like. This also helps to make communication safer for each of us, as whatever happened in the past we strive to treat each other with greater respect while supporting the healing process.

I completely get why you need to have your mum - and your dad - in your life, especially now. In your shoes, I would think about what you - and she - needs in order to achieve a resolution. For her, this might be an apology for swearing at her. For you, it might be an acknowledgement of xxxx or and reaching an agreement over what led to the row.

Try and work out exactly what it is emotionally that is holding you back, what it is that stung most painfully during the fall out and when you do speak to her, address the issue calmly and without lots of emotion.

(High emotions get in the way of us communicating as they provoke a defensive emotional response.)

Be prepared to hear her too. You might need to agree to let certain points lie for now in order to move forward.

And share your news and that you miss her. Sometimes that's all that is needed.

It is possible to have a relationship with a toxic background, as long as both parties are safe and as long both parties are prepared to do the work.

i would like to hear your daughters side of things because her version would be far different to the one you ascribe.

Ops mother abused her daughter in childhood and she has an enabler in the shape of her husband. The only acceptable level of abuse in any relationship is none.

My mother was cold to me and uncaring. She didn’t know how to be the loving, caring mum and used me as her scapegoat. As I grew, she didn’t allow me to become separate and projected her negative emotions about herself onto me.

I imagine, like me, you don’t need your mother, you are seeking the mother you never had.

I would not apologise to your mother. She could see it as a sign of weakness. I would do what my mother does, leave things a while longer then pick back up as though nothing happened and break your news. The refuse to discuss what happened / deny deny. Tell her you’re not going to argue with her and you don’t want her to spoil your news.

It is a good idea to get some more therapy now. I found having a dd hugely emotional and when she reach 5 months, I became incredibly angry, which lasted for a couple of months and I got some therapy to help with this. Now that my dd is a teen, I can understand my mother’s behaviour to me as a teen a little more. I see she was unsupported and very immature despite her age.

Abuse is not about communication or a perceived lack of, it’s about power and control. op has put herself through therapy, do you think her mother has or would be prepared to do the same?. Abusive people do not readily see a therapist.

op is not safe emotionally here with her mother and when exactly has her mother ever apologised to op or accepted any responsibility for her actions?.

Who is that addressed to attilla?

This.

I spent my life trying to please my mother. 66 years of trying to please her. I have very poor self-esteem as a result.
I too was conditioned to accept anything thrown my way, good or bad.
Now she’s dead I haven’t even grieved.
I wish I had cut her off years ago.
If I were you I would focus on having a healthy pregnancy and a beautiful baby, you’re worth so, so much more OP.
I would keep communication to as little as possible.

I think what you need to do is explain your behaviour so you mum is aware that the issue isn't all sorted out for you just because she was sorry and cried. Apologise for your part - swearing at her - but tell her you keep lashing out because you are still struggling with the things that happened to you as a child. I really think it would be helpful for you to get some counselling you help you navigate this relationship in the future and to deal with the past.

The silence is difficult - she is after all doing what you asked and if she didn't you could say she didn't respect your boundaries. I think it's a difficult one for her to win if you haven't been clear what the issue is exactly (maybe you were before you told her to f off but I'm not sure if that's the case or not). She could contact you and apologise but does she know what the issue is? She might believe you hate her and genuinely want nothing to do with her when it sounds to me that you constantly push her away because you want her to prove she cares - or to try to hurt her in the way she hurt you.

Being able to cut someone out your life like that is a typical narc trait - but also she might feel she doesn't know what else to do and that it's what you really want. It's hard to know which is the case although you seem to believe she is doing it to make a point and you know her best. I would also tell her that - that you feel her silence is to make a point and you are bereft that she has cut you off because all you really want is to feel loved. There's no point asking her why IMO, you are not going to get what you want from her I fear because she just may not have that emotional capability. Better to tell her how you feel and how her actions make you feel and what you want. You can't change her and to have a relationship you may have to accept some things that you wouldn't in an ideal world but put in boundaries to keep you and your child safe.

I have, admittedly, a terrible temper with my mum to the point where I would scream and shout and swear at her often. I am not like this with anyone else, just her, and it completely relates to the background of our relationship

There is no excuse for you, an adult who’s nearly 40 to be screaming abuse at anyone. I would cut someone off if they subjected me to this level of emotional abuse.

It sounds as though it’s best you don’t see each other anymore. She’s emotionally abused you, you are emotionally abusing her and it sounds a toxic situation for a baby to be around.

They sound a bit like my parents. I did always feel cared for but my mum is very socially inept and it took me a very long time to realise because you just assume your mum is normal. I’ve realised recently that she has borderline personality disorder and my dad always took her side because she’d go mad at him if he didn’t.

I was furious and resentful with her for a very long time and I suppose even now I still try to seek her approval and try to get her to be the mum that I need. She never will be. Anyway, she moved away in the end to be near to my older sister and admitted later that she’d done it because of me (even though she tended to cause the arguments or escalate minor disagreements).

I think it was good that she moved away because it gave my some time to realise how much chaos she’d been causing. Your mum might be doing a similar thing and you’re not even noticing, or you are noticing but you’re not quite sure how she’s managing to wind you up. My mum and I are close again now and my dad died last year so she has no one to back her up anymore. Your mum has apologised….I don’t think my mum has because she never takes responsibility for anything. My other sister has things far worse…she was scapegoated 50 years ago and has no relationship at all with my mum.

I think your mum still cares about you….just give her a ring. Quite often I’ve done this and we just act like nothing’s happened…we have to because neither of us will apologise. You need to work on yourself and build your confidence so that you don’t need your mum’s approval.

It sounds like you don't feel as if she loves you. Every argument is bigger than the issue because you are bringing so much emotional baggage to it. This is to be expected. Plus as others have said, being pregnant will bring a lot of the hurt bubbling back up to the surface as you face motherhood and think of how you will treat your child but realise the child you were wasn't treated with love.
Has your mother genuinely changed? You may just have to accept that you won't have the relationship with her that you want. You say that you're all close but it doesn't sound close, maybe more co-dependent. Are you still having therapy? I'd book some sessions if possible as it sounds like you need support.

See. While yes she was crap while you were growing up. I think that you don't get to punish her repeatedly for the rest of your life. It's a shit or get off the pot thing OP. If someone shouted and screamed at me with a terrible temper, I wouldn't just take it on the chin forever.

I ditched my mother and feel better for it. I've no desire to lose my temper with her. Life's too short for that. Just take some time to wrap your head around having a baby and focus on yourself for a bit.

In your opinion.

Going NC is so difficult. The OP says she doesn’t want that, not yet anyway.

I would be/am wary of this too.

I used to say "I'm sorry we fell out" to my mum. Similar neglectful home life. No childhood. Out on my own at 16, because she'd "had enough". Lived in various unsavoury places & didn't make anything of my life, unlike you. Regardless of her behaviour & neglect, mum was still my everything & I offered out the olive branch because the relationship with her meant more than some petty spat. I'm still heartbroken to have lost her in my 30s. Life is too short for all this. Go & see your mum. Its as easy as you make it.

You are just going to keep repeating the same cycle with her until you can let go of the anger and resentment you gave bottled up.

you say she’s apologised and accepted things weren’t right. You make out like she’s tried to make amends for who she was back then.

she’s trying to have a better relationship with you. And it sounds like you are looking for evidence all the time that she doesn’t love you etc and so you lash out verbally in defence causing the very situation you feared.

id send her a text and tell her you regret swearing etc. But honestly unless you get helP to move on emotionally the anger you hold - I pity this child that will come into the family and be around this drama.

get help. Or find a way to move on as a family or individually. But you can’t keep this going.

Exactly right